(First posted 12/22/2013) The siren song of the SUV was calling my name again. Oh so short was my memory of record gas prices, or what the heck, I only commuted two miles each way, on a price per pound basis, this made perfect sense!
Actually, it made sense on several levels I suppose I told myself. The Civic was a great car, but I do like some extra space in a car. I also find older (as in used with some miles under them, not necessarily outdated) vehicles to have more character and if I can find a creampuff for relative pennies per pound I am even more smitten (as was the case with my Mercedes 400E and the Buick Regal GS of a few weeks ago).
So it was with this Tahoe. It was a one-owner truck, garaged in a nice neighborhood. Every receipt was present, the only flaw I found was a small 2” indentation on the left rear fender. The wife (main driver) had decided she wanted a Volvo XC90, so after about ten years the Tahoe was put out to pasture.
Advertised for $5,300 with about 90,000 miles on it, I called and went to see it the first day it was available. It drove well, looked great, and the 2” thick stack of service and maintenance records were extremely reassuring. I tried to haggle but the seller was not very willing, citing several other calls he had already received. In the end we settled on $5000, I wrote a deposit check and arranged to do the exchange at a bank the next day during business hours.
The next day I got a call from the owner. He said when he took it home after I drove it he parked it outside. Later that evening he wanted to move it into the garage and noticed fluid underneath it. So instead he drove it to his mechanic, who called him first thing in the morning with a diagnosis: Lower Intake Manifold Gasket failure, cost quoted around $1000. Doh!
I gingerly asked if that meant our deal was off, and he replied no, it was still his problem, he would fix it and hoped that a two-day delay would not be an issue. Nope, not for me, happy to wait! Every seller should be so accommodating, the guy really was stand-up, very nice to see and it made me confident about my new purchase.
So I got it a few days later and drove it to work, where several people admired it immediately and were amazed how clean it was. And they were right, even underneath was spotless, the farthest off-road this ever got was probably the Nordstrom parking lot. Inside it had pretty much everything you could ask for at the time – large cup holders, a decent radio with CD player, driver and passenger airbags, power everything of course, and big heated pillowy seats that would come in very handy later on.
Finished in Summit White over Neutral Beige leather interior, every single one of you has at least seen if not ridden in one of these and very possible the same color combination. At one time they were really all over the place. Back in the day GM had the 2-door version and then the big Suburban and realized that there was probably a market for something in between. And so the 4-door Tahoe was spawned.
However, it was not just a chopped Suburban. The suspension was redesigned and is apparently a lot softer than a Suburban as the anticipated clientele was mainly suburbanites driving on paved surfaces. The LT package was the top of the line with a base price of $31,895, with the options mine had it was about $37,000 sticker when new.
However as far as the drivetrain goes, it was the same as the standard Suburban, so it had the 350c.i. V8 that generated 255 horsepower and a stout 330ft-lbs of torque, all delivered through a 4-speed automatic. The weight was around 4900 pounds. By 1998, the 4WD was all pushbutton including low-range and it all worked fine.
That 350 which is a descendant of the 350 that I had in my old Chevrolet Concourse Wagon many moons before performed just as smoothly and silently in this application. Smooth, effortless torque, subtle shifts, and a compliant ride made it obvious why this was so popular especially in locales where there are not many curves, even though it handled acceptably well anyway.
Like our Land Cruiser, the rear hatch was a split affair with tailgate and glass. Unlike our Land Cruiser however, there was no third-row option. No matter as the back seat was wide enough (we thought) and we had the van if need be anyway.
The front of the cabin was large, and well, plasticky. But everything worked and worked well. While not nearly as luxurious as our Land Cruiser it was much less expensive, a trade-off I could live with. All three of our kids fit in the back seat without major issues (one booster, one Britax, and one car-carrier seat/base assembly) and the dog could ride in the cargo area.
After about six months without any problems I started to notice a weird steering effect. It was similar to if you were going around a corner and hit a small patch of ice, the steering wheel would get superlight and jerk to the side and then the issue would be gone a split second later. It got to the point where I could repeat it at will and was disconcerting, especially at higher speeds. At first I thought there was a problem with the steering box or the suspension until I researched it (thank you Google) and found that it was part of the power-steering electronics.
There is a small ring that fits around the steering column that has a sensor on it which can go bad. I found a replacement on ebay and got to work. A modern steering column is collapsible, which in this case meant it is really like a telescope with several sections that can fit within each other. To replace this “ring”, you have to remove a bolt that holds two sections of column together, then slowly push the column up into itself, unplug and remove the “ring”, replace it, then pull the column back together and bolt it back together. This did work and the problem was solved! $26 for the part and half an hour of very contorted time in the driver side footwell.
