The best thing about my old ’66 F100 is that it hardly ever breaks, and when it does, it’s almost invariably easy to fix. I got in it the other day to haul some yard debris, pulled the choke, turned the key, and…nothing. Huh? Tried again: a few feeble and barely audible clicks. I knew it wasn’t the battery, as I did just replace that a few months back, since the old one was getting on 7 or 8 years. But wait a minute…maybe I didn’t actually have to, as the symptom was the same, but I just assumed it was the battery then since the truck hadn’t been driven in some weeks and it was winter.
Oh right…this happened about 15 or more years back. It was the starter solenoid! I confirmed it by bypassing it with a jumper cable from the positive pole of the battery to the starter. Turned right over. And it’s an easy fix; that is, if the parts store has one in stock on a Sunday afternoon.
Want to place your bets on that being or not being the case?
Grabbed a couple of sockets and disconnected the two main terminals of the solenoid, popped off the two minor ones, and removed the unit via the two sheetmetal bolts. Total time: 90 seconds? 120?
Drove to my preferred local parts store (Knechts) and…sure enough, in stock. $17.95. It never fails to amaze me how commonly parts are available for this 54 year old truck. Some years back I needed new brake drums; “no problem; we’ll have them here in an hour”. Ok. Water pumps and tune up parts and such are always in stock. But then these 240/300 sixes were made by the millions, although the later ones have FI and electronic ignition and such.
Anyway, reverse the procedure, and…nnnrrr, nnnrrr…roar; and the trusty old six fires right up.
If only it were always this easy.
This past summer while I was on “sabbatical”, I was driving the truck when it suddenly started bucking violently, as if I was turning the ignition on and off rapidly. Fortunately I was only a few blocks from home, and just barely made it into the driveway.
Please note: I am a mediocre mechanic, at best. Mostly because I’m a lousy diagnostician, which is actually just about the most important part. I’m impatient, and just want my truck to work when I need it for a job. It’s not like a toy that I like to play with. So I jump to conclusions and too often just throw parts at the problem and hope they stick.
Without even getting out a voltmeter or a diagnosis checklist, I assumed it had to be the points, condenser, or coil. See; not very subtle.
Since it had been about a decade since I replaced them last, I went to the parts store for new ones.
I dutifully replaced them, and put the shiny new blue cap on (I splurged!), and hit the starter. The engine cranked and cranked and cranked but absolutely no sound of life. What the?
I happened to have an extra coil around, probably when something similarly happened many years ago, and tried that. Nothing. I double checked everything, to make sure all the connections were tight, and probably emitted some choice words, but that didn’t help either.
So I did what I should have done in the first place: get out my old Chilton’s book and followed the trouble shooting charts that had me getting out my meter and working down the list. Everything was good until I got to the coil secondary primary resistance, I got…resistance. Like off the scale. But this happened with both coils. That’s just not possible.
It took a bit, but I finally tracked down the culprit: the lead (wire) from the coil secondary to the distributor (the black wire just visible at the bottom of this old picture) had a tiny crack in its insulation right where it entered the base of the distributor, and was shorting out. It had still been intermittent at first, which is why I made it home. But my tune up must have jostled it and now it was totally shorted out.
Should I make up my own or bother to get a new one? I decided on the latter, and sure enough, it was in stock. I replaced it, and all was good again.
And the fringe benefit was that now the old 240 six revs cleanly up to 4,000 rpm, where before it had started stuttering a bit at about 3500 or so. Not that I normally rev it that high, but when I’m entering two lane 55mph NW Expressway and have to cross one of the lanes to do so, with 3 yards of compost or a yard or so of gravel in the bed, I do need to put the spurs to the old nag. And now instead of complaining, it giddy-ups. I suppose a tune up more often than once a decade or so wouldn’t exactly be extravagant.
And if you’re wondering about those two heater hose ends sticking up next to the radiator, well, the heater core finally gave out…two years ago. I’ve been meaning to fix it since then, but just haven’t gotten around to it. And our winters are pretty mild, and I don’t use it very much then. Maybe I won’t ever bother…it’s just one less thing to break in the future. My truck is all about probing the limits of the absolute bare essentials necessary for hauling stuff.
