(Pictures are from my various ads)
I could blame the Caravan, but really it’s my own stubborn fault.
As you may know, my daily driver for the past 14 years has been our 2001 Ford Focus. The COAL article is here:
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/cars-of-a-lifetime/coal-2001-ford-focus-a-daily-dose-of-joy/
As mentioned in the article, it’s been the best car I’ve ever owned: Fun to drive, reliable, inexpensive to insure and operate.
Like many families, the D family has two daily drivers and generally I drive the “old” car while Mrs DougD drives the “new” car. Our problem in 2017 was that the “old” vehicle was now 16 years old with 275,000km, and our “new” vehicle was a 2007 Dodge Caravan with 265,000km.
So there wasn’t much new to be had in the D stable. Both of us have “serious professional” type jobs, and need to get to the airport in Toronto regularly, and occasionally drive clients around. I started getting the “How old is this car anyway?” questions about 5 years ago, but people have always expressed surprise at the year of my car, and that it’s good condition belies it’s advanced age. Nevertheless, something had to be done.
Since the Caravan was also doing well and would be more expensive to replace we decided to get a replacement Focus. After casually searching for about 6 months we found a 2013 hatchback with a 5-Speed, in the colour we wanted with very low miles at a good price. Sold!
Bifocals
Now we had to dispose of the old Focus. If you are American you may be surprised that we don’t want to keep the car for our 17 year old son to drive. The answer is insurance, it is rather expensive to insure a car for a young person in Canada (like $300 per month expensive) so that was not an option.
The options I did have were:
- Sell it as-is
- Get it safety checked and sell it certified
- Donate it and get the $200 tax reciept
- Scrap it and get the $200
If you know me or have read my CC articles, you will know that I am cursed with excessive empathy for machinery, and I just couldn’t bring myself to scrap my faithful servant (or donate it, which would have the same end result). So I decided to try to sell it as-is, and put up my Kijiji ad and waited…
Week 1: $1700 – crickets
Week 2: $1200 – crickets
Week 3: $900 – I did get one response which said simply “600“. I decided that to buy my car you at least had to be able to put a sentence together and didn’t respond. I also got one very interested guy who repeatedly asked what it needed to pass safety check (the answer being I don’t know, maybe nothing) but once I found he lived about 4 hours away I figured this wasn’t going anywhere either.
While this was going on I was also trying to find someone with a need to GIVE the car to, but it turns out I hang with a rather middle class crowd and nobody has needed a free car for about 10 years.
My father in law (the Ford sales associate) told me that there was a chronic shortage of cheap certified cars because of the provincial government’s recent overhaul of the MOT test expanding the scope and making it harder to pass. So I decided to switch plans, and took it to see John, our local old-school mechanic.
The $115 safety check told me that it needed rear springs (one was broken) and the headlights were too cloudy. I had the kit to do the headlights at home, and the springs would be about $400, so I gave him the OK to order the parts.
Coming to pick the car up the next afternoon I found that both rear springs had actually been broken, and because certain critical fasteners were seized he’d spent most of the day struggling to get the new units in with spring compressors. This made the final bill substantially higher than the estimate. I gritted my teeth as I paid the bill, and took the Focus home to do the headlights.
My problems continued at home, because when I opened the box I found that the last time I used the kit I had neglected to put the drill backing plate back into the box. So I wound up doing the headlights by hand, which takes a surprising amount of elbow grease and is not recommended.
One down, one to go. You can see the light on the right has more beam scatter.
Back at John’s the next morning he inspected the headlights and approved my (literal) handiwork. Armed with my newly minted safety standards certificate I stopped by another garage on my way to work to get the Ontario DriveClean test. This program was implemented in 1999 as a full bore simulated drive and exhaust sniffer test, but since 2013 has been just an OBD2 “Happy ECU Computer” check. Since the Focus had always passed and the check engine light was not on, I was correct to assume that it would pass, and surprisingly because I was not renewing my license tag this test was free.
My FIL had advised me to put $2900 on my revised ad, which I thought excessive so I decided to try for $2700 OBO. I didn’t quite get crickets, I got one reply which said “WTF, are you high?” which was amusing but not very helpful.
So I just edited the ad now to read $2200, there don’t seem to be any certified cars locally under $2000 so hopefully it’s getting into the range of being interesting for someone. The 5-speed is probably a major downer, who can drive a stick these days? Or wants to? All I wanted was a chance for this car to have a third act other than being crushed, and supply a decent cheap car to someone who needs one. From a financial and time management standpoint I just should have just scrapped it, but I’m still driving it every day because I find it more fun than the new Focus 🙂
The safety certificate is good for 30 days, I can still listen to the crickets for a few more weeks…
OMG, the Zetec engine AND a manual transmission, in my experience a very rare combination. If this were in the U. S. I’d sure be interested. Though I have to admit all those miles would temper my enthusiasm so maybe it’s just as well that I am in Florida.
Is it me, or do Focuses take a substantial depreciation hit when the pass the 3-4 year mark? Here in North Florida, that manual transmission would be a HUGE handicap, and even nice (automatic transmission) examples sell for under $2,000, quite a bit under.
Yep, this would be snapped up quickly here in the Middle West!
This is very true, Ed. My girlfriend recently sold her manual Focus identical to this in Iowa here and we had folks beating down the door to buy.