After about a year I had to buy new tires and found a set of Dunlops on TireRack for under $70 each. I was surprised at the value, but it makes sense since they must make millions of tires in this size. They worked well and were quiet and cushy. The Tahoe does not pretend to be a great handler so cornering didn’t get any worse, if you pushed it too hard it would start to squeal. Really it just liked to cruise and did so extremely well.
Around the same time I started to notice some oil droplets on the driveway. I took it to a local mechanic and it apparently was due to the oil pipes that run to the cooler were leaking. Apparently this is a common occurrence on these vehicles and was soon put right.
This was around the time that we decided to move to Colorado. We did the move ourselves, on our own dime, and it involved several trips in rented very large yellow Penske trucks (how is it that they let a normal person with a normal driver’s license acquired during a high school class with the football coach drive these things on the public highway?) for all of our stuff that we could not live without (but a lot of which ended up on the driveway at the community garage sale a year later, go figure).
My wife flew out with two of the kids to start their new schools in Colorado while I stayed back to sell the house and work for a while longer but since she would need a car one of the trips would be with the Tahoe (since the Sienna had burned as you may recall). So the week that my wife and boys flew out my daughter and I loaded all kinds of breakables into the Tahoe and we set off.
You can load a Tahoe to the rafters and it will not even care. Empty or full, it drives pretty much the same. Since we were in money-saving mode due to starting our lives over without any employment lined up and two mortgages to pay, I had decided a hotel was out of the question. At the end of the first day’s driving we had made it to Reno, so we decided that the parking lot of the Holiday Inn looked nice with a Denny’s next door for breakfast. We rearranged all of the stuff within the car and squeezed ourselves in the back.
I won’t lie and say it was super comfortable but it worked and at least we woke up early, ate at Denny’s and got an early start. At the end of that next very long day we made it to our new home where I basically handed over the Tahoe keys to my wife, took her rental car down to Denver, flew home and took a cab back to the house. The Tahoe averaged 17mpg on the 1250-mile trip, not bad considering some of the mountains in the way and our relatively high average speed. At least it took regular and gas got cheaper the further east we got.
Several months later when we were all situated and completely moved I got to experience the Tahoe in the snow. It worked fine, but you could feel the weight especially when braking. On a bitterly cold day while I was driving down to Denver and stopped for gas, it would not restart. The fellow on the other side of the pump gave me a jump start and I just drove straight to an O’Reilly’s, they load tested the battery (it was fine, but the alternator was not) and I ended up replacing the alternator right then and there with snow falling.
The end of the road for the Tahoe came when our youngest son was transitioning to a Britax Infant Car Seat. Modern kid seats require 3-point belts to work correctly. It turns out that this generation of Tahoe only had a lap belt in the middle rear. So with three kids it does not work safely unless you rig something up which I was not willing to do in this case.
I advertised it for $5800 (yes, more than I paid for it two years earlier) as a California car with every receipt from new and the first person that came to see it bought it without even haggling. Turns out he used to live in one of the East Bay towns that we used to live in when we had the Jaguar and the Saab, weird how the world is so small. While the Tahoe was not quite as reliable as many of the other cars I’ve had, in every instance the fix was easy, quick, and quite inexpensive. There is definitely an advantage to designs that were built in the millions.
how is it that they let a normal person with a normal driver’s license acquired during a high school class with the football coach drive these things (Penske moving truck) on the public highway? — agreed
+1 I’ve rented them and felt totally unqualified to drive them. Coach didn’t teach us how to drive any big trucks
Very true. My driver’s ed car was a Corolla. Luckily I was already learning to drive in the Highlander. I feel like I’d have more of a fear of larger cars if I’d only learned to drive in a compact.
+3 — I rented one in Alabama when I moved to NC and towed a dead ’77 Firebird (backwards) behind it with a tow dolly. I could not see any part of my beloved Bird in either side-view mirror and was relieved to see it each time I refueled.
Yeah I now give them all a very wide berth on on the highway. If one is behind me in traffic I will usually switch lanes to get away from it. After three trips in the big 26footers with a full load I got pretty good at driving them (OK, keeping them between the lines) but if faced with a real emergency, who knows. The last trip (pictured) involved a fair amount of snow in Wyoming, definitely a bit of a white-knuckler at times.
I was guessing that picture was Wyoming due to the miles of turbines. About the only thing to see for a lonnnnnng section of I-80. I know that state well.
Yep. For some reason Wyoming is one of my own favorite states to drive through. I really like the vast spaces with interesting land formations as opposed to say, Utah or Nevada or the states to the East of me now. I must have looked at too many Marlboro Man ads when I was a kid. I never smoked but it always reminds me of those backgrounds…
The rules here were recently changed to allow you to drive a 6000kg vehicle on only a car licence but only privately you must not be paid or you need the correct endorsement.
