The only way the 330-odd photos of foreign-made CCs I gathered over the past couple of months was to split them three ways: yesterday’s German chapter, today’s British/French/Italian cars, and finally American/rest of the world, which we will see tomorrow. But this second batch is a tad bigger than the others. So let’s kick things off in style with a Series 1 XJ6!
It took me quite a while, but I’m finally coming round to the XJS.
The reason why it took me a while to appreciate the XJS is because of the XK8 (and of course the E-Type.) I remember, when these sensuous machines first appeared in the late ‘90s, how outdated and gauche the XJS seemed by comparison. First impressions last a long time.
For whatever reason, most of the XJ40 saloons I’ve seen about Tokyo are branded as Daimlers.
That includes this extremely well-kept LWB model. I’m not usually too keen on XJ40s, but this was a pretty exceptional one!
Just because CC’s own Jim Klein has purchased one recently, here’s a couple of X-Type wagons. Your choice of bone-stock white…
…or a somewhat souped up black one? Ah, the agony of choice.
Who’s up for some classic Range Rovers? Yes, that a plural…
This white beauty in VandenPlas trim is missing a bit of its rear bumper, sadly. And it lacks the cool V8 badge (same as the one used on Rover saloons?) of the previous one.
Despite their reputation for fragility, these are real popular here – especially the later 4-door sort.
OK, excuse me as I have a bit of a Sprite moment here. We’ve seen this car before – it’s a 1959 model, according to the owner.
But when I wrote it up, I did not have that many pictures to go along with it. Situation well and truly reversed.
I even saw it a second time a few weeks later. It never rains, then it pours. Typical British roadster weather.
Let’s keep it Austin for a spell with a lovely pair of Mini Countryman, i.e. the woodie wagon variant.
There are a number of these about. I have caught a similar one (with a Morris badge) recently for a more thorough CC viewing. Watch this mini space.
This one looked pure ‘70s – the colour, the Leyland badge, etc. Nice to see some folks like these, too.
I guess this lovely VandenPlas Princess 1300 might as well be parked in this BMC-friendly area. Again, I was fortunate enough to find another one recently, so you can expect to see a post about it sometime.
I regularly see a pair of Routemasters around central Tokyo on weekends. They don’t seem to be ferrying any passengers though: they are just used as mobile advert billboards. Not that great from an ecological standpoint.
Of course, the same could be said of many vehicles in this post. Even splendid and far more modern ones like the Aston Martin Rapide.
Slightly older and rarer, but certainly not prettier: a 1999-2005 TVR Tuscan Speed Six. Please pardon the blurry photo (call it “artistic”…)
The Bristol 406 we’ve seen before made its way back to the business end of my smartphone camera. Strangely, the TVR Tuscan and this Bristol seem to have a curious kinship, from this angle.
The plot thickens: the Bristol / R-R collector that has been a great source of top-notch CC fodder has a new toy: a Bristol 410, one of 80-odd produced in 1968-69. Fingers crossed, this gem will come out of its cave and allow itself to be photographed someday.
Two notable Rollers in this edition – both blue, coincidentally. Starting with this Silver Spur.
And this rather loud Phantom Drophead. Even the wheels have blue accents! But the best Brit wasn’t blue, in this instance, but light grey.
‘Twas a balmy Sunday evening in May, near Asakusa, when I glimpsed the characteristic gleam of a slatted grille calling out from the darkness of a rather large private garage. I peeked inside; not only was the place deserted, but a gigantic Hooper-bodied Bentley S1 was ready to pose for CC posterity.
Strong contender for my find of the year. Let’s see in six months….
Back on planet Earth, a cute Morris Minor ute.
And a Minor 1000 saloon, for good measure, that was rusting peacefully right next to (how smooth is that transition?)…
…a very blue and very presentable (yet seemingly very dead) Renault 5 GT Turbo!
There was a bumper crop of classic Renaults. Let’s start with a little Renault 4 next to an R32 Skyline, as an appetizer. Is there anything more Tokyo than that picture?
I stumbled upon this nest of lozenge-badged vehicles (plus a yellow Peugeot 106 in the back there) – but the place was a bit busy. I made a mental note to return there in the early morning to take a closer look at my leisure.
It did not disappoint. This Renault 5 Alpine, though definitely dead, was a highlight. These were one of the original hot hatches (1.4 litre 92hp hemi engine, mated to a 5-speed) when they came out in 1976.
Nearby was this splendid black five-door GTL. These higher-trim models have a 1.3 litre producing 42hp only – the Alpine version really was the hottest. But this one is almost classy!