Actually it got very awkward as the first two to test drive it came concurrently and both wanted to buy… A Craigslist first for me!
Had the same combination in the ’96 Contour that I owned for a short time. Wonderful car (was my sister-in-law’s), sold it for a grand when I downsized the fleet, probably should have kept it a while longer.
dang near bulletproof!
I had a Contour with the Zetec and the dim-witted automatic, it was a willing engine, but saddled with a dance partner with 2 left feet and a chronic lack of skills.
Mine is a 2004 which looks the same right down to the wheels and spoiler except in tundra mist (a green) and with the 2.3L Zetec and 5 speed. It is a great car and outside the infamous passenger side motor mount it is bullet proof. Last time at the Ford dealer to look at the Fusion, not for me, the sales people wanted to buy my car from me. Apparently the big 2.3 with 5 speed is quite rare.
Omg, how expensive are cars in Canada! That focus would be worth at best £500 here, springs cost £20 each (I work in a parts store!) and an MOT test is £35. I feel for you having to pay out that much for an old car!
Canada would be heaven for me. Take a look at this current ad in Uruguay:
https://auto.mercadolibre.com.uy/MLU-449095582-ford-focus-ghia-20-_JM
Rafael: a twin and same color and wheels as my Mother’s. Hers and my little brother’s after she passed for 25 years.
Traded for a 17 Renegade and I am certain it never went for $7500, even with 60,000 miles on the clock
Here in the Very Deep South, cars are outrageously expensive, when new, or when old. Even though many middle class families may have two cars, typical size is much smaller. A Focus is a luxury car. A Fusion goes for 47 K in a country where a salary of 36 K a year before taxes is what a degreed, mid range, mid 40’s guy might get.
Rafael, that’s insane !!! Sorry to hear it.
That should have been 14 years.
We keep them a long time in my family.
Do the people there do the same ? I imagine it’s financially smart to do so.
DweezilAZ, that’s insane as you say. More than half of the car’s cost is taxes. People tend to keep cars until they have around 100K km on them. Of course, that’s not fixed. Other people trade them in every three years so as to “keep their investment”, which in my opinion is not true. Many people have smaller cars than they would like (I’m one of them) just because of cost (parking also is at a premium in the larger cities). Also, automatics are mostly available at the top ranges, but there’s no automatic option on most simple models. Personally, I tend to keep my cars several years. The longest I held on to a car was a 92 Fiat I sold in 2008.
I’ve been looking casually for a beater car (no offense DougD) to supplement our current fleet of one as winter approaches; suddenly cycling and walking for errands in the rain doesn’t seem quite so much fun as it was in summer. A CraigsList search filtering for manual transmissions yields very little in the way of Focuses, Corollas, even Civics here. Not sure if that’s due to people hanging on to them, or decades of low demand and sales, hence limited supply.
I’ve always liked the look of the original Focus dashboard. I have the updated, less swoopy dashboard in my ’06 and it’s just not as interesting.
My ’06 soldiers on. It remains the most fun-to-drive cheap car I’ve ever owned, but it’s certainly not been the most reliable.
I agree; the original Focus was something that looked more like a concept that slipped into production. When the original was replaced for the 2005MY (in the UK & Europe) Autocar had a picture of the original and new versions nose to nose – and the new one looked older (and very staid).
Try something like this…
This. Is. Brilliant.
I love it. Excellent work.
Here is another one
I am impressed! Fantastic.
I know what you mean about having excessive empathy for machinery.
I go through periodic bouts of the same condition with our 1995 Thunderbird. About 5-6 years ago, I concluded that despite our affections for the T-bird, it made no sense to keep it around, and it had to go.
But I couldn’t bring myself to sell our pampered 20-year-old car to whatever kind of person would be in the market for a $1,000 car; it seemed like a cruel way to end its life. So we looked around for someone to give it to. My brother-in-law seemed like an obvious choice, but he already had 3 cars. Then a friend of ours in Indiana mentioned that he could use a winter beater car, and the T-bird would work. But I just couldn’t do it…
So I had the T-bird’s minor rust repaired, had the front suspension fixed — and we still have it. It makes no sense, I know. We have lots of other expenses that compete for our resources, but we just can’t part with the car that my wife bought new 23 years ago. Every so often, when a significant repair comes up, I think of how we ought to get rid of it — but then I think “OK, I’ll get this fixed and it’ll be fine.” Again and again.
On a side note, I do like that generation of Focus, both from looks and drivability. Good luck!
Eric, my trio are family. My entertainment, time machine, nudie bar, booze, dining and vice fixes.
Worth every cent to me to have them around.
Killed me to put an $8000 HVAC system into my shack, but never thought twice about dropping $2100 on the Olds Calais.
That’s a good analogy — and one that I can relate to. I’ll keep that in mind when I have my next 4-digit T-bird repair.
LOL. It’s a sickness.
Doug, I can truly identify with your situation. Having futilely attempted to sell a certain Ford van, we made the decision to just keep the stupid thing. I’m eligible to retire in about seven years (eligibility and actuality are two different critters) and it’ll work well for throwing a mattress in the back and traveling North America. However, I know keeping the Focus isn’t in the cards for you due to insurance costs alone.