I’ll pile on here too.
Nothing scares me more that a large non-CDL rental truck or RV with a trailer. You’ve got 30-40ft & 10-15tons of vehicle “controlled” by someone who has no special training.
I think that a society we should have a license class between a B CDL and regular C.
Absolutely. When I ride my bicycle on the road I usually get treated well by drivers of commercial vehicles, but those single-axle cube trucks that can be driven without a CDL or other special licence are the absolute worst.
I’d say you got your monies worth out of the Tahoe. Great find at a great price. I like this body style better then those that followed
Im really considering getting a Tahoe or a Cherokee XJ as my second car, for those outdoor trips and moving stuff around. Both seem to be very simple and solid SUVs.
Somehow the SUVs of today look more like cars for soccer moms, which is fine, but im looking for something a little more rugged and simple.
Tahoe will be a better hauler while the XJ with be better off road with its front axle and lighter weight. 98-01 XJ are the best of the bunch with the refreshed interior.
Go for it! I have a ’96 4Runner as my outdoors/weekend truck and it is so nice to drive an “old school” SUV in a sea of crossover intenders. Take your pic, all are fairly decent whether you go Japanese (4Runner, Pathfinder, Xterra, Montero/Montero Sport, etc) or domestic (Explorer, S10 Blazer, XJ Cherokee, ZJ Grand Cherokee, Tahoe). The domestics have cheaper and easier to find parts generally speaking although my 4Runner is also generally cheap and easy to wrench on on the rare occasions that it is necessary.
Like Ian said if you’re taking more than just 2 people and maybe a dog or two and gear out to the woods/mountains, I’d go Tahoe or something like an Explorer over an XJ. XJ rear seats are really quite tight for adults. ZJ Grand Cherokees can be found for less money than an XJ and present a usable upgrade in on road refinement and rear passenger space, although rear cargo space is still hampered by a spare that eats up a lot of space.
Great choice Jim! Since I was kid I really liked these Tahoes, and actually did want one (or a similar Yukon) when I was young. This was before most luxury makes had big SUVs, so the Tahoe was pretty high-end.
Although the interior was definitely plasticy, at least it has an attractive layout, and those leather seats are wicked comfy (I’ve experienced them first hand).
These are still my favorite generation of Tahoe.
Great write up on a great truck! I’ve been exposed to several of these on a long term basis and they’re great trucks. A good friend of mine bought the last year of this body style in Z71 trim barely used, and it was a pretty fantastic truck. The Z71 package gave the ride a little more firmness and really completed the truck. I spent many miles in that truck, both as a passenger and behind the wheel, it really was one of my favorite vehicles of all time. And one of the most capable, by a long shot.
He replaced it with a brand new Z71 of the next generation and those too are pretty fantastic but lacking something. Never could put my finger on it, I like this generation better.
If these had a third row I’d be looking for one for my wife to replace our minivan, I’ve thought of a Suburban of this generation for her as they’re ridiculously cheap to fix and with the old venerable Vortec 350 will run forever. If they do die, it’s pretty cheap to fix.
Agree in volumes. Dare I say that if I found a Z71 in that condition locally, my Dakota would be up for sale.
Our neighbor has a Z71 of the newer generation with 3 rows, she is thinking about selling…
When I was looking I checked out the newer ones, at the time it wasn’t worth the extra money to me after I found this one. Looking back, if I’d found one with 3 rows and the center shoulder belt, we may still have it.
New gen ones are much nicer to drive, they’re just put together really well and seem to ditch some of the pillow-ness of that generation in favor of refinement. Said buddy of mine who bought his second Z71 new in ’04 still has it, and he’s brutally hard on vehicles. I don’t think it’s ever had a major mechanical, so that’s saying something.
For my preference of the old one it’s totally personal. They were a totally different beast when compared to the LT, the seats were still pillowy but it really was a firm riding truck – the booty sag on the LT was the total opposite on the Z71.
I really like these things, and there’s no good reason for it.
Friend had a 98 in college and I loved that truck. That V8 at idle that would make the blub, blub, blub sound. Had many good memories in this truck especially taking it out late at night after a blizzard in VT, heading into an empty parking lot, putting it into to 2wd and just drift it and doing doughnuts for an hour. Didn’t like the front seats for long distance trips. Very soft and no lumbar support. Also, another annoying thing about this generation was that with the shortened wheelbase, you could only open the rear windows like a third of the way. Anyways, wasn’t a feminine line anywhere on this truck. Loved that Tahoe.
