(first posted 9/19/2014) We’ve showcased our fair share of Broughamy eBay finds here on CC, and the B-body has been a perennial favorite, either as a CC in the wild or when listed for sale. Rarely chiming in, though, I’ve decided to go ahead and share one I find especially charming. My favorite ’77-’90 B-bodies have tended to be wagons, but it’s the early coupes that possess the greatest visual interest, and as far as the different divisions’ models go, the Buicks tend to be my first choice, owing to their ornate dashboards and restrained exterior trim. When I remember how attractive the initial Pontiac variants were, on the other hand, it becomes a toss up.
Though lacking the Buick’s sporty shovel-nose exterior styling, edging more toward Brougham classicism, the early Pontiac’s interiors were decidedly more modern and tasteful and in my opinion, the best offered on the ’77-’90 B-body. The three-spoker is entirely appropriate here, and note this example’s full instrumentation with fuel economy minder (a Pontiac specialty in those days), a voltmeter, and oil pressure and temperature gauges.
While the Pontiac didn’t get the Chevy’s snazzy backlight, it at least got the Buick’s faster C-pillar and not the Olds’s overly formal quarter window treatment. In fact, the Olds full-sizers, which I felt were the most attractive from 71-76, became the least attractive from 77 on, gaining a truckish bluntness about the front clip and dashboard.
But I digress. If my favorite B-bodies of this era are the Pontiac and the Buick, then this Landau coupe is right up my alley. As a loaded 49-state model with the optional 5.7, this car was given a Buick engine (Californians with a need for speed got an Olds 5.7, while those in high-altitude locales were given a Pontiac 5.7).
With Buick’s 350 having the smallest bore and longest stroke, it’s quite an appropriate engine for its mission in this Broughamy Pontiac. Many of us forget that the better Malaise era V8s still delivered torque in daily driving; sure, the cars weren’t fast, often not able to top 100 miles per hour, but they could waft about with the A/C on under a full load of passengers and cargo. With 155 horsepower and 280 lb-ft of torque at 1,800 rpm propelling about 3,800 pounds, take-offs in this Landau were most certainly brisk even if performance rapidly tapered off thereafter. Top speed runs aside, there was enough silent thrust to imbue this indulgent coupe with genuine character and an ability to lay down a bit of rubber (and this car can in fact crack 100).
No, these vinyl seats aren’t ideal and cloth would be preferable, but this interior is otherwise loaded and perfect. Best to just get some seat covers and preserve what’s there if vinyl isn’t your thing. The car comes with a full variety of toys, including a CB radio, power split bench seats and an Astroroof!
The personal nature of this top-end coupe screams “daddy’s car.” Ma, I imagine, went about her duties in a Olds Custom Cruiser, or maybe even a Cutlass Cruiser.
It’s really a shame GM got rid of this dashboard’s tooling. While the Buick, with its silver-backed gauge faces and large analog clock were opulent, it was Pontiac who managed to pull off some semblance of sleekness, with hidden air registers and more complex contours on the dash’s upper molding. The less said about the Cadillac’s or Olds’s blocky dashes, the better. And just how expensive would it have been to put it back into production for the Parisienne or even–gasp–share it with an updated Caprice?
Here we see the CB radio, a more obvious example of society’s change in the years since this Pontiac rolled off the line. Imagine wanting to communicate with–or at least be aware of–other motorists. Quite a far cry from these days of road rage, the primary interruption of today’s drivers’ sequestration courtesy of now-obligatory, omnipresent infotainment systems. Pardon my cynicism, but features like this show just how comfortable we’ve become with isolating ourselves. On a more positive note, this Landau boasts a rare-in-Pontiacs auto climate control.
Lest you think the passenger was left out, there are power seat adjustments on the right side as well. I remember this solid switchgear, the same as that used in my father’s Audi 5000, quite well. Who needs a Cadillac with all these electric assists?
Certainly not anyone who can appreciate the chrome rocker panel trim and fender skirts. It’s a very cohesive look, despite all the tacked on ornamentation; over-accessorization can work if all the pieces match.
Those color-keyed Rallye wheels add a sporty touch, along with the aero mirrors, keeping the otherwise effete styling flourishes in check. All in all, this is one of the best faces put forth by the newly downsized GM fullsize lineup. Next to the competition offered up by Ford and Chrysler, the case for this loaded coupe was obvious. No wonder so many successful heads-of-household decided to mark their arrival with cars like this. When considering the automotive landscape of 1979, B-body coupes like this Bonneville were definite standouts. I’d surely choose one over the equivalent Thunderbird.
If I’ve successfully piqued your interest in this fine machine, take a gander at the eBay listing. The current bid is $7,500 and the reserve has not yet been met. The car was pulled off of eBay last week and just recently re-listed (I assume because the buyer didn’t get the expected pay out). After seeing all these pictures, reading the ad and taking into account the car’s 37,000 miles, what would you pay?
Related reading:
CC Capsule: 1977 Pontiac Bonneville Brougham – This Grandma Had Class
Curbside Classic: 1979 Pontiac Bonneville Brougham Coupe – Who Needs A Cadillac?
CC For Sale: 1979 Pontiac Bonneville – Minty, In More Ways Than One…
This morning’s contrasts. I’ll take the Metro. Any day.