Here’s a thought on the Focus (based upon what I can do here)…..drop the license and insurance right after putting it in storage. Store it for about eight years, until it’s 25 years old. Then get it back out and refresh it, giving you an updated version of sorts of your VW. The upshot is you’ll have the only quarter-century old Focus around and it’ll be quite the novelty piece. Then you sell it.
I admire a man who doesn’t lose his Focus.
I have been there many times with a car I am ready to be done with and has some good miles left. The combination of old and nice is a very small piece of the market and the stick shift makes it smaller.
If for some odd reason Jason’s very realistic proposal is not in the cards for you I suggest E-bay to get more views or you announce on Kijiji that you will keep dropping the price by 50 Canadian each day until it goes (or hit 300). It’s called cutting losses and like a constipation it only feels good when it’s over.
…like a constipation it only feels good when it’s over.
That is priceless. And so true. I may plagiarize that line from you at some point.
Anytime!
BTW: How is Broderick doing?
He’s been uninspired. Part of the blame stems from hanging and mudding too much drywall and the dust has clogged his creative synapses. Or that’s what he’s claiming, anyway.
Oh, that’s better than I feared. I thought his bones are bleaching in the desert.
I am dubious about using Kijiji myself. I have advertised on there (non automotive mind you) and gotten fake buyers responding. You know, the ones who say “I am interested”, but never show up at the appointed time. The GTA is a big area, (I am in Miss.) I understand that, but FFS why waste people’s time. Good luck moving your vehicle.
I do not know your financial situation but my impulse is to donate to a worthy person or charity.
Yeah, that’s what we did with our previous Topaz:
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/cars-of-a-lifetime/coal-1989-mercury-topaz-i-cant-go-im-too-nervous/
And this time around I’ve mentioned it to various people, pastors & such. I think a major difference from 15 years ago is the insurance factor. In the GTA a lot of people who could use a free car simply can’t afford the insurance. Conversely if you can afford two or three hundred dollars a month for insurance you can do better than a $2000 car…
Most charities just auction off the vehicles and take what they can get for them, at least in the states. The fate of a car like this in an auction may not be good – sadly for a lot of older, perfectly good, but not particularly valuable cars the high bidder ends up being a scrap yard.
Doug ;
Good on you for trying .
I’m amazed that a nice car like this isn’t snapped up at the price what with the safety check and all .
Stick shift a plus ! .
I don’t need any more vehicles else I’d buy it and drive it back to Cali just for a vacation…..
-Nate
You might try Facebook Marketplace or even Varagesale although the latter doesn’t seem very good – I’ve put things on the site with no movement at all.
I’ve used Kijiji in the past with mixed results.
There are people who reply to an ad with “Call Me – phone number listed.” I called once and it was as if the guy didn’t remember what he wrote (he replied to my ad at 1:00 am – drunk shopping?). At first he denied sending the message and then said he would think about it.
I recently tried to sell some watches on Kijiji which tends to bring out the worst possible buyers imaginable even before you recognize trouble. I got a response from someone who seemed very interested and wanted to meet the next day in a public place. He gave me a phone number and told me to txt him the next day to confirm that we were still meeting. I replied that as a personal policy, I don’t communicate via phone right away as Kijiji keeps a record of all back-and-forth communication. I do however google the number to see if by chance there is a history with it. Sure enough, the guy had given me the number to one of the “talent” at an online escort agency. Can you imagine if I had txted the number the next day with a “Are we still going to meet?” confirmation message?
Hi Doug. I was in a very similar situation earlier this year.
My mother bought an 08 Focus coupe for a comuter car.
She realized the 5 speed was a mistake for her because of traffic.
We put it up for sale for $3500. And 4 months later no real interest even with the price lowered to $3200.
I put my 07Focus up for sale instead and got the $3700 asking price and kept her car instead. No one wanted a stick around here. But the sedan with an automatic went quick.
I enjoy the car. I really hope you find a buyer. But I wouldn’t take any less than the cost of the repairs and $650.
The local mechanic down the road had a Pontiac Sunfire coupe for sale for a very long time. It looked good, price was good and passed state inspection. Still it didn’t sell. It was a 5 speed manual and most people today would rather not shift. Finally someone did buy it.
Around here stick J-body coupes are snapped up fast as dirt track cars.
I still enjoy my 2005 Focus & I’m intending to keep it as long as possible since there’s nothing around these days that I want. It only has 60,500 + miles on it.
Speaking of insurance, I just removed the collision portion from my policy since my insurance agent informed me that my car is now only worth $3,200.00 @ most. Is this possible in Canada?
Also, how is the new Focus compared to the old one?
For obvious reasons, my car insurance agent thought I was crazy for NOT carrying collision, theft, and comprehensive (with a massive deductible, no less) on the car I bought from a charity for about $3,300. I can’t imagine what my premiums would be, but with liability it costs nearly $1,500/year.
I’ve noticed Ontario used car buyers, in this low price range are mostly concerned about mileage. Cheap low mileage cars go quickly, seemingly regardless of the model.
In Ontario, the barriers to putting an older car on the road are considerable. A tough mechanical fitness test, emissions test, 13% sales tax on all used cars, the need for an appraisal on older cars before transfer, manditory government paperwork costs and expensive insurance all mean buying a used car is a hassle and investment. Often the cost of the actual car is relatively minor portion.
For example, I bought a $500 beater car that was mostly sound. But the costs to put it on the road ballooned to $4000 even before insurance.