Head Gaskets or intake manifold gaskets. I sure hope that GM has learned how to design an engine that doesn’t eat these things. It’s too bad that seemingly every good vehicle design from them has had an engine gasket issue. At work, we had a similar vintage 2500 with the exact same gasket failure, but otherwise an excellent truck.
Toyota had these problems. Wasn’t this due, in part, that asbestos couldn’t be used in manufacturing those gaskets? The 4.5 six cylinder LC engines of that vintage share that affliction.
Its not the engine, from what I’ve read, its the coolant.
Maybe the gasket materials make a difference. Clean coolant certainly helps, but doesn’t ultimately prevent failure; at least not in the 2 failures I’ve had. I don’t think Dex-cool is any more problematic, any coolant must be periodically replaced.
Yes Dexcool is more problematic it is harder to contain, much in the same way that R134A is harder to contain than R12 because the individual molecules are smaller so they can find their way through a smaller opening.
Okay, but what I’m trying to say is that with one exception, the failures I’ve seen had nothing to do with Dexcool because the vehicles never had it in the first place. I’m referring to cars and trucks from the ’80s up to the mid-90s. The one exception was an intake manifold gasket leak in my dad’s 97 Astro, which I think had Dexcool from the factory.
I had a buddy who ended up with this exact truck, only a year older I believe. Was a tough old thing and I liked it a great deal, but Ironically, he was on sort-of an anti-SUV tirade at the time (why the hell he got the thing with this mind-set, I don’t know). Any-who, he kept it for a while for odd-jobs sort of duty and let it go. A real shame as far as I’m concerned, since he’d probably still be using it today….You nailed it: tough, cheap to repair and quite versatile.
Interesting aside about the steering gremlin. I had a Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham of the same vintage as the green one featured earlier this week and it had the same problem…..Pretty spooky the first few times it did it…It was infrequent enough that I never had it fixed before selling the car, so I never knew the cause.
Another big American monster that I miss….I loved that car and still regret getting rid of it.
I’ve always liked these. If they didn’t have such a tendency towards rusting, I’d probably still own one today.
Tahoes and Yukons as clean as the featured vehicle are a rarity around here. Assuming it had under 160K miles, it’d still bring upwards of $5K locally in that condition.
Seems that your leather had begun to come apart on the bottom of the driver’s seat – an ailment that seemed to affect them all eventually (tall truck, people “slide” in and out, cheap material wears out). For as long as I’ve been looking, I STILL haven’t been able to find an un-ripped pair of leather buckets in these 88-98 GM trucks!
The seat surface itself was fine, there was a 2-3″ gash in the side (above the seat controls), I never figured out if it was a split or due to some accident, it almost looked like a knife cut it was that clean.
At various times over the years I’ve thought about buying several of these and hauling them out to the midwest and making money on them. Buy two, buy a used trailer with no rust, haul one with the other and sell both and the trailer. These are still over over California and no rust anywhere. The gremlin is the transmission what what I understand, if used for lots of towing it may have problems, otherwise 200k+ is no problem.
That tear appears to be about where the lap belt would abrade against the vinyl with the driver onboard.
Yes, those 4L60E’s were a PITA later in their lives. I’ve said it before, but they account for better than 3/4 of the tranny swaps I’ve done in my adult life.
I’ve considered the resale possibilities too, but with a twist – scoop up clean southern/western trucks with bad trannies on the cheap, haul them back up north, have rebuilt boxes waiting, swap and sell.
When did they get better? Just curious because I have an odd leaning towards these things, and my wife’s vehicle should get replaced soon AAAANNND I have this tendency to be oddly spur of the moment. Or in other words, if I have to fix that flipping van one more time…
When did they get better? Just after they got rebuilt, in each individual case 🙂
GM made incremental upgrades throughout their life cycle – but as far as I’ve seen, a ’94 was just as likely to die in the usual ways as a ’99.
Various rebuilders claim that they can build a stronger 4L60E, but I’ve never spent enough money to find out if their claims ring true. For me, it’s always been either junkyard replacements, or the few surplus Goodwrench units I’ve been fortunate enough to snag.
I keep telling myself that the next time I have a non-urgent 4L60E failure, I’m going to rip into it and learn how to properly rebuild them myself. But so far, they’ve all been untimely failures that needed to be put back on the road yesterday!
Dont see many of these here, Suburbans were exported and badged as Holdens but they didnt sell well so I guess GM didnt bother with anything else.
Apparently they sold 750 in 3 years. Interestingly they had the dashboard from a Chevy Blazer – as those were built in RHD – rather than convert the normal dash. It wasn’t a great result…
Mind you they still hold their value well, I suppose mostly because there aren’t any newer ones available apart from mega-$$$ private imports, there are a few for sale at the $15-20k mark. Otherwise you are looking at a Land Cruiser.