You and me both, but variety’s what it’s all about and there’s a place in my heart for each.
“I’ll take the (Geo) Metro.” Said no one ever!
Said me. I really liked mine.
The thing about REALLY liking cars, is that it’s not mutually exclusive for most part, I can like the Geo Metro, or an Isetta or an X1/9 and on the same page turn around and I can like a Bonneville Brougham and and Eldorado Biarritz Custom Classic, or an Imperial, cars are like foods, it’s great to experience varieties of tastes and styles. Don’t be so closed minded.
+1 Carmine!
+ another!
… and another +
Still another! +
Amen, Carmy…
We should be the SAME way with people, too. 😉
Syke, I’m not a brougham fan, but this is a beautiful car; the only things I’d change are getting rid of the vinyl landau roof and dechroming it somewhat. I dislike vinyl roofs of any type.
For the ’77-’79 B-bodies (coupe or sedan), I like them in the following order — Chevy, Pontiac, Buick, and Oldsmobile, with the last bringing up the rear because of its blockiness, as Perry mentions.
Pontiac really redeemed itself with these beautiful cars, after the hideous ’71-’72 Bonnevilles and Catalinas, which were the ugliest in my opinion of the bloated ’71 B-bodies, such a contrast to the sporty elegant Pontiacs of the 60s.
That’s my big barf point, too. Plus I always felt that Pontiac could have simplified the front and rear end trim a little.
It’s wonderful to see an example of a Pontiac that isn’t a GTO or Trans-Am (or any Firebird) out there. Whoever buys it, I hope he shows the hell out of it. There’s a whole generation out there that needs reminded that these cars existed, too.
These Chevrolets which consists of the RWD A-Bodies (G for the 1970-72 Monte Carlo), RWD A Special and RWD B-Bodies were the last popular large size cars at least INMHO because they were not too huge but at the same time never small from the outside. They shared their size popularity with RWD X-Bodies and the nearly identical sized Downsized RWD A-Bodies as well.
Thanks for dwelling on the dash a bit, Perry.
What was the last American car with an electro-mechanical digital clock? I have the first one and yes it works perfectly, thanks for asking.
Our old friend JunqueBoi would know this, I bet. I wonder if he’ll come out of hiding with the answer?
They mostly disappeared from GM cars around 1982 or so when the ETR Delco 2000 series radios with the built in clock started appearing in cars. My 1980 Caprice still has one, and it works too.
Our 84 Olds 88 had one, and the Custom Cruiser continued with the same dash till 1990. I can’t remember if the clock was optional or if they rolled into to the ETR-2000 series after dropping the 2700 series shaft units.
This Electra had it, and it was either an ’84 or ’85 (I’m leaning towards the latter, but didn’t look it up):
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/blog/junkyard/weekend-junkyard-outtake-electra-follow-up/
Sadly, my 1989 Olds Ninety-Eight had a spot that clearly would have fit one, though none of them would’ve had it. There was a blank “Ninety-Eight” plaque on the panel that’s the same size as the older clock. I still remember the geary sound those clocks made when the car was off.
Actually that hole was for the optional “Auto-Calculator” trip computer.
I know that’s how it was used, but its size and shape were unmistakable to a long-line Ninety-Eight owner.
Do you mean cars that actually had the mechanical digital clock in it in or cars that once had that clock as an option and then stopped offering it but left the mounting place and wires intact?
If you are wanting to know the last car that had the mechanical digital clock in it, it was most likely various GM models in 1983.(I can remember seeing(and buying) a mech-digi clock in a 1983 Cutlass Supreme)
Now if you were asking about the last car that had the place and wiring for it then that would be the 1990 Oldsmobile Custom Cruiser. While it last was offered with a clock like that (or any stand alone non radio clock) in the early 1980’s, the car had the mounting(including the screw holes) and the wiring intact up until the last year the car was made(1990) the mounting and wiring live behind the Custom Cruiser nameplate on the dash. Just remove the plate and get yourself a clock from a Olds 88 or 98 or CC from the early 1980’s and plug and play(the Olds 98 version had stenciling around the glass).
The 1988 Cutlass Supreme Classic(Oldsmobile name for the RWD car) also had the wiring and mounting intact. You simply removed the center vent cover( with the Oldsmobile Rocket Logo on it) and the mounting holes and wiring were still there. Simply go to the junk yard and get the clock, clock bezel(the vent plate) and the two screws that held the clock and install them. I had a mechanical-digi clock in my 1987 Cutlass Supreme sedan that I got out of a 1983 Cutlass.
Thanks, all. It’s funny that they left the wires and a blank spot. I’d think they could have replaced it with a cheapie LED unit, at least.
was standard equipment in 1986 Pontiac grand prix 2+2
Buick Enclave.
This car is beautiful. I didn’t appreciate this kind of thing when this car was new, but I do now. I appreciated the exposition on the Pontiac dashboard. I’d never really considered it before but it is a good one. And I like the idea of Chevy fitting this into the Caprice. That just wasn’t done in the 70s but it’s the rule now, to be sure.
Buddy of mine had a ’77 Buick LeSabre two-door. I’ll always prefer its looks over the Pontiac’s, but only slightly.