Maybe not quite as far as this one, but I do have a fondness for minimalism.
And a running truck. Back to work.
Now about those dead turn signals…never mind, my copilot is good with hand signals.
Our local independent auto parts store, right on our main downtown shopping street cheek by jowl with lingerie boutiques, poke bowl restaurants and gourmet cookware shops, recently closed. A few years back I went in to see if they had a fuel filter for my Ducati, which I had learned was the same as used on various ‘70’s Mitsubishi’s. The counter person barely hesitated, then went in back and returned 30 seconds later with the right part, top tier brand (Denso?). I doubt I’d have the same experience at AutoZone.
As for starter solenoids, when I was a young engineering student with better diagnostic and repair skills, and an empty wallet, I repaired an open contact in the solenoid on my Vega with some jumper cable and screwdriver tip welding from the battery. Lasted 3 more years until I sold the car.
I remember Ford starter solenoids from my days selling auto parts in the late 70’s.
And holding a screwdriver across the terminal of one on my ’67 Cougar.
Now about those dead turn signals…never mind, my copilot is good with hand signals.
“Clyde! Right turn”
As a police officer, one night I got a woman out of a dark parking lot and on her way home by shorting across her starter solenold connections with an aluminum flashlight.
“DO NOT TURN OFF THE ENGINE TIL.YOU GET HOME!!!!”
I almost ran myself over doing that once. My room mate had borrowed the car and not put it in park when he left it. (Non interlocked floor shifter)
Next day I went to go to work and nothing happened when I turned the key. I jumpered the solenoid and luckily was able to stumble back when the car started and bumped into me.
I learned how to hot wire a car very early on. As in my mom’s ’65 Coronet, to take it joy riding at the age of 15. It was so easy back then… 🙂
On most 1960s Chrysler products before steering column-mounted ignition/starter switches, you could reach up under the dash, unplug the harness from the ignition switch, and jump the ignition and crank it with two paper clips…or just one, if you bent the paper clip just right.
That remote starter solenoid reminds me of the first time I looked under the hood of our 85 Ford Ranger. I though hmm, it’s got a Ford style remote solenoid, followed by of course it does, it’s a Ford. In my defense this was the first Ford I’d ever tried to work on since my previous vehicles were water cooled Volkswagens.
Since some things stay the same my 2002 F-150 apparently uses a very similar starter solenoid.
“Want to place your bets on that being or not being the case?”
Yes, I’ll bet not.
But in the jostling the connection/ground problem was fixed.
How about a postmortem?
Oh well, can’t miss changing out an ancient relay.
By the way that’s coil primary, not secondary. No biggie just that I was intently following along the reading and it threw me. The manual doesn’t give very good advice if it directs checking coil resistance while still in the circuit.
See the bare ground lead to the moveable breaker plate? That’s dangerously close to the insulated moveable contact arm’s spring. At the least opportune time it’ll find a way to connect. Wouldn’t hurt to twist the terminal it away an 1/8 turn.
I’m actually wondering if that didn’t “red herring” or fry the lead-in wore?
Good job! Thanks for the report.
By the way that’s coil primary, not secondary.
See; I told you I was lousy at this. That incident happened last summer, and it’s already getting foggy. There’s some things my brain likes to remember, others not so much so.
My Corvair’s engine instantly quit while I was passing through a busy intersection a few years ago. After coasting through the intersection, I jumped out and pushed it as fast as I could run to a nearby library parking lot, because cars were starting to line up behind me. I was taking my wife to lunch, and considering that she works across the street from the library, we just took her car.
When we got back, it didn’t take long to figure out that the primary coil wire had broken clean off near the coil. Luckily, I was able to scare up a connector and a wire crimping tool from a department at her work. I fixed it up and was on the road in minutes; I’d have to look, but I think it was a good enough repair that I just left it.
I can’t even see the starter on my car. Speaking of which, you do these repairs without the need for glasses (I’m the same age)? Remarkable. I can’t see squat without them, not even to take a selfie.