Great vehicles. Whereas most of Chevy’s lineup in the mid-90s was woefully outdated relative to the competitors, the Tahoe was almost uniformly superior to anything else it was shopped against.
The best MY for these, IMHO, was 1996. First year for the Vortec 350, last year for fixed-rate power steering that managed to convey some semblance of road feel. GM introduced a variable-rate system in the 1997 C/Ks and SUVs that was far too light at all speeds; I actually sold a lightly used ’96 Tahoe LT to a customer who’d wanted a brand-new 1998, solely thanks to the older model’s better steering feel.
Yeah it had ZERO road feel. Literally one-finger-able at most speeds too. Until that sensor issue, after that you tend to keep both hands on the wheel until fixed!
Agree! My wife and I bought a new ’96 Tahoe LT 4×4 in midnight blue w/ beige interior, and it was one of the best vehicles we’re ever had. We replaced it with a new ’99 ‘burb to better accommodate our growing family, the last MY of that C/K platform, which was also solid vehicle, but not quite as nice to drive as that ’96 Tahoe.
We later traded the ’99 for a new ’01 ‘burb, and it was evident by then that GM had some build quality issues and had cheapened its full size trucks. We didn’t care for that Suburban, but my wife chose to replace it with a ’03 Yukon Denali, which was one of the worst vehicles we’ve ever owned, and which we traded for an ’05 Acura MDX. We’ve not owned a GM vehicle since.
Cheapen-out one of your biggest cash cows – now that’s a good idea… Make an extra % profit on this sale and then none on the repeat business you don’t get.
People love these things, and Ill just never get it. Granted, as a do-everything family car these and other big SUVs really are capable of handling all of that. But me, as a single, no kids having yahoo I cringe knowing this is the closed we’ll ever get to the original ’69-’75 K-5 Blazers with the full removeable tops. Now That’s the kind of SUV Id be into. Of course, being a Mopar fan that means my choice would be a 1st gen Ramcharger or Trailduster….
I agree on the big moving trucks! I rented an Isuzu NPR cabover when I moved from Memphis to Oregon the first time. There is literally NO instruction on how to handle it, but seeing as Im adaptable, a decent driver and a quick learner I got used to it pretty quickly. The driving experience going from my ’95 Wrangler I had at the time to that rig was eye opening, indeed! I knew I had to straighten up, fly right and keep my wits about me. The idea of some texting soccer mom or hipster that can barely handle a corolla driving one of these down the freeway is frightening.
True, true.
Several years ago, back when there were oodles of realtors around, I had an agreement with one of them wherein I could borrow her ’05 Chevy Express-based cube van whenever it wasn’t in use, so long as I kept it up on oil changes and other basic maintenance. It had a 6.0 Vortec, a 4L80E with the shift points set ridiculously high, dualies in back, and a box that was something like 8x8x16′, complete with the realtor’s face plastered across both sides.
I had no problem driving it, and in fact quite enjoyed it. It drove like a dream compared to my winter beater at the time, so much so that I would look for excuses to use it.
The purpose of the van was for the realtor’s clients to move their things into their newly-purchased homes. Sometimes clients would be waiting to get the van from me when I returned. Many of them made me quite nervous, watching them get out of their Camcords and try to figure the beast out, and always declining my offers to help familiarize them. It was not uncommon for the van to accumulate new body damage on a weekly basis.
Needless to say, whenever I see U-Hauls or any other amateur-driven vehicle of similar size, I give them a WIDE berth.
I don’t understand those agents that have a truck for their client’s use. Yes there is some advertising benefit but there are also negatives when someone sees a client taking out mail boxes or mirrors on parked cars w/o a clue they are doing it. The person who witness it isn’t going to pay attention to the “use this truck free if you buy with me” line and focus on the name on the truck. Also you would have to be moving a ton of properties to make it cheaper than just paying for a local U-haul rental where you make the client rent and assume responsibility for any damage and you just reimburse them the cost of the rental and fuel. Not to mention how good is the advertising if the truck shows all that body damage inflicted by clients.
On the other hand I sometimes consider it as it would be useful for my robotics activities and moving materials for my own properties.
In this case, they had me to pound the dents back out. Since the customers were financially liable for any damage, and I was doing the fixing in exchange for a bit of mileage, I’m pretty sure the realtor came out on top most of the time!
But yes, I too often wondered about the business case for it (short of claiming the cost of the van as a business and/or advertising expense for tax purposes, which I’m fairly sure they could and did).
It will come as no surprise that, just before it hit 100K miles, the van disappeared with no replacement. I lost touch with the realtor shortly after that; not even sure if she’s still in the business.