I had a ’79 Bonneville once upon a time – it was a nice respite from driving the Chevettes that I used for commuting before and after the Pontiac. Mine was not quite a decked out as this one and I had the whorehouse plush red interior. I still have a soft spot for fender skirts.
V8, A-6 compressor and R-12 – you could darn near freeze water on the a/c vents even on the hottest days – they sure don’t make a/c like that anymore.
My ATS’s A/C is quite good at cold, at least for me. We had 90+F yesterday and the A/C was cold enough that I turned up the setting to 75F.
I was thinking about this the other day – I remember the A/C in my family’s cars back in the 1980s being absolutely frigid. Now I expect the old R12 systems converted to R134a to be somewhat weak, but even the A/C in my 2010 Challenger just doesn’t quite have the juice on really hot (100+) days.
Well I can say that my 2007 SRX’s A/C could stay very cool on 105 degree days and the coolant gauge never wandered from the normal point. On the other hand my Aurora, which did not have a radiator grill, would tend to run warm on very hot days.
Some cars had deliberately downgraded air conditioning, probably for compressor durability reasons. An example is the Chrysler PT Cruiser and Dodge Neon SRT-4 which had the same engine (the PT from 2006-on had more power, due to changes in the intake plenum). The compressor is driven slower for a given engine RPM on the turbocharged cars, probably because they were more likely to be run at redline, risking overspeeding the compressor, for a longer time than the normally aspirated cars. The pulley on the turbocharged cars may be larger; I have not measured one. But I can confirm from the factory service manual that the specified outlet temperature under identical test conditions is about 5F higher on the turbocharged cars.
Other cars may have the actual capacity of their air conditioning reduced, for fuel economy reasons.
I have sort of looked into the A/C systems online. An R-12 system that has been converted to R-134a will not have quite the same cooling capacity that the R-12 had. However, what the automakers have designed newer A/C systems with the R-134a standard is not clear. They could have designed them for lower capacity. The temperature of the air coming out of the vents depends on how cold the evaporator gets, and even with R-12 the evaporators were not designed to run below freezing as they would freeze up.
I changed a couple cars from R12 (when forced to) to 134a. After reading, it turns out that it needs a bigger condenser to act the same as r12. Yes the temp of the air coming out the vent depends on having a cold evaporator. Even more so you need a cold return air. The real telling difference is stopped at intersections but there is some difference throughout.
If you are cooling 100 degree air you might hit 80 degrees with the output. If you are pulling from outside it will pretty much stay at 80 degrees. If you are pulling from inside the car it will start pulling down pretty quickly. If you are driving something from igloo or thermos it gets cold enough to freeze meat before it freezes up. Now that there are few r12 conversion systems it works better. Never cool outside air if you want to get cool quickly.
The biggest difference now is that the systems are designed with the new (old now) refrigerant in mind. My history is truly with HVAC and refrigeration. I always thought cars were a leak waiting to happen. Cars did not use r22 because of leaks. Anyway there are tradeoffs and r12 gobbled ozone.
R-134a (no chlorine) is thought to be non reactive with the ozone layer. But it is a green house gas (worse than CO2) so will be phased out soon. I have not had problems with my A/C’s leaking. But the A/C systems on farm equipment (my brothers) seem always to leak, even the new windrower that I run.
Can someone easily explain why Californians got the Olds engine and high-altituders got the Pontiac engine? And what would be considered high altitude? 5000 ft?
I mean I’m sure CA got the Olds engine for some kind of emissions reason and the Pontiac probably delivered power differently than the Buick engine, but what was it that caused them to behave different?
High altitude is 3000 feet, at least for low octane gasoline. I live in the wild west and our elevation is right at 3000 ft with the hills going up from there. Our “regular” gasoline is generally 85 octane, some of it is ethanol, some pure gasoline. Premium is generally 91 octane, but it is a mix of pure gasoline (now about $4.00 per gallon), and some is ethanol ($3.79)
Fuel injected engines are designed for 87 octane, and altitude does not make much difference until you get up to 10,000 ft. Carb’s were different a long time ago.
I just checked my 1978 Edmunds price guide. The list high altitude counties as those at or above 4000 feet. (my area is not listed)
About the emissions standards: California had their own standards, and GM spent the money to get the Olds engine certified but did not bother to get every engine certified.
Its all about the emissions certification. In some ways GM had it easy with the introduction of emission controls. They had the volume to make it worth their while to tool up and produce emission control devices, like air pumps, EGR valves, Temperature Vacuum Switches, Evap canisters ect. Though they also sold those components to anyone that wanted to buy them, and likely for a lower overall cost than a smaller mfg could tool up and build for themselves.
On the other hand they had way too many engine lines and even if you’ve got great pricing on the components you still have to go through the calibration and certification of each of the different engines. Now they burned themselves when they put Chevy engines in Olds in the past so they probably figured they should at least keep BOP engines in BOP full size. It was easier, quicker, and most importantly cheaper to certify less combinations for the smaller markets. You’ll find that CA often ended up getting fewer power train options in this time period.
Since GM had different engine families it was convenient to let the engineers at one division calibrate and produce the engines with the specific calibrations.