Faced with cost structures like this, I, like most buyers look for low mileage, pristine cars. Even then, most buyers shamelessly low ball sellers. Unfortunately. Doug’s car’s mileage is too high to be appealing unless the price was very low. I considered low balling Doug on his car, but I felt embarrassed to be that annoying cheap time-wasting troll. And no, that $600 offer was NOT me 😉
FWIW, I find selling cheap cars to be so annoying, I don’t bother. When they’re done, I keep them for parts for a while, then send them to the scrap yard.
Slap a paint tray on the hood and send a pic to Dave Saunders. He can use it for next year’s race and your car will save him a lot of prep time. Good luck with the sale, I’m trying to thin my herd as well.
I’m thinking that Ed Snitkoff may be the guy . . . . Maybe upstate New York is the place for a car like this, given the economics of car ownership in Ontario.
I’m not so sure about that JP. There are plenty of cars to choose from in my area, and one with that mileage would probably warrant an asking price between $500-800, but thats with an automatic.
My value gauge seems to be askew on both ends of the market. To me anything that looks good, runs right, drives right and has working heat and a/c is worth at least $2k. Other than the occasional accidental lucky discovery, I continue to maintain that there is no such thing as a sub-$1000 car because it will be guaranteed to need tires, brakes or a repair due to some long-neglected maintenance. At the same time I have trouble seeing anything over 12 years old and over 150K miles as worth more than $5k, I don’t care how nice it is. Perhaps the List of Craig knows more than I do because listings that do not fit my criteria seem to make up about 95% of what’s found there.
I continue to maintain that there is no such thing as a sub-$1000 car because it will be guaranteed to need tires, brakes or a repair due to some long-neglected maintenance. At the same time I have trouble seeing anything over 12 years old and over 150K miles as worth more than $5k, I don’t care how nice it is.
I have a theory that the Seasonal Affective Disorder promoting weather here in the upper midwest produces a dour outlook in it’s residents. I certainly have a problem being optimistic about anything when I haven’t seen the sun in months and constantly have to battle snow.
‘course, I’m really tight with a buck too, so agree with your assessment of used cars.
I’d probably pay a little extra for the DougD factor. He’s Canadian, so he’s nice by default, but DougD is pretty much at the 99th percentile of the Canadian Niceness Index so I doubt the car would need anything.
Also, I think his pricing is in Canadians, so that’s kind of like the Peso for us down here. This car is probably cheap for what it is…
If you were near n.e. Ohio I’d be on it like white on rice! A stick Zetec??? Hell yea!
Doug;
Been there done that with other cars. Bought an 07 Focus SES hatch last March as I had sold my Cordoba, 02 Mazda and not long after my 03 Mustang Coupe. I paid $2,500 which seemed to be the going rate around Edmonton for a Focus.
Its a 5-spd and fun to drive around the city. I’ve driven it on the highway a few times and its great for long distance travel. It needed a little love even with only 125,000kms but by the end of summer my sow’s ear became a silk purse. The car will stay with me for a few years. I don’t mind putting a few dollars into a good used car if I know its going to be with me for a while or I know its real worth.
I had to chuckle at the responses you received to your ad. Perhaps we’ve all experienced that. A one or two word text response to an ad doesn’t sit well for me. Usually low-ballers. Attached is a before pic. Got rid of the window tint except for both rear quarter windows. The tint made the interior too dark and dreary.
My current ride is a 2007 Focus wagon with auto. I love it. Sorry but I think you wasted your money on this one – a 16 yr old sedan with 275k clicks and manual-shift = no sale.
I’m flinty enough that I can recognize when a car fails a cost/benefit analysis. When my Civic, which I had bought new, was 15 years old, due for a timing belt, and needing new shocks, I had no trouble putting it on Autotrader. Finding someone who would buy an immaculate Civic hatchback, with no a/c and a manual trans, was a different matter. Finally found a kid who was an engineering student at the University of Michigan. He kept it until the following July, perhaps realized a car with no a/c was not a swift move, and sold it.
My current beater is a manual shift 06 Focus, bought used. This old crate would fail any state inspection due to shocks and exhaust system, if Michigan had any inspections. Latest adventure with it was an intermittent PATS failure: turning the key would only provoke rapid flashes from the anti-theft system light on the panel, no starter action. Knocked some of the rust off a couple ground connections under the hood, and not only have I not had another PATS failure, the radio now works a lot better. The old crate actually goes pretty well, once it’s warmed up, but the place where I have the oil changed has been trying to sell me $600 worth of exhaust work for nearly a year. (I keep telling the guy it’s good enough, ie not a completely broken pipe).
The Focus is on the brink of failing the cost/benefit analysis tho. Michigan has the highest car insurance rates in the country. A recent second attempt to reduce insurance costs was drowned under a flood of lobbyist money in Lansing last week. Having minimal liability coverage, with the “second car discount” still costs me over $500/yr, and somehow, that doesn’t seem to be worth it to keep the VW out of the winter road salt…especially as attractive as the new Tiguan is. I could easily decide the VW will be an 8-10 year car, instead of a 15 year car, dispose of the Focus and pocket the insurance money, not to mention avoiding the not too distant day when the muffler and flex pipe give up entirely.