I need cheap reading glasses for any close work, reading, etc. I’m up to 275s now. And my long distance vision, of which I was so proud of, is getting a wee bit fuzzier too. Just like my truck; the parts are wearing out. If only there were replacement parts so readily available. 🙂
Time to get +3.50. Then you are on your own since while +4.00 is made no drug store would stock. If you have an old pair of +1.25 sitting around I’d bet you could drive with them and even see better. Age catches up with every hyperope eventually and then it is all downhill.
You and me both, Paul. I ordered bifocal cheaters online with non-corrected main lenses and 2.5x insets for reading the dash instruments or radio. Got a clear pair for night and sunglasses for day. They work a treat.
Your piece made me miss my old ‘69 just a bit!
I feel you. I have three problematic European cars in my charge right now, all of which are in various states of disrepair and all of which are difficult to diagnose. Future COALs coming, once I get at least one of them off my hands.
What, the “smack it with a crescent wrench” fix doesn’t work on a Ford starter solenoid any more? 🙂
I’ll bet that part has been used for decades. When I was going on a trip with my high school band a Ford rental truck had a solenoid go out in the school parking lot. We pirated one from the late model LTD that belonged to one of the chaperones and someone instructed the rental company to replace the solenoid in the yellow LTD because we were on a schedule.
I’ve never had to try that fortunately even with four Fords. I do happen to have three good pull offs and four NOS American made ones that are not stamped Autolite or Motorcraft. So I believe I am covered.
Points? I don’t use no stinkin’ points in anything and am much better off for it.
I’ve never had points actually fail, ever. They let you know when they’re starting to get a bit fuzzy. But I’ve heard of plenty of electronic ignition modules failing. 🙂
And at least one breaker point failure mode can be fixed at roadside with a bit of…well, it’s better to let Gus Wilson tell it.
The Model Garage series is great and has gotten me out of several fixes with the old ‘50 8N. I read through the whole series every few years, they’re that good, especially from the late-‘30s on.
Excellent story there Daniel, a friend of mine once replaced the spring on an points setup by cutting a ring of bicycle inner tube ( to effectively make a rubber band) and used that to pull the points closed. Worked perfectly on a Datsun Cherry in 1993. I think the car was around 1980
I had the points “fail” suddenly on the ’72 VW bus. All of the sudden it had almost no power, but at night, in the mountains, with a bunch of friends on board, very little roadside diagnosis was attempted as it was still running. The next morning in the driveway I found the phenolic block had broken, way retarding the timing, but if the points open at all, the coil will fire.
I usually have other things fail. Ignition tumblers in the Focus. Float level in the Cougar. Today the alternator in the Polara. All failed at the same ARCO right after getting gas 1.5 miles from home. First two needed a tow while today the Polara was able to get back after a AAA battery jump and crossed fingers.
Let me give my opinion as an ex-professional mechanic. The Arco station is jinxed. Get a new gas station.
Nylon rubbing block on a Chevrolet’s points broke on me one time.
“I’ll bet that part has been used for decades.”
Right, that version from ’56 on well into the electronic ignition era, when a slight change eliminated the bypass terminal.
Unfortunately one of the most frequently unnecessarily replaced parts, IMHO. Mainly because so many faults can show the same symptoms as a defective starter relay.
I have seen rust build up between the solenoid bracket (its ground) and the fender causing a no start issue and just pulling and cleaning takes care of it,
My father was a professional mechanic with a paradoxical penchant for minimalism when it came to our family vehicles.
In my early days of driving and learning to repair vehicles I used some of his tricks: bypassing heater cores, removing thermostats, disabling automatic chokes…. Over the years I grew to appreciate doing repairs in a professional fashion, especially on the vehicles we use to get to work every day, back when we went to work. Long ago I stopped saving the old parts just in case the new ones broke-no more trunk full of fan belts for me.
Though it is diagnostically impure, I tend to replace a cluster of related parts rather than one at a time, especially if all of the parts are quite old… Except when I don’t. Last year my Subaru sent a code that traced to a bad oil pressure switch on one head. In a pique of stinginess and diagnostic purity I replaced only the bad one, and, sure enough the other one went a few days later, followed in too short a time by the solenoids that control them.
Lesson learned? Only time will tell.
My father was a professional mechanic with a paradoxical penchant for minimalism when it came to our family vehicles.