My guess is that they found the Olds engine to be the easiest to make meet the strictest CA standards. Since they had access to the same components my guess is that it was based on combustion chamber design. If you end up with too many nooks and crannies in the chamber fuel can hide there, not burn, and end up as HC emissions. I’m not sure why they would have picked the Pontiac vs the Buick for high vs low altitude. The vehicles didn’t need to be cleaner just different calibrations do deal with the less dense air. They could have given Pontiac the High Alt calibration because the Buick engineers were busy with not only their V8 but the V6 too.
Fully automatic climate control was not available on the full sized Oldsmobiles at this time. They got the semi automatic type with no auto fan. One of the things that I did not really like about my 78 Regency.
Just wait until one of those auto-climate units goes haywire, then you’ll wish for the manual unit.
Yea, well my 71 Riviera had the first auto unit, and there was a vacuum leak that I fixed. Otherwise, the 76 Riv, the 83 Skyhawk, the 86 T-type Electra, the 91 Reatta, the 95 Riv, the 98 Aurora, the 2002 Seville, the 2007 SRX have never had a problem. The most troublesome car was the 78 Olds diesel (semi auto climate control) with most troubles with fuel system seals.
Strangely enough, so did the Pontiacs in ’77-’78. The top HVAC option was the Tempmatic semi-auto system The full Comfortron unit became available in ’79.
Chevy offered the Comfortron on the downsized Impala/Caprice from the beginning in ’77. Go figure.
This thing is gorgeous. I want to hop in it and set the cruise, point the hood at the horizon, and not stop until I need gas. Buick 350 torque-y goodness is the icing on the cake.
WOW on that exterior color and steering wheel. Perfect color for the car and those rear fender skirts, which I usually hate, look pretty damn good. I still prefer the Buick LeSabre Sport Coupe, but not by much.
Pontiac GTO or Bonny from the sixties!
They lost it…………..
Wow, looks like somebody really checked-off all the boxes when they ordered that! I like it, but if I was ordering it new, I think I’d have preferred it without the vinyl roof.
I like the tail end treatment of the Olds, and not just because we own a ’78. The Olds has vestigal fins, and the taillights aren’t bad either.
A very nice car. The downsized Bonneville/Parisienne coupes were deinitely the most formal of the GM set especially with the landau roof. I find the fender skirts and rear treatment tend to give it a heavier look than its counterparts. What a shame the original owner ordered it with vinyl and not the Valencia interior, that would have been perfection.
Unlike Perry I have a soft spot for the Olds coupes. I still remember the ads for a red Delta 88 Holiday Coupe. With its bucket seats it was a combination of sporty and formal. I;ve never seen a downsized Holiday 88 come up on Ebay, they must have been rare.
Killer B.
Nice, nice, nice and NICE.
Too bad the 400 or 403 weren’t available anymore in 1979, I though the 403 still would be, but its not listed on the brochure, its just missing that to be ultimate B-body coupe.
Grandma’s 1979 Oldsmobile 98 sedan (loaded) had the 403, but naturally that’s a bigger than B-body car. That car had some wicked get up and go.
I think, but I would have to check to be sure, that the 403 Oldsmobile was mostly reserved for only the C-body cars for 1979? But maybe it was available in the Delta 88 still?
That dash is impressive, with such a small number of controls to do so many functions.
The landau roof and skirts spoil it for me though, it is ironic that the Pontiac has the throw-back styling and the Buick is much cleaner and more attractive (IMO of course).
Yes, I really enjoy Buick’s refined sporty theme in those years with the turbo engines, etc. Like I said, the LeSabre is generally my favorite, but next to the 77-79 Bonneville, it’s a toss up.
Good grief, that’s a pretty car. Perhaps the ultimate downsized B-body Pontiac? As Carmine noted, you’d probably want a ’77 or ’78 with the 403 for that purpose, though the ’79 had a cleaner grille design. Even with demerits for that and for the vinyl, still an amazing car and one that I hope finds a really good home.
On the more abstract question of the ’77 to 79 B-body coupes, they all thave their good points. LeSabre has the “sportiest” design and was available with the turbo engine…Impala has the bent-glass rear window…88 does have a very nice tail design with suggestions of the fins in those fender ridges. Given my pick, it would be a tough choice between one just like this, and a LeSabre turbo sport coupe though.
Agree with others, incredible example. Very high equipment level, excellent condition. For what it is, it could be worth $10,000 as a unique and ready to go car, but I’m not sure the collector interest is there yet. Would be a shame to kill this as a daily driver.
I did not like vinyl seats back in the day, but now that every middling and up car has leather, the vinyl is just fine – all the drawbacks of leather as far as being hot, cold, or sticky, but easier to keep clean and maintain.
The sport steering wheel, sunroof, built in CB, and auto climate control put this example over the top for equipment.
From experience, the 5.7 did indeed have decent scoot for the times. The 5.0 cars were competent, but the 5.7 added a bit of oomph to the driving experience.
I was thinking about the comment that this might be dad’s car in an upper middle class household. In some cases, sure. But, I recall B coupes tended to go to empty nesters and the elderly. The ’77-’79 Bs brought relative youth back to the full size segment, but the coupes with their framed windows tended to go to older folks. This car was a clear step above a ’79 Thunderbird. I’m not sure how many would have cross shopped those two new, we high school kids in the early ’80s cross shopped the ’79 Bird with a host of GM A bodies, but few could have afforded or wanted a B coupe. Thinking hard, I believe a couple of Impala coupes made it into teen and college hands, but even the Caprice was too conservative. The OPEC II and the ’80 update killed any chance that youth had much interest in Bs after the ’79 model.