The five-door body only joined the range in 1979 – seven years into the R5’s career. The GTL version was sold from MY 1980 to 1984. Cannot recall the last time I saw one this nice!
The Twingo was kind of a reinvention of the R5 for the ‘90s. They never devised a RHD version for these, but in Japan, that just adds to the prestige factor. Now that I know a bit about the Honda Today though, the Twingo’s design doesn’t seem quite as advanced as all that.
The Renault’s 4-cyl. engine and slightly bigger dimensions do render it more user-friendly than the 550cc Today, though. Which probably explains why I run into quite a few of them around Tokyo. It’s cute, it’s small, it’s chic – like a French Mini, with better suspension.
Those present-day Alpines are really something. Best-looking French car of the ‘20s?
Well, it’s time to slow things down to a 600cc flat-twin’s cruising speed and examine some 2CVs.
This one was located nearby the W112 Mercedes coupé discussed a little while back. Talk about opposite ends of the spectrum!
This one was making full use of the soft top, which enables it to transport oversized objects with relative ease, weather permitting.
Finally, one that’s not seen action in quite a while. Snailed to the ground.
The other Citroëns I caught this spring, aside from an exceptional trio that will have its own post shortly, were Types H. Food trucks are as popular here as anywhere else, and the Type H is ideally suited for the job. Here we have a later model (mid-‘70s, I reckon) – the most commonly seen of the lot, logically.
Here’s a much older model (pre-1964), as evidenced by the long chevrons and the split windscreen.
Still running into the odd C6. And it’s still a shape that I find attractive.
A couple Peugeot cabriolets to polish off the Frenchies? Who can resist a sweet little 205 soft-top? This is a series 2 car (1990–1994), in the requisite dark green. T87 approves.
But then check out this 306: genuine 4-seater, leather seats, power top – all pretty well preserved too, given it’s all 20-plus years old and built by Pininfarina in Turin. Oh, I feel another transition coming!
Yes, it’s time for the Grand Finale – the Italian cars. Warning: there were a lot. And they were sublime, like this Maserati 3200GT.
OK, I exaggerated a bit. Nobody ever accused the Fiat Multipla of being sublime. The epithets that come to mind include odd, misshapen, ugly and… practical, I guess?
We’ve seen this little red number before. I’m not 100% sure how genuine its Abarth credentials are, but it sure looked peppy.
Despite all the mods, this one has no Abarth badges per se, but the name is embossed and painted into something adjacent to the exhaust. Nice touch!
Another Fiat Punto cabriolet sighted! But the absolute Fiat di tutti Fiati was the one below, no contest.
I hadn’t seen an X1/9 in ages – very impressive and stunningly beautiful, compared to most wedges.
But while we’re on the subject, let’s keep it on the origami side while we look at Ferraris. There were a lot of sightings, starting with this 328 GTB…
And this GTS. Because one 328 just wasn’t enough.
OK, it says “Dino” on the front, but it still belongs here, right? Right?
The last Ferraris that still look kind of interesting (to my eye) are now pushing 20, like this 360…
Or the 612 Scaglietti; impressively restrained, compared to what they’re doing these days. Incidentally, the PF designer who is credited with creating the 612 is Ken Okuyama, who was born and still lives in Tokyo.
But really, for Ferraris as for most cars, the older the better. Anyone fancy a red head, by the way?
I’ve seen a few late ‘90s Lancia Ypsilons, as well as present-day ones (though some wear a Chrysler badge), but this is my first 2nd generation (2003-11) Ypsilon encounter.
Far more substantial first Tokyo sighting: the mighty Thema (1984-94), the last successful big Lancia. These were marketed via Autozam dealerships in Japan back in the early ‘90s.
And of course, the obligatory Delta HF Integrale.
No Lamborghinis to report, unfortunately, so we’ll just have to end this post on the Alfa Romeos. Many interesting ones cropped up, thankfully. Starting with the FWD GTVs.
There was an early model Twin Spark in silver. Everything looked fine, but that Alfa Romeo badge lost a bit of its surface. I thought that only happened to BMW roundels.
Alternately, a radiant and melodious red coupé presented itself, packing the 3-litre V6. Your pick.
Such a shame that this Alfetta was hiding behind a gate and a pair of bicycles. It needs to be brought out, given a bit of TLC and admired!
Back in the early ’90s, I had a school friend whose father drove an Alfa 75, so this does stir up some dusty memories. Never cared for the looks, but that engine note is etched in my brain.
