I guess we all remember how we got to school. Personally, I walked most of the time. Other kids went on a school bus and in Italy the kids may well have gone on the scuolabus.
I recently saw this scuolabus on a trailer in my village, on my way to work. Never mind, we’re going to stop for this – a Fiat 238 minibus on a trailer with a Peugeot 407SW tow car, neither of which were regulars in the village.
The Fiat 238 was powered by an 1197cc, 44bhp petrol engine and built on the underpinnings of the Autobianchi Primula, which meant it has as transverse front engine and that the gearbox was on the end of the engine, not underneath as it was on BMC’s Mini and ADO16 for example. The engine was also shared with the Fiat 124 saloon. Overall length is about 15 feet and the payload was a ton. In context, this is the Italian equivalent to the VW Type 2, but without the compromises required from the rear engine. It does have a longer front overhang though. Visually, it looks like an oversize version of the Fiat 850 T van, which was rear engined.
Within Italy, this was the panel van of choice for many years, and although it was sold outside Italy, it is (and always was) a rare sight outside Italy, as the European market was more diverse in the 1960s and 1970s than it is now. The usual range of configurations, from van to camper to pick up to bus, was available.
As I took the shots from across the road, a lady came out from the house, clearly interested in what I was doing. Like many Curbivores, I’ve learnt that some people are more easy going than others about this sort of thing, outside the car show environment, and this lady was clearly in the easy going, almost the excited, group.
It seems that the van had just been trailered to the UK from Italy, through Germany, behind the Peugeot, and had arrived late the previous evening. The plan (her brother’s plan actually) was to convert it to a mobile coffee bar.
I didn’t have time to have a full chat about it, so I do not where in Italy it had been used, but I was told that it was a genuine, time served with distinction school bus, and should have had the “Scuolabus” sign on the roof. Sadly, this was taken during an overnight stop in Germany.
But a good start to the day. That’s what being a Curbivore can do to you.
Nice find, Roger! If you were wearing shorts and a tie like a proper English schoolboy, she may have even let you sit in one of the seats so you could see what you were missing out on as a wee lad…:-)
This one’ll reignite the towing discussion over here too. I now fully understand the difference in tow setups comparing the EU and the US and how it makes a difference, but can’t stop wondering if maybe you guys have a better handle on it over there. There is really no reason to allow people to travel as fast as they do with a trailer over here especially considering that there is virtually no (if any at all) training required to do so.
Sorry, but I left my school cap at home,,,,,in 1973.
Trailer regs vary all over the world and within Europe. In the UK, the weight limit is set by the weight of the car and the level of braking on the trailer. No training is required and the only people really interested, assuming the lights work, will be your insurer. Ultimate sped is limited also. – I would say apparently based on what we see sometimes.
Agreed, one really shouldn’t drive faster than 90 to 100 km/h with a car + fully loaded trailer. No matter the tongue weight, the position of the trailer’s axles, or the weather- and road conditions. Training or no training.
Most Peugeot 407s, the Peugeot model in Roger’s article, are rated around 1,500 kg towing capacity. More for the most powerful diesel with a manual, in that case it’s 1,900 kg (4,190 lbs).
I find the tow car interesting. I know next too nothing about Peugeots, always thinking it was some weird French car, but I may have to reevaluate my thinking. This looks pretty nice.
The 407 is the “old” model, the current Peugeot model in that segment is the 508. Which looks much better, IMO, than the 407.
See, now that looks like a proper wagon. Maybe what I’m seeing is exaggerated by the angle of the camera, but the 407 looks almost like a mini-MPV.
It’s the camera angle Chris, the old 407s weren’t as tall as that shot makes it look. This is a more representative angle.
I was a bit disappointed when the new 508 came along, it’s a far more staid design, kind of “me too” German (or “Ich auch” if you like) a lot of recent Peugeot-Citroen output is guilty of the same lack of styling courage, though some recent stuff like the Cactus suggests PSA might be getting their nerve back
Yep, looks to have normal wagon proportions. And I agree that it’s more distinctive–change the badging and that 508 could easily be a Volvo. A few styling tweaks and it could be a BMW or an Auid.
Actually, Peugeot’s MPVs are called 2008, 3008 and 5008 (that’s from small to big). The biggest:
Those Pugs can be had with the twin turbo 2.7 diesel Jaguar uses awesome cars, The van looks cool Ive seen a very rusty example before and it looks like going by the sill panels that one has gone the same way, lots of work for someone with a welder.
This car has a 2.2 litre diesel – still a good puller though
I had a 2.1 406 wagon plenty of grunt.
That shade of yellow is about the same as for Bundespost vehicles, so should I assume Germans don’t use this for their school buses?
Once I saw a parking lot full of Bundespost Golfs & Vanagons. Come to think of it, postal vehicles would make an interesting article.
I haven’t seen one of those in a long long time.
Never had the privilege (or misfortune?) of riding to school on a bus. Not sure if I’d want to try with this one, looks small.
The nice big ones here in America don’t even have safety belts, hard to believe in our risk-averse culture where such things as diet is a crusade for sanctimonious Guardians of Schoolchildren.
We have the same here, north of 49. You’d think with the paranoia for safety they’d have changed something by now.
A big part of the push for making rear bumper camera “setups” standard/Federally required is that about 2-3 dozen people per year are backed over. But seat belts on school buses, can’t seem to do that.
To bus manufacturer and the Federal government’s credit, there’s A LOT more padding on the backs of bus seats now than there was when I was a kid.
I wonder if it has to do with quick ingress/egress in the event of an accident?