I agree in that the ‘smaller’ 2 door Chevy B’s never caught on as ‘hot rods’, like the 60’s Impala coupes. Only decades later are some Caprice sedans made into Resto-Mods these days. And the 90’s Impala SS is its own catagory.
Ditto on vinyl; I wish they wouldn’t put it on high-wear surfaces like armrests & headrests, cloth does absolutely no good except to look pretty, which it doesn’t after a couple of years in contact with oily creatures like human beings. My old Accord’s cloth headrest got pretty nasty after 12+ yrs.
And the sun never got the vinyl areas hot enough to be a problem in our previous cars. Just keep the cloth on the seats, at most.
I should know better than to read an article on the B body. Now I’m gonna dislike myself for giving away the 77 Impala for, at least, the rest of the day.
To me the ‘ultimate’ would be a ’77 Bonneville with a Pontiac 400 motor, and ‘sport’ tuned suspension.
No more Poncho 400 in ’79? I was sure I’d seen at least one B-body Pontiac of that year with such a mill. Perhaps I’m remembering wrong, or it was a swap done early on.
The featured car looks great in that color. I would have leaned a bit more towards sporty than Broughamy (white letters, lose the skirts, no vinyl top, and a less bold interior color), but hey – it was a different day and age!
Still, this one got a lot right. Looks like “power everything” from what I can see. The Rallye IIs are also (always) a good choice. Astroroof? Pretty neat… I don’t think I’ve ever seen one in person. Same goes for the fuel economy gauge and the auto climate control. And though it was “only” a Buick 350, at least it had that.
It’s not me, but it’s not bad either.
1977-1978 was the last year that it was an option on the big cars, the 400 was still available in the Firebird in 1979, but only on 4 speed cars with the WS6 option, and all of those 400’s were actually 1978 motors that were left over, so availability of the 400 was very limited for 1979.
The fuel economy minder gauge was not limited to the Pontiacs of that generation….I had a 1979 Caprice that had one of those fuel economy gauges…It worked off engine vacuum if I recall correctly and the gauge was marked simply from max to min….Min being minimum fuel economy….When you would be working hard up a hill, it would go to minimum fuel economy.
The car had a 305 V-8 with three speed automatic without torque converter lockup….It topped out around 19 mpg on the highway….With an overdrive, it probably would have broken into the low 20’s in mpg but the overdrive trans was still a few model years away for the Caprice back then.
The economy vacuum gauges were available in all of the new B and C body cars, Chevrolet had a gauge, so did Pontiac, Oldsmobile had a little gauge where the optional engine gauges would have gone, Buick had a green and orange light in the fuel gauge face that would glow either color depending on how hard you pressed the pedal, Cadillac had little jewel lights in green and amber in the warning light strip above the dashboard.
Pontiac was semi unique in the availability of gauges, Oldsmobile had a semi gauge cluster and Chevrolet had a temperature gauge, Buick had a very rare gauge cluster on the ultra rare 1980 LeSabre Sport Coupe only.
These cars were so durable and drove so well. This is the first one I have seen with automatic climate control and dual front power seats. The only thing it lacks is the plush interior option Pontiac offered. Five more minutes in the oven and it would have been an Electra.
that is a sweet car. economy gauges are always funny.. gee, step on the gas and your mileage goes down…who’d figure? 🙂
A minty example I saw
As a proud owner of a 1986 Parisienne, I can definitely confirm this 79 was a way nicer dash design than the later Caprice piece. And I love that mechanical digital clock!
As someone who spent quite a bit of time in an ’86 (we had one when I was in high school and college) I fully agree with you! The dash on this Bonneville is indeed much nicer than the Caprice-based part in the later cars.
This Bonnie’s Gauge pack makes me jealous too, Ive been hunting for a while for the deluxe gaugesw/ temp and vacuum to fit my car, but ive got a tach and water temp discreetly mounted to bottom of my dash at least. Heres my 2 pack of factory gauages with the all important SYSTEMS MONITOR haha
Too bad so many B-body Buicks of that era had neither full gauges, nor a reasonable space to mount some.
The ’83 LeSabre really needs something more than just dummy lights. I really, really wish there was another model from which I could rob a more robust cluster.
But alas, it seems the only choices are to: a) do some major carving on the dash, b) eliminate the ashtray assembly in favor of the traditional “three in a row” instrument panel, or c) end up with something that’s either ridiculously conspicuous and/or a “knee knocker”. Pick your poison!
This looks familiar…
Except that my Caprice does have the fuel economy gauge, but I have had the needle pointed south east like that a few times.
Carmine how does your speedometer sound at high speed? Mine was past max like in my picture one time and around 180km/h(on gps) it started squeeling horribly. its been fine ever since, but i’ve been scared to go that fast again and break my cable 🙁
Quiet, my Caprice only has 59,000 miles, I don’t think I’ve ever had it at 180kph/111mph though, maybe around 100-102mph max.