Again, the 155 is part of that peculiar ‘80s/’90s era of broken wedge Alfa saloons that I’m still not keen on. But hey, it’s still a classic. Right?
I like the 164 better, personally. And they’ve all disappeared from European roads by now, I bet. Same platform as the Lancia Thema (and the Saab 9000), by the way…
“Enough with all that prim and proper, mint-condition, over-restored nonsense, T87!” I hear you cry. “Give us some grime, some rust and some flat tyres!” Your wish, as always, is my command.
I wrote up the restored version of this car a couple years back. This one has more character and brings forth more emotions. What a waste, but what a shape!
So here’s a much better-looking GTV to see us off. We’ve earned it!
We’ll be looking at the US-made stuff, plus all the rest, in the final installment tomorrow. See you there.
With the combination of off the wall stuff and convertibles you find there, I halfway expect a Renault Alliance GTA convertible to show up in here sooner or later.
So many of these cars just beg the question “what are you doing here?” I love these sightings.
I’m guessing the Sprite driver is having more fun in traffic than the Ferrari driver behind him
Back in 1989 when I was working at a Cadillac dealership, we traded in a 1985 Jaguar XJ6 in silver with red leather. At that time, we still drove “demos” and mine had just been sold and they didn’t assign another new Buick to me yet. I always liked that free time to be able to choose a used car off the lot to drive home at random, and this was my chance to see what a Jaguar drove like. The manager was hesitant to allow me to take that car in fear it would break down, but he gave in and I was able to drive the Jag for a few nights. That started my love affair with them.
Over the years, I ended up buying two for a fun car: One was a well worn 1989 XJ6 in white with blue and no sunroof. It has some rust and small issues, but was cheap and ran well otherwise. One day the entire heater/AC system failed and I took it to a Jag dealer where they delivered me the bad news. Sitting out front was a freshly traded (and very nice) 1996 XJ6 in British Racing Green with tan hides. I worked out a deal and drove that car home. That was a great car. Over the years, I’ve looked as several more but never pulled the trigger. Now I look at the Jags today and feel a real loss from the days of fantastic style and grace. Everything today looks bland, lots of dark plastics inside and just no passion when I see one.
The highlights for me were the Renault 5s. Wow. That Hooper-bodied Bentley S1 is an amazing find for sure.
I’ve always been a big fan of the second-generation Dino, much more so than its predecessor and in fact significantly more so than any of the other Ferraris spotted this month. To my eyes its proportions and simplicity make the 328 (especially the GTS with its ill-aligned roofline) look somewhat busy and a bit too long and low. Some of that may be the camera angles, but it does stand out to me.
The FWD GTVs continue to have a face that would send an arachnophobe fleeing to the next county despite the rest of the car’s lithe appearance. I’m no arachnophobe myself, but it at least would have made me flee to a different dealership in the ’90s.
Also in my experience Saabs (especially the post-GM-takeover models) seem to have the highest rate of badge erosion.
I always liked the XJ/S, its one of those things that instilled in me at a young age not to succumb to peer pressure and things as asinine as generational identity because I have yet to meet one person in real life that doesn’t think they’re a mediocre Jaguar for vague reasons. The XK8 is the one I never warmed up to, its only E type connection is its more rounded bodywork but it looks like a bloated Miata, its proportions are all wrong and quite frankly the V8 replacing the inline 6 and V12 was just lame, I lose all interest in cars (and entire brands) when they shed engineering identity like they did, Jaguar today is just another luxury badge and that descent started with the XK8 as far as I’m concerned.
I never thought I would say this but the Fiat X1/9 has more visual appeal to me now than the Ferrari 308 GTS as far as 70s-80s Targa topped Italian sports cars go, I just adore the lines and packaging of it. I’ve seen a few in recent years, there was one parked in the street in my Mom’s neighborhood in Denver for a long time, and just recently spotted one in the same orange as it here at a Chicago area junkyard.
Liking Jaguars and thinking they (or any other car) are mediocre needn’t be mutually exclusive, both can be true 🙂
The Jaguar V8 is generally considered a good, generally reliable, long-lived and relatively low maintenance engine, things that could not be said of the two engines it replaced. Had Jaguar continued with the 6 and 12 they likely wouldn’t even be around anymore at all rather than being a somewhat interesting alternative to the German brands (as with Alfa for that matter). It’s more than a little ironic that you say you lose interest in cars and brands when they shed their engineering identity considering your Mercury though! 🙂
My Cougar is a rear wheel drive V8 powered unibody personal luxury coupe just like the original, Its not the same engineering as 1967 but its most certainly an evolution of it, the MN12 platform even uses strut rods like the Falcon platform cars did. Not like the later Contour based Cougars, which yes, I have zero interest in.