My disposal plan for the Focus would be to dump it at a local used car lot that specializes in beater grade cars. If they refused, because it’s a stick, it would go to a charity, which would be a straight write off for me as I don’t itemize my taxes.
I think Michigan’s auto insurance is beyond fixing. Probably moving to Canada is easier. My summer car was hit by a lady without insurance two weeks ago and it’s just another indication of the problems.
Many cars on the streets I can just make a guess if they have insurance or not.
I drove one of this generation, an ’06 5-door hatch several hours back from Connecticut last year, as it was my co-worker’s (somehow I got roped into it) customer’s trade. I can’t say it was a positive driving experience, though granted this one was beat to shit with many issues.
These cars have certainly become roaches of the road, commonly seen still roaming the roads despite a lot of wear and tear. I also did really like the pre-facelift styling of these when new.
These cars have certainly become roaches of the road, commonly seen still roaming the roads despite a lot of wear and tear.
Old Foci are all over the place near my home, but then a lot of them were built at Wayne Assembly, which is less than 10 miles from my home.
Attrition is thinning their ranks. Saw a wagon on the side of I-94 a few weeks ago. Looked like the right side ball joint failed and the wheel took out the fender as the suspension collapsed. Another wagon had a lurid moment on Michigan Ave, quite near Wayne Assembly. I saw an explosion of dirt a hundred yards down the street, followed by a Focus wagon careening over the berm from the eastbound side. The Focus spun in the middle of the westbound lane, then skidded back up the side of the berm before coming to rest on the top…..and another one bites the dust, literally.
That was another reason we replaced the Focus instead of the van. I wanted a Michigan built one before they move production to China.
Commonly seen? I rarely see a Focus on the road where I live today. Maybe one a week at most if even that.
“The 5-speed is probably a major downer, who can drive a stick these days? Or wants to?”
We have a winner.
Car guys can go on and on and fill message boards about how wonderful it is to drive a manual trans, but the general buying public couldn’t care less. {I used to think same} And if buying for a cheap commuter or for a “kid”, clutches are no sale.
Wonder why manuals are fading from dealer lots? Try selling one. Maybe in 1991 was an easy sell to kids, I had lots of calls selling 5 speed ’86 Escort GT. These days, teens want Uber/Lyft, as their “first car”. Uber drivers want autos.
My son owned a 2001 Focus. Having driven it, being an automatic, I think the 5-speed would be an awesome car.
To me, that is practically brand new. My daily car is an 88 Merkur XR4Ti with almost 270,000 miles on it. My backup car is a Scorpio with 178,000 miles on it, although it is waiting for a wiring harness transplant.
What surprises me the most is the fact your 2007 Grand Caravan isn’t a pile of rust. Our 2005 has around 145,000 on it, but is rusted just about anywhere the metal is folded over, all five doors, the hood, the rear quarter (one was repaired under warranty so it is good). In other words, typical Chrysler quality on corrosion protection.
But back to the Focus. Ours was very reliable, had just a hint of rust over one wheel arch, had less than 60,000 miles on it. It wasn’t a car I’d want to rive on the highway and for such a small car, the mileage was horrible. Give me an manual any day of the week. Unfortunately, my son ran into a car in front of him and the Focus was toast. Good luck with the sale.
That’s the power of Krown rustproofing. Just had the van (and the new Focus) done yesterday.
That and one day I was walking by a Caravan with terminally rusty rockers and noticed a big plastic plug on the backside (which you could see because the entire front panel was missing). So every couple of years I take the plugs out, vacuum out all the grit that gets in there and spray in some Krown oil.
Like with the Focus, it has worked well enough for the vehicle to last so long as to be completely worthless 🙂
I’m with the majority Doug. When you had mentioned selling it I had asked my son about it as he is looking for his first car and we are about three hours away from you.
All I got was “I don’t want to drive a standard and no, I don’t want to learn how either!”
And I have arthritis in my hip so giving him my car and getting it doesn’t fly either.
So I think the stick is going to be the “sticking” point for a while. (Couldn’t pass on the pun!)
“I don’t want to drive a standard and no, I don’t want to learn either!”
Life lesson to young son, the more you know, the better your employment prospects are. I’ve been hired over other applicants before because I could drive the employers manual Trans vehicle and the other applicants couldn’t.
That’s a real shame about your son.
I’m just a few years older, in Southern Ontario, and I’d seriously consider picking it up for a manual learner car, if only it was offered around this time next year (no money right now).
I didn’t grow up around anyone interested in cars (visible minority), and your son is just taking it for granted, like the typical person of his age.
Ugh. This brings back memories of my ’01 ZX3. I seem to be the only guy who bought one of these and ended up with a pile of junk; it still has been the only car I’ve owned that has left me stranded on the side of the road (twice, in fact). Determined to be rid of the thing before the warranty expired, I took a loss of $10,000 for the privelage to own the car for 2 years (I got $6,100 for it in August 2003). Such a shame, as it drove incredibly well for a small car of that era. The actual “Lemon” when it was new:
Ugh. This brings back memories of my ’01 ZX3. I seem to be the only guy who bought one of these and ended up with a pile of junk;
iirc, when new, the Focus set a record as the most recalled car in history. Once they had a decade under them and the bugs have been worked out, they were better.