Sharp car. The 350 from Buick is, so far, the most pleasant to be behind of any engine from the 1977-96 iron that I have driven (Ford 302, Olds 307, Buick 350, Chevy L05 350). Smooth and climbs right up steep hills without downshifting.
Love the interiors on these Pontiacs, they look just as nice, if not nicer, as/than anything from Buick or Oldsmobile. Which of course, lends some credence to the criticism of GM by this time.
I look at my Electra 225 and other than cloth instead of vinyl, what am I really getting that I couldn’t have gotten with a fully loaded one of these? Shucks, this even has the Cadillac style wastebasket and a split bench, and that Ford-style domelight with map lights. The deuce doesn’t have any of that, just a/c and power windows.
On a positive (yet negative in another way) note…why can’t we get fake wood that looks this good today? Even the real wood they’ve been putting in GM cars looks faker than this fake wood. The fake wood in my ’93 Fleetwood doesn’t hold a candle to this stuff. It’s just plastic, how hard can it be?
Well, in something like the Electra you would be getting some of the nicer C-body touches, like a rear armrest, which I assume your Electra has, the nicer door panels with the reflector/red & white courtesy light, the extra wheelbase, remember that this Bonneville is at the very very very tippy tippy top of what you could get in a Bonneville just gets you to the basically the starting level for a Buick C-body.
True, and it does have all of those things, the extra rear legroom, armrests, etc.
I get it, and I get also that the original owner of my car probably wanted to get the big Buick and pay the least he could for it, hence the setup, but it’s just hard to believe given the existence of such a Pontiac, that they would offer such a, well, basic interior in a Buick Electra which is supposed to be “DeVille without shouting about it” as the ’73 ads implied. Might have made more sense to just sell a Limited and Park Avenue version in retrospect to keep the “ladder” a bit more intact.
That ladder was not as straight up as people give it credit for from the end of WWII on. A loaded high end ’56 Chevy would be more comfortable than a base ’56 Cadillac, just because of the AC in the Chevy alone. Add a few options to the Cadillac, and a combination of interior space, sound insulation, a better transmission and a stronger engine made the Caddy a more appealing package, unless a buyer saw saw price and operating costs as a negative. There is a reason Oldsmobile was sometimes called the thinking man’s Cadillac – omit the ostentation and some things you really didn’t need, and the Olds was probably a better all around car.
Why offer duplicitous product? Because they could! The marketing machine managed to create a hierarchy of thought behind each brand. For many years, GM truly did offer about 8 reasonably unique ways to experience a full size car. In ’79 I was not a big fan of the LeSabre, but there were three more B body choices that could be equipped similarly to a LeSabre price point. A finicky kid in a candy store will find something to take home. You could shop at GM for a long time in those days before going to Ford or Chrysler for alternatives.
It was a rare sight to see a late model 60s/70s base Cadillac Calais on the street. Usually driven by fedora wearing senior man, born in the 1890’s. Chevy BelAir’s were more common, it seemed.
In the mid ’60s the Impala was the best selling Chevy hands down, and many of them carried a host of options. Most were V8s with automatic. Power steering, brakes and AC were reasonably common, and more so each year. The Caprice sold well out of the gate, and some were loaded. By about ’68, Motor Trend ran a test against the idea that the Caprice, LTD and Fury VIP had become the thinking man’s Cadillac.
The basic Electra could also be aimed at the rental market. Rental companies could get them cheap, but rent them at a premium price.
This would be a great car for my good friend Dave, who once owned a1986 Parisienne, if he had a garage to put it in.
These era cars were great until the winter salt ate them.
These GM cars were pretty modern as far as rustproofing and held up a lot better than most cars from a few years earlier. A number of ’77-’84 GM B cars went through my life, one was around for 15 years in salt country. The car was tired, and the family was tired of it when we got rid of it. But, it was still running fine on the original engine and transmission, and had no real rust to speak of. We did make an effort to keep it clean and wax it annually, and it got garage time. The ’68 Chevy and ’76 Ford my folks had before it both had real rust issues when they were sold at 8 years of age, and both were equally well treated.
A surprising number of these full-sized cars still exist here; absence of salt is a huge factor. The sun, though, does a number on cars. It destroys paint, it weakens upholstery, it destroys vinyl. So a lot of cars from this era look much the worse for wear here. But I understand the attraction: lots and lots of room, both in the cabin and in the trunk, without the bulk of the ’71-’76 cars. And the isolation was second to none, probably because of the body-on-frame construction. The quietest car I’ve ever been in was a ’77 Sedan de Ville; it was almost like an anechoic chamber. I rode once in an Olds from this era; it too was very quiet, if not quite so hushed as a Cadillac. That’s what I have missed in all of our unit-body cars over the last 30 years or more: none of them have done a great job of hushing the road noise and rumble.
David, I agree with you the 77 Cadillac’s were very quiet as was our 77 Electra. I did not find the Oldsmobile 98 of that bodystyle to be as quiet. Not many people seem to care about how quiet a car is or road isolation, everyone wants to “feel” the road. I still have my 06 Lexus LS430 Ultra that is as quiet as a tomb.
Yeah, it really limits choices these days with the demise of the Town Car. Quiet and softness of ride are almost all I care about, other than size. I hate ‘feeling’ the road. I get it if you regularly spend your time driving mountain roads in the quest of hiking, etc.