I’m not suggesting Jaguar should have continued the use of their V12 or ancient inline 6, but that if they were developing an engine from scratch they should have stuck with what they’re known for, not a 90* V8. That seemed like some interference from Dearborn fueled that decision.
Personally I value this stuff far more than a badge and a grille on an otherwise similarly engineered vehicle to its competitors when it comes to “interesting alternatives”. You should know, Tesla had become an “interesting alternative” to the establishment luxury brands by having an engineering identity literally nobody else had when they hit the scene, that will always be the brand’s heritage, even as the competition ultimately copies and homogenizes EV propulsion. Here’s a hypothetical on that note; lets just fantasize that climate change is solved, a truly clean alternative fuel discovered, whatever… would you be as interested in a Tesla model, or hold the same value for the Tesla brand as a whole, if they put out an ICE model in light of that?
While I have ICE cars and will likely continue to be using and buying them for the near-term future to fulfill some of our needs, internal combustion is a dead end no matter if the fuel is as clean as water, irrespective of the label on the trunk. It’s simply an inelegant solution with far too many losses in the process comparatively speaking, better solutions have been proven. There’s no point in dealing with hypotheticals, why would I ever want more moving parts to go wrong over fewer in order to achieve the same result? The main hurdles to EV adoption have been mostly overcome (from a technical viewpoint), at least for what I need our main car to do for us, the rest of it is improving every day.
Manufacturers (all “mass’ manufacturers) are figuring this out, any of them still protesting this are doing so only because they for whatever reason have not yet been able to figure it out completely and are behind the industry leaders to various degrees.
There is MUCH more to offering a good EV than figuring out how to plug a battery into a motor.
Ford buying and owning Jaguar for a time is probably the best thing that ever happened to Jaguar as far its long term future was/is concerned. Ford buying Jaguar is just as probably not one of the best things that ever happened to Ford though…As with most of the car industry worldwide, 99% of the ownership likely doesn’t care, know, or care to know much if anything about that noisy thing under their hood.
So that’s a no then? 😉
No, please don’t put words in my mouth or make assumptions, I’m still not quite sure what exactly the point of yours that you were attempting to make was.
While it’s an asinine scenario on the face of it and there’s no good reason to literally go backward (which may be what you’re proposing?) I think my published car buying history speaks for itself in that I’m neither any company’s devout fanboi nor do I or have I limit(ed) myself to only those products of any one manufacturer or any one propulsion system. The proof would have to be in the pudding, so to say. Bring it and I’ll decide. Change and progress is good, you should try it sometime, anything else is just so…limiting. But to each their own I guess. I’ve actually shown myself to be open to any possibility and yes I’ve tried broccoli 🙂
Climate change solutions DO exist and electric power CAN (and in many places, is) be completely clean – Solar, Wind, Hydro, Wave etc. So that’s already happened. Now it’s just down to actually implementing those solutions, building on them, advancing them, and of course first getting heads out of the sand. A man got put on the moon 53 years ago, then the country that did so let a couple of tragic setbacks take the wind out of the sails for good. Now the country that did so is PAYING the man who popularized Tesla to also take the newest generations of astronauts and space cargo into space and to develop and build the equipment to go back to the moon along with managing that mission. What happened there? But since that’s the case, there’s also no way we are going to develop a 100% clean internal combustion fuel, again there’s no will. But an alternative exists and is growing.
I’m not proposing anything, that’s you putting words in my mouth. Teslas engineering identity is quite clearly BEV propulsion, my question to you was very simple; would you be as interested in that brand if they were for any reason to deviate from that? (Doesn’t even have to be back to ICE, could hypothetically be hydrogen fuel cell or hybrid or whatever)
Me personally, I’d say no, because that’s not how I know the Tesla brand, and that’s how I feel about post-Ford Jaguar. I mean it’s not like a 90° V8 was exactly the no brainer progressive engine choice for Jaguar in the 1990s, at that time the buying public was quite accepting of inline six cylinder power in the luxury field, just look at BMW.
I don’t mean to go all philosophical but since you brought it up I value variety more than progress, I don’t consider variety limiting. Progress on the other hand tends to have a destructive and/or homogenizing effect when left unchecked.
“Here’s a hypothetical on that note; lets just fantasize that climate change is solved, a truly clean alternative fuel discovered, whatever…”
That sentence of yours I was referring to is the very definition of a proposal. One proposes a hypothetical, that’s how it works.