I could darn near do a COAL on that van, what with all the stories it had. Like the time a customer tried to take it through a fast-food drivethru, with predictable results and body damage to match. Or the time when the customer’s “cargo” included live farm animals – and they had the nerve to claim the interior was “like that” when I handed them the keys.
A friend has a 1998 Tahoe – in brown, of all things. A good color for this vehicle.
What’s funny is that’s he’s about my age, a bit shorter, and a retired Cincinnati Metro employee who drove a bus for years. He tilts the steering wheel all the way up, and drives it like a bus, too!
I call it the “shoebox”. It has served him well. It’s also got leather – a very comfortable place to spend some time. I ask him what kind of mileage he gets – he says: “oh, I don’t know… when it needs gas, I get gas.” He has a comfortable retirement, I guess.
A friend of mine has a next-generation Yukon that he’s quite happy with. We took a road trip back in July and with six people and luggage it handled well and got decent mileage with the 5.3 litre V8.
When I worked for Palm Chevrolet back in 1999, we sold a ton of these things!
A few observations…the build quality was incredible! I mean, even today, these have a certain solidity to them that no modern truck today seems to be able to match.
Sure the interior was plastic-y, but the plastics were durable. The cloth in the LS felt like it would last a hundred years. The leather in the LT had the most aromatic scent!
And if I recall correctly, the stereo had eight speakers and sounded very good.
It’s a bit on the big side for me, but was definitely a bright spot at GM at the time, and was further proof of where most of their development dollars went to…
It’s interesting Jim, that you didn’t make a direct comparison between your Land Cruiser and the Tahoe. For many years I had a Cruiser (the older FZJ80 version) and my wife’s sister and husband had a similar vintage Tahoe. The 80 was a nice SUV but still came from an earlier generation of truck with its solid axles and straight 6, and yet EVERYTHING about it was much better than the Tahoe, except maybe horsepower. The brakes and handling on that nearly new Tahoe were terrifying. A few months ago I was “upgraded” to a rental Suburban, from a subcompact, (why is it that when they upgrade your rental they don’t downgrade the fuel charge?) and I found it very nice. GM has learned a lot in the last 15 years.
You are correct and it was mostly a conscious decision due to a few factors:
1. Allison drove the LC about 80% of the time and I drove the Tahoe about 80% of the time.
2. We did not have them at the same time, there was at least 2 years between them.
3. The LC we bought relatively new and with low mileage for around $30k, the Tahoe was relatively old for $5k, however both were in excellent (I’d say almost identical) condition.
4. New their prices were also quite different, the LC would have been close to $50K, the Tahoe about $37K. But yes, both were new in showrooms at the same time.
5. So, all that being said – Sizewise they are look and feel quite similar. The Chevy is certainly solid and built tough. The LC if anything even more so, BUT with a greater level of refinement that is evident the first time you compare the outside and especially the interior materials. I’d say that generation LC’s interior fit, finish and materials were not built comparably by GM until the 2007 generation of Tahoe/Suburban (is that GMT900?), but in all fairness the GM entry was always MUCH cheaper, by that time the Sequoia kind of took over the mass-market for Toyota and was more comparable. The Tahoe was also of a generation at least 10 years older than the Toyota development-wise. From a driving perspective the Tahoe has more grunt off the line but is more of a cruiser, the LC drives a bit more taut if that makes sense.
Which would I rather have – Cost No Object: LandCruiser. But if cost IS an object (and it usually is, especially buying used) then probably the Tahoe. Repair and Longevity wise I’d guess they are similar long term, i.e. you can probably make either last forever, the GM will probably need more attention sooner but it will be cheaper and easier to maintain. Usability-wise they are essentially identical with the exception of the 3rd row in the LC.
I looked at a new LandCruiser at the LA Auto Show a few weeks ago and would not buy it new over a Sequoia. The LC stickered over 80k. The Sequoia was over 30K less and comparable to Tahoe/Suburban. I could not see where the extra money went for the LC over the Sequoia. But I do see them around here, clearly some people will spend more just to spend more and get greater exclusivity I guess. Mine is the last generation that I think you will see off-road though, (in the US at least).
I also agree that the newer Tahoe/Suburban (the one just now being replaced) is extremely nice and I would have no trouble owning one…
That generation also had leaf springs and drum brakes at least in the rear which contributed to it’s very rough ride.
I gotta say I’m not a fan of these and their ilk for a number of reasons. Chief among them, that they were just another way for fat and lazy Detroit to deal with CAFE regs. While the Japanese and Koreans were upping the game as to what could be done with efficiency and the family sedan, Detroit decided to take the easy way out and convince families they needed one of these as their day to day vehicle. Second, the 2 box shape is boring, there’s only so much you can do with it and they’re pretty much interchangeable except for grilles. End of rant.