If you’re just driving around suburban parkways and boulevards, what the hell do you need road feel for? Why do you want it? You can’t even use it! I’d prefer to filter out all the bumps and make the drive as pleasant, and unstressful, as possible. Floating rather than clomping over road imperfections is step one.
And no, the Camry does not deliver the same “floaty” ride as an old Cadillac, despite allegations to the contrary. The feeling is not the same because the car has a much smaller wheelbase and unibody construction. It pitches around whereas the Fleetwood floats, gracefully.
Orrin, I am with you on comfort. First I have to have safety, dependability, then comfort. Without those three things the car is of no interest to me as a daily driver. I can even live with an ugly car as long as it has those three qualities in that order.
I agree also. I’ve owned Miatas, and Camaros, and a GTI and now drive Panthers. I mostly drive freeways and suburbs, and haven’t had to change traveling speed at all. The Panthers cruise much more comfortably and you really don’t give up anything in real world cornering. Perhaps in a tight urban environment the size could be annoying to deal with, but otherwise the big rwd body on frame car is king IMHO. And access to fix things is greatly improved.
The third composite photo shows a siver model – I’m not sure which brand it is but there is a certain Fiat 130 Coupe vibe going on there, to me.
And that red interior is fantastic!
A Buick LeSabre Sport Coupe is the silver one.
What i think makes the car are those rear fender skirts.
Pontiac was the only one that kept them until Oldsmobile put them back on the 98 in the early 1980’s
I love everything about it except the vinyl roof. Easily worth at least $7500 in my opinion. Hope it finds a good home!
This would be a fun car to slip a built Buick 455 into, while keeping engine bay stock appearing. What a sleeper you could have.
I would go with a nice built Pontiac 400, built to 1969-1970 specs.
I saw this earlier today but did not have time to comment. This is a beautiful car, in fact, I remember seeing many of them in my hometown area (Youngstown, Ohio) dressed this way. They were rather popular, probably the last popular big Pontiac, ever.
My wife and I had a 1977 Olds Delta 88 with a 403 in it. Someone further up the thread had mentioned these cars wouldn’t break 100 MPH. The early cars still had some muscle to them, our Delta was capable of well over 100 MPH. And would do it for sustained periods, although back in the double nickel days, those would have been some serious fines had you been caught at triple digits.
We kept it under 80MPH most of the time and I still had plenty of reserve power in that car. We also got 23 MPG on long drives. I think because the engine was so torquey and lightly stressed, it hardly was working, even when pushing that (relatively) big box down the road.
We had the FE3 suspension on that car also. It was rather a decent handler for a large car, especially considering the tires we had back then. Rarely did anyone buy speed rated tires, they were still on the lettering system for the tires (FR70-15, for example). Even though my 1980 Capri RS had the TRX wheels and tires, I think the Delta could have kept up with it in the twisties. I’d love to have that car back and slap some modern rubber on it, just to see what the old girl would do.
There are only a couple of cars I’ve had over the years that I really want back, that 77 Olds Delta is one of them.
I’m sure the 403 had to be able to break 100. I just slightly broke the century mark in my ’82 307 Delta 88 before I got nervous about getting jail time along with the ticket.
I’m not sure what my Dad’s company ’77 88 had in it. 350 or 403, it had some kick.
Yes, they really got weak after 1980, it seems to me. The “big” motors were gone, and everyone got tiny V8s after then. It was an awful time to be a motorhead…
The V8’s in the 80’s got weaker. However, the V8’s of the 90’s are a different story. My 98 Aurora and 2002 Seville both had wonderful performance and loafing along at 70 MPH could average 29 MPG on long trips.
Out of all those B- bodies in the coupe collage, the Caprice is where its at! The jacked up rear end and the corvette rallies sell it as a potentially souped up ride. The Buick and the Poncho look like they got switched at birth. Pontiacs are supposed to be the ‘sporty’ vs Buick as the ‘plush’. Olds has a dash of each but leans posh.
Is it me, or are those gorgeous rallies grossly out of place on this car? Mag style wheels with padded roofs, lots of chrome and a skirted rear fender is just….wrong.
They may have seemed out of place, but the traditional Pontiac rallies were so common on these that they didn’t look out of place at all. The vast majority of Bonnevilles I remember as a kid had either rallies or wire wheel covers. Once in a great while you would see one with the Trans Am-style snowflake wheels.
Someone must have really wanted vinyl seats to go to the trouble of ordering up a standard model Bonneville (not a Brougham) with everything in the book on it, making this car all the more rare. If that vinyl is the same as what was in my grandparents’ base model ’77 LeSabre, it’s as soft and comfortable as any leather.
Speaking of Pontiac, you might appreciate these pictures of B-body taken in Europe. Friend got a 86 Parissienne and we could not resist to make few pictures with mine 87 Caprice Brougham, especially when they looks like twins. Enjoy 🙂
https://picasaweb.google.com/112030719289354524886/ParisienneCaprice2broughams?noredirect=1#6048667473427981570
By all rights, I should hate this car and find it horribly tacky… but instead, I think I’m in love!