“Progress on the other hand tends to have a destructive and/or homogenizing effect when left unchecked.”
Lol, wut? Who “checks” it? Come on, gimme a break. It isn’t 1950 anymore.
Tesla simply chose to pursue battery electric as it seemed to them to provide the best and easiest return, accomplishing what it needed to and proving to the world that an alternative can exist if a maker chooses to sit down and do it. Tesla has never been about taking over the automotive world, their mission has been to encourage others and other manufacturers to embrace and develop BEV technology rather than the ultimately destructive dead end of ICE power in vehicles.
Back to your (non?)proposal:
Hybrid technology, as the term is commonly accepted in relation to motor vehicles, USES internal combustion as an essential part of its solution. So clearly a no-go for Tesla, again, moving completely backward.
Hydrogen would seem to be the next most elegant solution and, at its root, IS ALSO AN EV, just not one powered by stored energy in a battery, rather it generates its own power onboard while emitting some warm air and water. It uses electric motors rather than a combustion engine (maybe you’re thinking of Natural Gas powered engines, been there done that too, not fundamentally different than gasoline). Tesla’s all in on batteries and has built a very workable charging infrastructure from scratch which may well end up being their most enduring legacy. Those slagging it don’t know what they don’t know, as usual. Tesla’s not about to start all over again doing the same thing with Hydrogen, although if history is any guide, nobody else will either, preferring to (just like with battery charging) let their customers deal with crappy third party “solutions”, higher than necessary costs, and sub-par systems integration and then, to the benefit of all (sarcasm alert!!!) push for and let the government be involved to make it work for everyone! The last time the government got involved with providing “fuel” for transportation (i.e. most of the 20th and much of the 21st century so far), it resulted in thousands (tens of thousands? hundreds of thousands?) deaths and massive destruction amongst other things, all paid for by the public, drivers and non-drivers alike. But it any case Hydrogen is perhaps the next most viable possibility if they were to decide that batteries aren’t the way to go. And if so, then sure, why wouldn’t I consider it? I’m not bound to some or any “tradition”. Shit, I’d seriously consider a Jaguar EV if it were up to the bar. I’ve spoken highly of the Mustang Mach-E as well as the E-Mini after driving them rather than just being dismissive of their visuals or name. But more importantly, no maker is actually bound to those traditions as well. Sooner or later (probably sooner) the regular Mustang is going to go bye-bye too, but before it goes it may well get its most powerful motor yet. Most likely an electric one!
But what else is there to consider, steam? Onboard nuclear? Mind power?
All things considered though and getting back to the base conversation, the engine in your Focus is probably more “Ford roots” seeing as the Model T had an I-4 rather than the “progress” shown by Ford’s use of a V8, a configuration which they hardly invented, having been patented some 28 years earlier. In France to boot, a country not renowned for their embrace of V8 powahhhhh in their motor vehicles. Were you around in 1932 you probably would have considered a Ford with a V8 heresy as well, just like you seem to with Jaguar in 1997, after all, it wasn’t part of their “legend”.
I think we are done here, thanks for playing…
Yeesh, is that the part of the sentence that you’re that hung up on to write out that diatribe? The part I literally added in last second because I wasn’t trying to NOT open up can of worms about the socio-political baggage attached to these methods of propulsion and just wanted to focus on the brand and what the brand itself is about? This…
“Here’s a hypothetical on that note; would you be as interested in a Tesla model, or hold the same value for the Tesla brand as a whole, if they put out an ICE model?”
…Was the root question. Sorry, proposal, whatever way you want to put it. Simply a hypothetical analogy to a brand doing something out of character and how would you feel about it if they did.
I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree with the importance of brand tradition/legacy. For me I can acknowledge that yes Ford is responsible for Jaguar still being with us today, but I will argue that Jaguar’s name and legacy is what truly saved Jaguar and afforded the company to rest on its laurels in the several years before finding an interested suitor, in a way a less beloved brand couldn’t. 20 years from now though when nobody living could recite Jaguar’s racing history and what made a Jaguar a Jaguar after the engineering becomes little different than any other BEV CUV that will presumably be the only shape offered on the roads? We shall see how well that progress alone keeps the brand alive.
And I have a Mercury, the original Mercury was V8 powered;) It’s not about who invented what, it’s about who embraced something and became recognized for it., like the Ford V8, like rear engines in Porsches, like Vtec in Hondas etc.