You don’t hear about many deaths in school bus accidents–at least not the bus passengers. Some of it may have to do with the fact that they don’t travel that fast, even on highways–I think most are governed to 45 MPH. Also there is the padding on the seat backs, which is what they would most likely encounter first…
New York has some of the strictest school bus laws in the country and every passenger has a lap belt available.
NY strict, I doubt not. What I do doubt is whether kids actually wear them, at least while any peers are watching.
In the UK, what you can tow depends on when you passed your test.
The following is from the DVLA website.
The rules on what you can tow are different depending on when you passed your driving test.
You can view your driving licence information online to see if you’re allowed to tow.
Licences issued from 19 January 2013
From 19 January 2013, drivers passing a category B (car and small vehicle) test can tow:
small trailers weighing no more than 750kg
a trailer over 750kg as long as the combined weight of the trailer and towing vehicle is no more than 3,500kg Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM)
If you want to tow a trailer weighing more than 750kg, when the combined weight of the towing vehicle and trailer is more than 3,500kg, you’ll have to pass a further test and get B+E entitlement on your licence.
You’ll then be able to tow trailers up to 3,500kg.
Licences held from 1 January 1997
If you passed your driving test after 1 January 1997 and have an ordinary category B (car) licence, you can:
drive a vehicle up to 3.5 tonnes or 3,500kg MAM towing a trailer of up to 750kg MAM
tow a trailer over 750kg MAM as long as the combined weight of the trailer and towing vehicle is no more than 3,500kg
For anything heavier you need to take a category B+E driving test.
Licences held before 1 January 1997
If you passed your car test before 1 January 1997 you are generally entitled to drive a vehicle and trailer combination up to 8.25 tonnes MAM.
This is the weight of a vehicle or trailer including the maximum load that can be carried safely when it’s being used on the road.
You also have entitlement to drive a minibus with a trailer over 750kg MAM.
Those drivers licenses were standardised throughout the European Economic Area: hence not just UK, but also Latvia, Finland, Andorra, Spain and Bulgaria (and many more).
Dad got one and got rid of the Volkswagen panel van.
For me the 238 was heaven compaired to the VW Bus, which was hell!
This, this had a low low low loadflore, it had FWD, it had heating, in wintertime it had heating, not a red knob that was apparantly for show in the VW bus.
This shifted gear, you’d not need to stir the oil instead of shifiting gears and it was a blast to drive with heavy side winds.
The thing that struck me is that the Dutch stayed loyal for reasons totally unknown to me with to their VW vans, the FIAT 238 was fast, nimble MODERN and used less fuel.
Ok it was noisier but it had a real heater !
And loading heavy washing machines and fridges was a laugh with the 238 !
This is actually the only classic van I’d even consider, maybe, maybe the also excellent driving Peugeot J7 which also had FWD, low load floor and is very roomy as a van, very roomy!
A better driver then its eternal French rival The Citroen H models !
Don’t recall seeing one of these vans before, and I’ve been to Italy twice.
At first glance this looked like a fairly large van, then I noticed that it was on a trailer….being pulled by a car that looked even longer, bigger (?).
And a 1200cc engine? Well, I guess I shouldn’t be all that surprised, since my own childhood school bus was powered by a 6 cylinder engine.
I was going to say it looks like a smaller version of the Commer 1500 van, but it seems to be the same size (length at least). I wonder how they compare, just going on the different driveline and suspension layouts I bet they are quite different.
The old school “bus” is smaller than the modern compact wagon!
Nice van. I always liked the European approach to vans, and these have a style that you wouldn’t see in an American van to go with their practicality. As for school buses, ours was a late ’70’s International.
When I was 11,I remember seeing these all over Italy when we spent summer of 69 there. We had a 67 VW van, and I was always comparing it to the Fiat. I remember thinking , when I grow up I might get one of those , just to be different. So these are front engine, front wheel drive, like the Dodge Promasters, which are also Fiats.
Didn’t know there was a school bus series. That cursive script is perfect. Great find Roger.
HMMM ITS FAIRLY MINT AND ORIGINAL SHAME THEY WILL RUIN IT BY TURNING IT INTO A COFFEE BAR
+1
A nice find ! .
Too bad the sign got stolen .
I remember riding to school in a first generation 196? Ford Falcon (Econoline) van , very crude and no seat belts , it rattled and wheezed us to school sans complaints .
-Nate
One rare find, 238s were seriously rust-prone and they all got scrapped, same with the later 242s.
We had a white one such as this one in my family, less the Scuolabus sign, that was used for transporting bulky stuff and sometimes for weekend outings. It was underengined and therefore quite thirsty, so after the fuel crisis in ’74, it received a natural gas plant, becoming an unbereably slow drive.
There were loads of these in Israel when I was growing up but they were never thought of as reliable as the VWs and the survival rate is low (of course, the VW has a huge following and hence parts avialbility where as the Fiat is way left of center). We also had the 850 van and that was even shorter lived and replaced by Subaru and Suzuki minivans as soon as those became available in the 70s…
Here’s one rusting away in Israel (pic by Uzi Tal)
… and from the back (pic by Uzi Tal)
First time I’ve registered the term “Curbivore”, Roger. Brilliant. I will now and forever consider myself a Curbivore.
I spent quite a bit of time trying to figure our how I could afford to buy that very vehicle; it’d go perfectly with my 78 Weinsberg. Would love to know where I can see it in the UK. Currently lusting after this…
http://www.cc-cars.dk/UK/car.aspx?number=846301525