The interior is really a total knockout, and just goes to show what a difference small details make. In this case, it’s the steering wheel. I never liked this dashboard before, but I had only ever seen it with the all-plastic three spoke wheel. With this one, it becomes a beautiful explosion of red, silver and black – very much a throwback to an earlier era. The whole car is, really, although the detailing is almost more ’50s Pontiac than their classic ’60s era, which is fine by me. For instance, the trim on the front turn signal lenses recalls the classic “Silver Streaks” hood ornamentation. Just needs a light-up Indian head somewhere…
This is one of those rare instances where I actually don’t think the vinyl Landau roof seriously hurts the looks of the car, but I’d still prefer it with a steel top. Just change that and give me the Pontiac 350 and it’d be perfect. Nothing at all wrong with the Buick engine, but I always think it’s cool to find a matching car and division-specific engine on these models from the period right before engines went all-corporate. I also thought the Pontiac 350 was dead by this point, but I guess not, since it’s right there in the brochure?
This takes me back!
I had lots of shotgun time in a ’78 Bonneville coupe owned by a best friend’s mom. They took me with them when they traded in her ’74 GrandVille and picked up the ’78 at Glenn Straub Pontiac in Wheeling, WV.
That one matched the subject car pretty well. The major differences would be: exchange the burgundy paint for white, no moon roof, no gauge package and an AM-FM 8 track. I think only the driver’s seat was power. At the time, I felt the car was pretty nicely optioned.
Don’t knock the burgundy vinyl. It was actually pretty comfy, and held up pretty well, as I recall. In my mind’s eye, it was a darker, more subtle shade of red than in these pictures.
Lots of misadventures with my buddy in that car! Looking back, it’s probably a good thing his mom went with the ’78. The trade-in GrandVille had the 455 4-bbl. If the same stunts pulled with the 78 were instead performed in the ’74, neither of us would still be here today.
This should be a CC Blast from the Past, “early 80’s parking lot scenes”(minus, the newer “appliances” in the background. LOL)…
My 83 Corolla parked next to a 79 Bonneville coupe(nice guy, too)… he went from an Acura TSX to a REAL classic. lol
Cool. 🙂
Had a black 1979 Landau and tan buckets seats, center console but no a/c. Wish I had it back. Buckets seats much be super rare. Great ride.
I always thought the Bonneville was a better looking Caprice Classic. Actually I think most Pontiacs in the 60s and 70’s were better looking Chevy’s. lol
I had a ’79’ landau white outside with red velour. It had the Olds 350, buckets, console, glass sunroof, all power, cruise, A/C, tilt, dual exhausts, remote trunk release, full gauge package.
I bought it from the service writer of a Watsonville, CA car dealership who claimed there were only 14 other Bonneville coupes optioned better than it was. He might have been right.
I loved that car! It was my DD for many years and gave me almost no trouble except that the A pillar on the passenger side rusted out due to a clogged sunroof drain. Structural damage was near the top door hinge mount, and the car was almost 20 years old when I let it go because I needed a tow vehicle for our 5th wheel.
I still miss it, gobs of torque and a very smooth running engine. And that dash looked straight out of a Jetliner..well, almost.
Can we talk about the stupidity of asymmetrical placements of switches in the centre console? I can accept the non-functional switch placeholders as to preserve the cohesion of overall design, but this one is really jarring and triggers the OCD in some of us…
Same ol’ GM, full o’ laffs.
There is a good reason for this layout. Well a reason, if not a good one. Once upon a time in a land far far away, cars had individual options you could order a la carte. And unlike today, panels to accommodate varying optional-equipment loads by filling unused holes with blank plates was considered unsightly and inappropriate for American cars, even if the practice was already common on those small furrin cars. General Motors would not suffer the indignity of blank panels fowling up the good work of Bill Mitchell and company. Thus, for the 77-79 Pontiac, there were as many as TEN versions of this panel made, each with a different combinations of holes to accommodate options. A fully maxed-out panel would have two small holes at the left, a large hole for a digital clock in the center, and two more small holes to the right. Our 77 Bonneville Brougham had three of the small holes filled for a cable-controlled right outside mirror, an electric rear window defogger, and a power antenna up/down. I’m not sure what the fourth hole would have be used for. Our car had the standard analog clock (still mechanical) which was positioned between the speedometer and the fuel/volts/amps/watts gauges (the same spot could be filled with a fuel economy gauge or a blank panel with a Pontiac logo; all had PRNDSL indicators). So your car could have one of many inserts here, which may or may not have been symmetrical, depending on options ordered. Further complicating things is that this panel was large, stretching from the driver’s gauges to the glovebox. So many variations had to be built! The 80-81 panel was simplified somewhat by cutting it off so the driver’s gauge area and the glovebox surround were different pieces, making the up-to-5 hole panel above the radio and HVAC controls much smaller. Still no blank panels allowed though.
Is the RH mirror remote control (electric) an option? I’m interested about what this dash looks like if that’s not there.
A college roommate had the Buick version of this but I don’t remember anything about the dash.
Amazing how the old G.T.O. Rally 2 wheels made it all the way to the Brougham years and still looked contemporary.
Funny no one has yet pointed out that the owner of the dealer that listed this car has been charged with fraud earlier this year and as far as I can tell the dealership is no more.
Because it was 6 years in the past, most likely.