I did not know about the recall record, but I can attest to an absurd amount of notices I received and had to take the car in for, worst being related to some rear suspention components. Ironically enough, none were related to the actual problems my car had issues with. I was still getting notices in the mail for years after I sold the car. And yes, I replaced the damn thing with a Honda, if you can believe that. * sarcasm *
The first two years of the North American Focus were not good from a reliability standpoint. From what I’ve read, Ford made changes to the car compared to the European version (which debuted first) when readying it for North America. Unfortunately, Ford didn’t sufficiently test the revised components.
(Meanwhile, I recall the European Focus being named “Germany’s most reliable car” during this time frame!)
Ford did work out the bugs. We had a 2005 Focus SE sedan that went for 235,000 miles, and didn’t have any major repairs (an alternator and a rear-wheel bearing) until about 195,000 miles. Unfortunately, too many early buyers got burned.
I’m glad you got a good one; in fact from my experience with others that owned them, the sedans and wagons were better cars in those early years because they weren’t built at the Hermosillo plant in Mexico like my 3 door. Such a shame, because I did like the car, but it certainly didn’t like me!
I’d keep the old one. That new Focus with the tiny windows and high doors reminds me of the 1976 Montego I had briefy for a company car. It felt as if I was sitting in a barrel. Loathesome. Give me a car with an airy, large greenhouse. That’s why I still have my Taurus wagon…that, and I still can do the work it needs now and then by myself. OEM NOS parts are dirt cheap and plentiful for a 1990.
That’s why in the opening line I’m blaming the Caravan. If I had a 3 year old Caravan this would never have come up and I’d be shooting for 400,000 km on the old Focus. And that’s also why I’m still driving it to work every day..
I still marvel at how many Americans can’t mentally convert kilometers to miles. 265,000km is only 160,000 miles – your car’s just getting broken in. Body cancer around the Great Lakes will get your car before it fails mechanically. Heck, my antediluvian Vulcan has all of 150 HP and the AXOD was the weak point in the drivetrain, but I had it rebuilt at 189,000 miles (almost 305,000km) and the engine’s never been opened unless you count replacing the oil-pan gasket about 16 years ago. Maybe I just got a rare perfect one, but aside from normal wear & tear and expected refurb here and there – this car only was designed to last about 15 years, is my best guess – it’s MY daily driver. I’ve changed the front seats to powered, customized the dash cluster, rebuilt the front and rear ends and replaced the HVAC system about five years ago. I’m good for another ten years. 🙂
I hope you get another 200,000km out of it! Hell, set a record. 😉
I think it is the stick shift that is giving most folks pause on it and not the miles. Stick shift cars (unless a specialty car like a sports car) are hard to sell new (let alone used) nowadays. I have actually bought several cars with manual trans for scratch due to no interest in a stick shift car. My Ford Probe was one of them
Having owned a 2005 Focus and having spent a lot of time with the current Focus, I feel the 2001-2007 Focus is a much better car in terms of visibility and seating comfort. Unlike the current Focus, there is no intrusive center console and plenty of leg room…… of and NO Sync
Why not keep it for a while? Do you folks in Canada have provisions on your insurance where you can exclude a driver from a specific car? This would keep the insurance company from charging you all that money because they think 3 cars and 3 drivers in the house means that each person has a car. My insurance company allows that.
Agree 100% about useable interior room; my ’01 3 door felt spacious for such a small exterior package. Dad got a 2012 sedan as a company car and that thing was insanely small inside. Talk about retro-grade.
In Ontario, if you have three cars and three drivers, each driver MUST be listed as the primary driver for a car.
The family car that was to be passed on to me was deregistered when I received my license for this reason – my parents upgraded one car, and I wanted to keep the old one for sentimental value, but we couldn’t possibly insure it at the time.
Takes me back, to my 2001 1.6 litre Euro spec Focus hatch – IMHO, truly a brilliant car and one’d buy again if I was time traveller.
You know, no matter how nice a certain car is or was – even a Focus has been to you, it’s a car I wouldn’t give two cents for, and apparently many others feel the same way!
Only my humble opinion – to me, the Focus is an incredibly ugly car that in your 2001 model anyway, was rather awkward to drive – I have driven them, and the weirdest thing about it was the offset steering wheel. That threw me off and never got used to it. I’m not a Ford guy, hence my bias. Certainly nothing personal. After all, not many care for my W body Impala, either, but I love it! I am a Chevy guy at heart.
I’m happy yours has been so reliable. Our old 2002 CR-V was pretty good, too – Wifey loved it, but I wouldn’t have one for my daily ride on any condition. I suppose I have a very narrow area of what I like, but that’s just me.
Hope you do find a willing buyer, however, because it’s a shame to have such trouble selling an older car no matter the condition. All my best to you!
I doubt I’m the only one out there, I’ve always thought the ’00 – ’07 Focus was/is one of the most hideously ugly cars ever made (along with any Taurus made between 1996 and 2007, and any Toyota Echo made from 2000 to 2005. For me, the Focus introduced in 2008 was a huge upgrade in the looks department.
This is largely why I have finally “bit the bullet” and am now driving an automatic-equipped car. It is also the reason that, when the dealer told me my ’01 PT Cruiser 5-speed was a $500 car, I took it and ran. Good car; worth nothing.
Whatever you end up doing with it, good luck!