I don’t know but here’s the difference: You definitely seem to be making the argument that there is no or you can see no difference in engineering between one BEV and another or at least that’s how I am reading it. That is simply incorrect. Just because it does not interest you does not mean there aren’t significant and tangible differences between them. You do the same with CUVs purely because they do not interest you. And a CUV EV, oh boy, that’s a witches brew right there, better lock up your chickens before Lisa Bonet comes and makes a voodoo sacrifice!!!
To put it another way, that’s what the average person (not the average gearhead) on the street might say if asked the difference between V8 engines from different manufacturers or to a greater degree between different sports cars etc. “There’s no difference, they are all the same or at the very least completely interchangeable” is how I might expect someone to answer and with zero ability (and desire or need to try) to explain any single difference. But cars aren’t their thing so that’s fine and expected.
To the other (your main) point, tradition only matters so much and for so long. Traditions are alright in a few limited cases, in others I believe they often produce a (let me check my notes here…) “destructive and/or homogenizing effect”, to borrow a phrase I saw somewhere recently 🙂 . For Jaguar it tapped out a little before they were sold, the baggage overcame the traditions, now they trade on a thin veneer of that “history”, good for them.
Successful makes though constantly do reinvent themselves and embrace progress to stay ahead of the times, not be a follower and fall further and further behind by standing still; at some point it becomes impossible to keep up or catch up. Ford fought it for a long time, then somehow made a leap to try to be at the forefront of EV tech. The jury is still out on how that’ll turn out for them. So far it’s a bit mixed, but probably better than GM and Stellantis are at this exact point, with Ford’s own internal issues likely their biggest baggage. If any of the three of them though were just to stay bound to their “traditions”, well, those “traditions” would become “history” along with the brand itself in short order.
In short I don’t care about some brand’s character, the only thing that matters to me is what that brand or thing or product can do for me. That’s as it should be since I’m paying for it and cars at the end of the day are consumables that I employ to mostly get me from point A to point B, not mythologize. Maybe I used to but not anymore. As I age I care less about the act of driving itself, it used to be fun all the time, now not so much, there are more important things. Note that I like the 64.5 -66 Mustang, I really like the early Shelbys, I can take or leave everything up to 1973, I find them kinda big yet claustrophobic really, the Mustang II is okay in some forms, the Fox Body as a “Mustang” is more or less objectively garbage in most any form bar (for me) the SVO and only the later LX 5.0 models (again for me), ’05 and up I like most of them beyond that they are less practical than they’ve ever been and lastly I believe naming the Mach-E a Mustang was a masterstroke of marketing for all the free publicity offset by the fact that some like my wife won’t own anything labeled a Mustang, it’s just not her thing which is too bad for Ford as I like the car a lot and by definition she is the target market for that car and it’s really the only Mustang I would realistically consider driving on a daily basis as opposed to just owning and waxing. (Yes, she has owned other Fords).
I don’t know but here’s the difference: You definitely seem to be making the argument that there is no or you can see no difference in engineering between one BEV and another or at least that’s how I am reading it. That is simply incorrect. Just because it does not interest you does not mean there aren’t significant and tangible differences between them. You do the same with CUVs purely because they do not interest you. And a CUV EV, oh boy, that’s a witches brew right there, better lock up your chickens before Lisa Bonet comes and makes a voodoo sacrifice!!!
To put it another way, that’s what the average person (not the average gearhead) on the street might say if asked the difference between V8 engines from different manufacturers or to a greater degree between different sports cars etc. “There’s no difference, they are all the same or at the very least completely interchangeable” is how I might expect someone to answer and with zero ability (and desire or need to try) to explain any single difference. But cars aren’t their thing so that’s fine and expected.
Well let me just say that’s definitely not the argument intended to make. I didn’t bring up BEV to debate it or slog it, just that it is intrinsically linked to Tesla’s brand identity. For Jaguar I firmly believe one of their big defining engineering traits before the Ford era were the inline 6 and V12, for better or worse. When they worked they were great feeling and sounding engines that added to the driving experience of those cars, the V8s had good qualities, but not particularly unique to Jags.
Just to lay it out, I don’t have any problem or really any remaining skepticism of EVs, do they tickle my fancy? Not really, but its not like I have an existential dislike of them, I’d replace the Focus with the right EV if the opportunity struck, I’m not exactly smitten by the modern ICE powerplants with turbochargers and 10 speed transmissions when it comes right down to it anyway, I like the simplicity factor of EVs quit a bit. CUVs, yes, I don’t like them. The EV part is the very last thing that I dislike about the Mustang Mach E.