Silly Americans you do not need an SUV to live in the suburbs unless you go off roading on the weekends or need a 4×4/All Wheel Drive. Where I grew up people were too poor and/or sensible to buy SUVs unless they needed one until we caught up with the times and by then the Japanese, Koreans, and Europeans were building them and that is what many people bought instead. Not surprised you met another Californian in Colorado, they call it Californication for a reason and that is why I went to Oregon instead where rent is cheaper.
Personally I rather have a stripper model Suburban and use it like a truck or a Caprice Estate 1A2 and use it like a car/truck than bother with a Tahoe. I have ridden in 3 stripper model Suburbans and l like the vast interior space, the vinyl bench seats, the long hood, barn doors, and the looks. Suburbans are good vehicles for hauling farm supplies or building supplies and nearly anyone can fix them. They are even tolerable with no Air Conditioning during a Dixie Summer. Pity GM could not build cars as good as they built SUVs; hope that has changed.
Not really sure if I should respond but I will anyway…I dunno, when I was a kid growing up in Germany I remember being in the back of a car racing down the Autobahn without seatbelts or anything, no car seats required. Nowadays there are not many cars available that can hold 3 car seats side by side. So a Minivan or SUV is required for many families. Even if you only have 1 or 2 kids constantly bending over and adjusting belts etc in a lower car is a (literal) pain. It becomes a convenience thing.
For people that have (or feel they have) a genuine need for 4WD/AWD there is only one minivan available, the Sienna. Much more choice in the SUV arena. I will happily admit I did not NEED 4WD when I got the Tahoe. I did get a lot of great car for very little money though…
Plenty of Californian’s here but there are probably even more in Oregon…That being said, the people here (or there) that are from CA are there for a reason, that being that it is NOT CA. It makes for a different mindset. (and nothing against Californians, on the whole the people are great and I think it is a wonderful place to visit nowadays). I do recall that when we were looking to move and checked out a bunch of places the people that tend to not want you are the people that are from the same place you are from…NOT the natives, they are generally happy to have someone overpay for their old house!
Americans don’t need SUV’s in the suburbs and they don’t need Corvette’s either. They don’t need M5’s or A8’s or LS460’s either. But it sure is nice to live in a society where people are allowed to buy whatever they WANT, rather than having to settle for what they NEED.
+1 Bravo!
A friend of mine says that taking his grandkids anywhere, with their seats and all the other baby crap (2 year old fraternal twins with iffy bowel control) is more stressful than taking his 3 big dogs to the vet, with them bouncing off the inside of his Suburban. The dogs are more cooperative, most of the time, and if he had to take the seats in and out like he did when they were infants, he would just refuse to take them anywhere. His last car was a big Benz and was a huge hassle to do anything with those car seats. Between the seats and their “gear”, hauling babies is a huge hassle. At least the Sub has the room to take the dogs and the kids at the same time. And the Sub is 10X less likely to be in the shop than the Benz was. Time will solve all the kid issues, he doesn’t think there will be any more grandchildren, at least he hopes not. Eight really is enough.
Another point is that the market has largely migrated over to CUV’s, although I did see a lot of new Tahoes running around during our US trip – probably owned by the same sort of “cost is not that important” people who drive new Land Cruisers in Australia at $85k for a GXL.
Do not sweat it, I am not being opinionated and somewhat annoying.
also, can someone explain to me the difference between the barn doors and lift gate? Some people are fervent followers of each of he choices and I see a good mix of the two around. Is it an agricultural thing?
I obviously had the lift gate but the barn doors make it MUCH easier to take something out of the back. I do remember having to clamber literally into the thing to reach luggage or stuff from Costco runs sometimes. It’s even worse in a Suburban. Not that having tons of cargo space is a bad thing, not at all, but once the liftgate is down all of a sudden you have another two feet to reach over…
There is a reason that all vans are either barn doors (large vans) or full-length lift doors (minivans).
Conversely, the liftgate is nice when transporting long objects, you can raise the top (glass) portion and stick your lumber or whatever out over the top (as if it were a pickup truck). With Barn doors you can’t obviously.
It’s relatively rare to see a Tahoe with barn doors (but I do think it was an option) but on Suburban’s, especially of this vintage, it is much more common to see.
I think driving with barn doors would annoy me having something in the middle of the rear view mirror but I guess I would get used to it over time.
The Chevy Astro van had it both ways with barn door bottoms and a lift top (glass) area. I always liked that arrangement.
cool. My neighbor has a ’96 Yukon with barn doors.
How did they get the tail light guards on with barn doors?