I think a reason also is that you have to disassemble half the car to replace the clutch on a FWD. On an older car the labor would make this a loosing repair as the cost could easily be more than what the car is worth and be a little daunting for the average shade tree mechanic or kid. On a rear wheel drive car it is much easier, I got to the point I could replace a clutch in 3-4 hours back in the 70’s. Still have a bunch of wooden pilot shafts around.
If you can find an online forum or facebook group for Focus/Fords that covers your area, I’d advertise on that. A manual car would be an enthusiast car at this point, so try and find one who will appreciate what it is especially given the condition.
Around about 2003, I lost my company car and needed to buy a daily driver. I’d been enamored of the Focus, particularly in ‘sport wagon, ZTW form, with the fog lamps and 16″ alloy wheels. Found one on my local Ford dealers used lot, so I took a test drive. Let’s just say I was NOT impressed. It wasn’t the car. I liked THAT. It was…….the engine. It just didn’t have enough power for me. I moved on in my car shopping and ended up with a 2000 Audi A6 Avant. Well, that experiment didn’t last long. The Audi was amazing to drive, but constantly needed expensive repairs. I started thinking about a replacement…….. By this time, it was early 2005. I saw ANOTHER 2003 ZTW at another Ford dealer, and took it for a test drive. MUCH better, all because this one had the 2.3 liter P-Zev engine. It also didn’t hurt that it was also equipped with leather seats and a moor roof! I went back a couple of weeks later and traded in the Audi. I LOVED that wagon. Sadly, I ended up totaling it on October 27, 2010 in a solo, roll-over accident into a snow bank. If not for that, I think I might still be driving it…..
Hallelujah! I’m glad they’ve finally begun doing something about this.
For the last year I’ve been trying to sell two vehicles for very little money. One was a 1994 Ford E350 Club Wagon Chateau, one owner, 460 ci engine. This one finally sold two weeks ago for $1000. I lost $500 on it. The second car is a 1979 Fiat 2000 Sport Spyder. The Spyder is a complete car with almost no rust but the PO removed the cam tower on it. All the parts are in the passenger side footwell. I am asking $500 which is considerably less than what one would pay for some of the parts. It still sitting in my storage place. I’ve had a couple of people look at it over the last year. The last person that came said he mainly wanted the seats and the seats in my car were in the same condition as his so no sale. My ads include tons of pictures and an accurate description of condition and I still get texts/emails/calls asking “does it run?”
I got so fed up with all the stupid questions I revised my ads and in Bold letters to say ‘DOES NOT RUN’ “PLEASE READ THE AD IN ITS ENTIRETY BEFORE CONTACTING ME’. One thing I truly detest is when someone contacts you and say ” what is the lowest amount you will take”. This happens at least 95% of the time so my reply is “What is the maximum you are willing to pay?”
Selling old cars is a true PIA except if you are selling air cooled Porsches. And that may be changing.
Doug I feel your pain. Best wishes.
Update to my last post:
I finally sold my 1979 Fiat Spider. The buyer turned out to be a great guy and not only bough the ’79 but also bought another Fiat Spider I had. This one being an ’80 and a parts car.
It took a while but finally sold.
Doug
I’m in the same boat with my ’02 Wagon. Too old to be worth anything, but worth more to me as a daily driver that takes the Winter salt away from my “better” cars. Maybe yours can do the same for your Caravan/New Focus.
I feel badly about your predicament, DougD, and—as someone who’s taken in some “rescue” dogs before—something about me wants to give the Focus a good home, if only to have a “slow car to drive fast” manual-transmission car to toss around on country roads now and then.
This essay—-as well as the thoughtful responses through the day—-reminds me which CC is the right older-car site for me to hang around in online!
It’s 16 years old. It’s rare to see one from that generation at this point. My sister sold one of those two years ago. Although state of the art at the time it came out it was not nearly as nice to travel distances in as my car:
Today I sent my 1990 Pontiac Trans Sport to the crusher. (Actually, I think it’s a shredder these days). The engine was tight, no leaks and no oil use between changes, which were rather long term and a little random. The passenger and back seat looked great.
On the other hand, no air bags, rear suspension spring bases rusted and falling apart and on the road to imminent failure (part of the rear beam axle assembly), leaking tail gate and front passenger door (shrunken seals), passenger door only opening from the inside, sliding door only opening from the outside, tail gate latch handle broken off so it could not be opened, radio not working, speedometer and tach about 1000% optimistic (thank you Waze for telling me how fast I was going), wipers suffering from 90’s GM erratic wiper syndrome (look it up), AC leaking Freon replacement stuff and no one can find the leak…..
My point: sometimes it’s time to pull the plug. Particularly if your state has safety inspections.
The manual transmission is actually the best one to have. No problems with one of those. The automatic transmission however is a major POS. It is a Mazda design that Ford adapted for use in the Focus. i know from experience it is a piece of crap. My car was a 2005 Focus wagon and i really liked it but i could not keep a working transmission in it. If mine had the manual transmission i would still have it.
When beaters get over 12-15 years old, even low ballers want a newer model year cheap car.
“I can get a 2006 for same $$$”
I had the same problem ten years ago selling my ’91 Corolla. Excellent condition, needed nothing, but 280K and a manual. All I got was lowballers who wanted it for basically scrap value. I was trying to get at least $800 or so. I remember one lady calling, demanding to know what kind of problems the car had. No problems, I replied. What’s the mileage? 280K. Whaaat? She thought it was 80 and the number in the ad was a typo. Well, maybe that’s the problem, she said, before hanging up. Eventually, the car was bought for $600 by a couple of Mexicans who shipped it south of the border. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s still running in Mexico somewhere, with twice the mileage.