To the other (your main) point, tradition only matters so much and for so long. Traditions are alright in a few limited cases, in others I believe they often produce a (let me check my notes here…) “destructive and/or homogenizing effect”, to borrow a phrase I saw somewhere recently 🙂 . For Jaguar it tapped out a little before they were sold, the baggage overcame the traditions, now they trade on a thin veneer of that “history”, good for them.
Successful makes though constantly do reinvent themselves and embrace progress to stay ahead of the times, not be a follower and fall further and further behind by standing still; at some point it becomes impossible to keep up or catch up. Ford fought it for a long time, then somehow made a leap to try to be at the forefront of EV tech. The jury is still out on how that’ll turn out for them. So far it’s a bit mixed, but probably better than GM and Stellantis are at this exact point, with Ford’s own internal issues likely their biggest baggage. If any of the three of them though were just to stay bound to their “traditions”, well, those “traditions” would become “history” along with the brand itself in short order.
Well there’s progress and there’s trendiness, the Jaguar V8 is case in point, it was certainly a reinvention of what Jag had been known for from the I6 and troublesome V12, but was a 90* V8 in the mid 1990s really progress? Given the wake of many other DOHC V8s of the era it seems like it was following a trend(see homogenizing), but it was a technological dead end in the grand scheme of things. When they were reinvented with these new engines its not like the lineup changed, if anything the styling actually went a more backward retro direction, the XJ/S was a much more out of character design for Jaguar upon release than anything through most of the the Ford era.
Slight tangent, ironically it occurs to me when Ford also owned Aston Martin they used the Duratec V6 as a basis for their V12, which is funny because up to that point Aston Martin had reinvented themselves into a V8 company…and the DB7 with said engine was derived from the XJ/S
I don’t know if I can agree that successful makes are constantly reinventing themselves, I’d argue successful makes don’t have to and when they do you wouldn’t notice a major change occurred. When I think of makes, or brands in this case, reinventing themselves the first one that inevitably pops into mind is Cadillac, constantly chasing the elusive target brand they’ve modeled themselves after to little avail and trying again with the next hottest make in the industry.
In short I don’t care about some brand’s character, the only thing that matters to me is what that brand or thing or product can do for me. That’s as it should be since I’m paying for it and cars at the end of the day are consumables that I employ to mostly get me from point A to point B, not mythologize. Maybe I used to but not anymore. As I age I care less about the act of driving itself, it used to be fun all the time, now not so much, there are more important things. Note that I like the 64.5 -66 Mustang, I really like the early Shelbys, I can take or leave everything up to 1973, I find them kinda big yet claustrophobic really, the Mustang II is okay in some forms, the Fox Body as a “Mustang” is more or less objectively garbage in most any form bar (for me) the SVO and only the later LX 5.0 models (again for me), ’05 and up I like most of them beyond that they are less practical than they’ve ever been and lastly I believe naming the Mach-E a Mustang was a masterstroke of marketing for all the free publicity offset by the fact that some like my wife won’t own anything labeled a Mustang, it’s just not her thing which is too bad for Ford as I like the car a lot and by definition she is the target market for that car and it’s really the only Mustang I would realistically consider driving on a daily basis as opposed to just owning and waxing. (Yes, she has owned other Fords).
That’s you though, I’m certain your typical new Jaguar buyer holds some intangible desire to have a Jaguar, any Jaguar, beyond it being point a-b transportation, it’s still a luxury good as the brand exists today no matter what it’s powered by. Jaguar, BMW, Porsche, Mercedes, as a few brands, the Mustang, Corvette as a few models are mythologized by their own makers in their marketing. The Mach-E wouldn’t be called a Mustang without that mythologizing. Vehicles in this category to me are like owning expensive wristwatches, the act of wearing a watch in this day and age is an indulgence and many who are seem to desire a mechanical type movement turning the dials for the sake of it being more interesting, not just a battery powered quartz one even though that’s more reliable and accurate, analogous to a more conventional and efficient engine in a more mainstream car.
The reason Jaguar went with a V8 is all too obvious and logical: the Germans (Mercedes, BMW and Audi) had all gone to V8s for their higher-power offerings. A six would have been too weak, both literally and image-wise. A V12 instead of a V8 would have made the whole line too heavy, expensive and thirsty, and unlike the Germans, Jaguar could not afford a V12 and a V8.
Frankly, the overwhelming majority of Jaguar buyers couldn’t have cared less about its I-6 heritage. They were buying styling; inside and out, and as long as it had plenty of effortless power, who cared?