A friend of mine has a blue Tahoe he bought new in 1998, it’s been a great vehicle, It has over 300,000 miles on it now, and it’s going to be gone soon, the rust is beyond bad, but it still drives great. It’s needed a couple water pumps, a trans at 200K, and of course, intake manifold gaskets at about 125K. He did them himself, saving a lot of money. The engine has never had the heads off. The horrible factory stereo thankfully died just about the day after the warranty ran out, giving him a good excuse to put in a much better aftermarket head unit. I had thought that no factory stereo could be worse sounding, until I bought my 2000 Sierra, which had the worst stereo I’ve ever heard, going back to the early 60’s in my mom’s New Yorker, that one was bad, deaf on AM and FM, but sounded 10X better than the Sierra’s POS. It wasn’t just my truck, I knew several people with GM trucks from that era and that stereo was just plain rotten sounding.
I had an ’82 K5 Blazer, most trouble free vehicle I’ve ever had. Four years, about 50K, and the only issues it had was a piece of trim on the passenger side above your head handle came off about the third day we had it, and it blew a headlight in 1983, that’s it. It went all over the country, off road a couple of times and was just great. The only complaint I had was the 305 in it was weak.
Anyone had any experience with the new generation of Tahoe/Suburban (2007-present)? I remember when they came out the press was raving at how GM had improved them. I have not driven one or even sat in one so I am wondering how they compare to the previous two generations.
I had a co-worker that had bought one new and he complained bitterly at what a “POS” it was. His list was pretty lengthy and included at least one transmission. The only consolation was that the truck was still under warranty and all the repairs had been covered.
I’ve owned three full sized Chevy/GMC vans, a Cheyenne pick up, and my current GMC Safari. While they were not the most refined vehicles I’ve owned, they have been reasonably reliable and cheap to repair.
I’ve driven a few GMT900 trucks and Tahoes. They drive like GM vehicles – somewhat ponderous, but decent ride and handling for what they are, and Tahoes in particular offer immeasurably superior handling compared with the Expedition despite the latter’s IRS.
As for fit and finish, it’s mostly “typical” GM. This generation uses some of the thinnest sheetmetal ever on a domestic vehicle, and is more vulnerable to door dings than anything weighing close to three tons should be. Exterior trim pieces are also very thin and cheap, and the adhesives are prone to separating from the metal early. Inside, the interior design is leaps-and-bounds ahead of the previous generations, though there are still obvious signs of cost-cutting. Everything looks okay, but none of the materials really stand up to close scrutiny when you touch them. (The SUVs use GM’s “luxury” truck interior and dashboard, that are very carlike; they also had a clunkier “work” spec on the trucks that looked more like the GMT800 interior.)
Keep in mind that the GMT900s were developed and produced in the years immediately prior to GM’s collapse, when development dollars and worker morale were at their lowest points since the 1970s. It’s kind of amazing the products are as decent as they are, though as such it isn’t surprising to hear these have some problems. I understand the bugs had been largely worked out by 2010, and a friend has a 2011 Tahoe that’s been trouble free through 50,000 miles.
Apart from styling, the new 2014 models look rather appealing for the segment.
I notice that on some of the GMT900s the black coating on some of the radio buttons wears off exposing the plastic’s natural green color. I have seen one or two 07+ Tahoes in SoCal that had some UV damage to their black paint on their hood and roof.
Late to the party, but I could not pass on commenting here. I sometimes feel like the only person in my extended family who has not owned one of these (or a Suburban) of this generation. In the 90s-00s, it seems that almost every one of my relatives or inlaws owned at least one. I was the stubborn oddball with the Ford Club Wagon.
Virtually all of them treated their owners well over a long period of time. My sister bought a new Tahoe of this generation. I recall asking her why she did not opt for the Suburban for the extra room. She liked the smaller size but later told me that I was right, after they traded the Tahoe for a Suburban.
Someone above said that this was the one market segment where GM was a genuine leader, and with a very good vehicle. I never understood how Ford and Chrysler never quite figured this segment out. This is one of the few modern GM vehicles that I would have no trouble whatsoever owning.
I recently purchased a 1997 Chevy Tahoe LT for 3500 bucks. Best money I ever spent. I felt like I had been waiting for this car all of my life from the instant I first drove it. Smooth cruising is the norm, great transmission, shifts smoothly and at lower RPMS. The 4WD HI and LO are activated with a push-button, and work smoothly. The power is amazing. The town mileage sucks, but I average about 16-17 on the highway. I need to get it painted, as the paint has fine cracks all over it, a common problem with these. I am going to get it painted, as I simply love this vehicle. I would still drive the “hoe” even if I won the lottery. ‘Nuff Said.
Nice rig. Right color too. Always beautiful in white.
In my opinion the MK1 is the best looking Tahoe ever, by far.