Of course, Doug, your timing is wrong – I’d seriously consider it as a manual-learner car if it was around this time next year instead of this year.
I didn’t grow up with anyone with an automotive background, so learning maintenance and to drive stick isn’t something I’ve gotten experience in yet. I’m 20, and also in Southern Ontario, hence costs have been prohibitive so far, though I’d probably have enough next year. It’d be a lot easier to buy from someone trusted who has done their maintenance.
The prohibitive costs are why the family car that I got from my parents is currently deregistered while we save up.
Good luck though!
Almost sold it. Daniel sounded like a nice kid, but he checked with his insurance company and that was the end of that…. 🙁
A few years ago, I bought the family ’98 Sienna to keep it in the family for sentimental reasons (he got another old Sienna) even though the insurance costs would be excessive (Southern Ontario as well here). We decided to park the Sienna for a few years, and it’s still parked – I plan to put it back into occasional use sometime next year.
Doug, I didn’t know you had dropped the price to $900. I remember you posted about it in another thread at about $1200 and I was thinking that was a good price. At $900 I would have very seriously considered it, based on how well you’ve looked after the car and your good experience. The fact it’s been Krowned annually is a huge plus in my books too (I have been an avid Krown user for 20 years.
I have been thinking about getting a cheap, fun to drive, manual transmission commuter car lately. For me, a manual is a must on a small car. Since I do pretty much all my own mechanical work, a cheap “as is” special would be right up my alley. My car insurance is pretty cheap, but I haven’t done the math yet to see if the savings in fuel would be worth it.
I wish you all the best on the selling of the car. I was in a similar situation when I was selling my Suburban. It was about 20 years old, it had nearly 400,000 kms but was in better shape than most with half the mileage. The 350 was strong didn’t burn oil, it was Krowned annually so had a very solid body, the interior was excellent, all the power accesories worked. It was an old, high mileage vehicle, but very sound and well cared for. However, the mileage was just such a turn off, I almost had to give it away. The guy who bought it afterwards was so happy with it, he emailed several months later saying he couldn’t believe how well the truck ran.
It was somewhat similar when we sold our Prius. It was only 5 years old, but had about 165,000 kms on it. The car was like new, garaged, Krowned, waxed, perfect interior and exterior; it only needed a marker light to pass safety. But as soon as people heard the mileage when they called and that was the end of the call. I held my ground on that car though, and ended up selling it a really nice lady who had a 1990 Corolla with close to 400K that was ready for the scrap yard. My old Prius was the first car she ever bought alone without her husband’s assistance.
One thing you can consider if you don’t sell and want to donate is giving it to a school. I have a family member and friend who both work in high school shops. They are always looking for donations for students to work on.
Just changed the ad again, $1,900 certified and e-tested. Chirp chirp, if there’s still crickets on Monday it’ll be $1,500. And so on.
Yup, should have donated or scrapped it instead of spending the money to safety check it. I will not make the same mistake when the Caravan goes.
The difference is that the Caravan will have a huge potential market. Whether a large immigrant family or a tradesman who will pull the seats and use it for his work, old minivans seem quite popular.
The difference is that the Caravan will have a huge potential market.
Caravans have a huge market here in Detroit, with thieves. They love minivans for carrying all the other stuff they steal. When I worked for a company that installed office furniture, one of the project managers almost lost his beater Caravan at a job side in the D. Rich said that as he approached his van, he noticed it was running. Then he got in and saw the steering column was torn up. The thieves had not been able to get the trans out of park.
Update!
Finally sold it last night. Basically I broke even, if you add what I would have got at the wreckers to what I paid to get it safetied that’s what I got for it. I got paid nothing for my marketing efforts, but at least I didn’t lose money.
Hopefully it provides some good use for the new owner. Last photo in the driveway with my plates off this morning. New focus with snowtires in the background.
Oh rats, I was going to buy that. 🙂 Just watch your phone/email start blowing up with offers. Murphy’s Law is alive and well.
Oh rats, I was going to buy that. ?
That’s why I posted Franklin’s impending disposal on Facebook first. I didn’t want someone jumping out of the woodwork claiming to want him after he’s gone.
Congratulations! In my book, breaking even is a job well done.
Congratulations! I sold my 06 Focus yesterday.
I had considered obtaining a part time job to keep occupied over the winter (I’m retired from full time work). If I had something that would have required I drive somewhere 2-3 times a week, regardless how evil the weather, I would have kept the Focus, but I didn’t turn up anything that sounded really appealing, so the Focus became surplus.
Per my plan, expressed earlier, I took it to an independent used car lot that specializes in beater grade cars. The guy was making noises around $1800, until he twigged that the car was a stick, then he said “that takes $800 off”. He handed me a check for $1,000, I signed off on the title, and I was Focusless.
I’ll recover from my post-Focus-partum depression soon enough, because my VW is really nice to drive.
Good news ! .
For $900 I was seriously thinking about it ; take a cheapo flight or the bus up, why not ? .
I can’t imagine it not being worth that much .
-Nate