A V8 was light, short and cheap; there’s a reason it became the dominant engine configuration for so long.
As to Matt’s original question about that hypothetical situation, in the first place, that hypothetical reality is so utterly removed from reality, and so much of our reality has been increasingly shaped by AGW, that it’s not really possible to answer readily.
But nevertheless, given that the name “Tesla” refers to the greatest genius of electricity, it seems rather absurd to even ask the question if Tesla would build an IC car. Would Stanley Steamer have built an IC car? Would Detroit Electric have built an IC car?
Of course not, to all of them. In each case, the impetus for the founders was to build a car with what they felt was the clearly superior propulsion system. And of course, electricity is the obviously superior system, due to its profoundly greater efficiency (~90% instead of 20-40%), There’s a good reason electric cars outsold IC cars in the early years of the car. And why owners kept their electrics for decades because they were superior city cars.
Once li-ion batteries were invented, the issue with EVs was on the way to being solved. And there’s no going back now; all the manufacturers have committed vast numbers of billions to switch to EVs. The die is cast, in the Megapress.
@Jim Klein – Considering the AJ16 straight six is the most reliable and stout engine jaguar ever made, its kind of weird for you to claim the V8 that replaced it was more reliable, considering it is known to have been the complete opposite for many years before they ironed out the kinks.
Going for a V8 was a good choice for the marketing though, as V8’s are a very likeable and popular engine configuration, especially in the American market, where l6’s historically are considered a steep down.
Personally i went for a straight six x300 generation instead of the later V8 x308 ones when i bought an XJR a couple of years ago – it was just more characterful and special feeling then its V8 replacement, even if it was slightly down on power.
I believe we were more discussing the prior I-6 and the V12, not the AJ16, which was probably a little tarnished just by its association, rather than perhaps the reality. Without delving into it more it’s a little odd that it had such a short lifespan though, as you say, sometimes marketing is a big part of it, times change. Who would have ever though that Jaguar would also embrace diesels? Crazy stuff. Enjoy your XJR, lovely car.
Jaguars, I must avert my eyes and harden my heart.
I come for the car pictures, I stay for Tatra’s captions. Always enjoyable, thanks.
Nice, A Rootes group collector I know has a folding top Pug that wears Rapier badges no thats not why he bought it could be later than that 306, A good crop of Europeans possibly more than I see here on a normal day,
I did see a similar Aston Martin recently its hard to know I recognised the grill behind me at the Tahuna roundabout but once thru it the Aston was gone just tailights disappearing into the darkness.
That Bentley would be a rarity anywhere on the planet, lovely car,
Late Citroen C6s turn up for sale here but I rarely see them in the wild, Keep em coming looking forward to the US crop when it shows up
Once again, what a feast. And there’s more tomorrow!
Oh to be in Tokyo now that CC-time is there!
If anyone else needs some eyewash after seeing that poor Routemaster, here you go.
I know what I like here and so does T87, good man!. Mine splits the difference of the boring white and black with a lively gray. Uh, I mean grey. I’ll report here that Jaguar has well and truly licked any remaining vestiges of rumored British electronic unreliability, at least as far as the Check Engine lightbulb is concerned, merrily re-illuminating itself yet again earlier this week, and now clearly setting records for bulb life longevity! So it’s safe to run out and get your own if your worry about electronic foibles was keeping anyone on the sidelines…
This Fiat 500 Abarth ticks all the boxes for me. I’ve never been a fan of the 500 either old or new. However this specimen is so refined it’s changed my mind.
I always look forward to your posts from an alternate universe, but this week you’ve really hit it out of the park. Like a kid in a candy store, selecting favorites is a tough when there’s such an abundance of riches. Keep it coming!
I am constantly amazed at the pictures you get. From the street, from poking around every public parking garage, private backyards, and private garages. You must do a lot of walking and little driving.
I see older cars while driving so I can’t get pictures. I see some on the street but need to be unobtrusive in shooting them. I once took a shot towards a house from across the street where I pulled over. Before I even got to the second shot the owner ran out of the house yelling at me and challenging me to come over.Yikes! Only when I said I like to shoot old cars did his aggressive tone change and he told me some will be for sale if interested. That was weird…
The XJ6 (and, I guess, the D and E models) were proof enough for me that miracles can happen: Something comparable to seeing the Queen in a Bikini ? Thanks for leading with that Series 1.
As for your Italian selection, the X1/9 and that Dino would suit me just fine: mid-engine magic for the classes and the masses ?