“The cobbler’s children have no shoes.”
I could tell you some hair raising stories about my father (a neurologist) misdiagnosing misdiagnosing serious conditions in my mother, because he refused to have her seen by a specialist.
Sometimes, it makes good sense to change clusters of parts, though, if they’re difficult to access. If you’re taking the transmission off, might as well replace the clutch. If you’re arm-deep in the suspension, there’s no harm in changing the old bushings and ends, even if they have nothing to do with what you’re fixing (as was the case for me, recently)
And while you’re at it, do the engine rear main seal too.
Maybe no seal this time.
It’d mean removing the transmission too on a 240, they use a one-piece seal.
Wow, I guess I really have never worked on an old Ford because I have never seen a separate solenoid. I just assumed they were all attached to the starter, so that they could overheat from being next to the engine block and leave you temporarily stranded in important places (like the starter on our International Loadstar would always do on the scale at the grain elevator). Glad you found that short, my one experience with intermittent running turned out to be a cracked distributor cap. Boy, that makes for a tiring Interstate drive until you figure it out. Happy Trails!
You got that T-Bird now, so keep an eye out.
(I don’t know why I didn’t think you browsed this blog, because it makes absolute sense)
Always thought you were a sensible guy Paul, but you have a habit of overloading that old truck, and that’s not very sensible.
And yes, it’s a pain to have to put your glasses on to fix the car, but it’s nice to still be able to crawl underneath it – even if crawling back out isn’t so easy…..
Good sleuthing and yeah, it’s a hell of a thing to walk into a parts store—oh, casual as you please—and easily walk out with repair parts for a half-century-old vehicle.
You might want to pay some heed to the top end of the positive battery cable. Those two-bolts-and-a-strap terminals (purple arrows) are meant as a temporary get-by until a proper repair can be made. They tend to last longer than they’re supposed to, but with the cable strands exposed to the elements like that they make for a marginal connection and attract corrosion and cable degradation as water and acid wick down the length of the cable. If you’re not into replacing the whole cable, compression-fitting terminals like this greatly lower the risk of a sudden no-start.
Also: did this truck spend time in California, do you know? It’s got a crankcase breather cap that looks like a design newer than ’66, apparently ducted to the clean side of the air cleaner (green arrows). Ducted crankcase breathers started in California in ’64 (rest of the US + Canada in ~’68) and they were virtually always ducted to the dirty side of the air cleaner. California had a retrofit mandate for awhile, though—typically a hole was drilled in the air cleaner and a potmetal elbow fitting was attached with two screws and a rubber gasket—but the design of many air cleaners precluded effective ducting to the dirty side.
It appears this is not the original engine, as it has an oil pan from an Econoline. meaning every time I do an oil change the oil spills on the cross member. Scoutdude pointed that out to me once.
And the air cleaner is an aftermarket Fram thing, also not original. If it was from an Econoline, it likely had one of those undermount things to clear the dog house.
But yes, it’s from CA. That’s where I bought it in ’87.
Closed crankcase ventilation was required in California starting in ’61, and was a rare factory option starting in the mid ’50’s primarily for vehicles operated on dirt roads. The hardware did look different on early systems.
That is not quite correct. A terminology error of that time has made this a bit of an enduring nuisance to understand correctly.
The purpose of the crankcase ventilation system (of whatever type) is to take vapours and fumes out of the crankcase, so there has to be an air inlet; it’s called the crankcase breather. Air flows in through the breather, sweeps crankcase fumes and vapours along with it, and out via one method or another. The out-via method is what began to change in California in 1961.
What was mandated on new ’61 cars in California (and ’62 in New York, and became standard equipment on more or less all vehicles for ’63) was positive crankcase ventilation: crankcase gases had to be ducted into the intake tract rather than dumped out into the atmosphere via a road draft tube. It was not a closed system, because the crankcase breather was still vented to atmosphere. But it was widely, sometimes even officially, and erroneously called “closed crankcase ventilation” at the time.
With an open-to-atmosphere breather, under zero-vacuum conditions (wide open throttle, e.g. up a long hill) and/or on an engine with high blowby volume, the crankcase gases flow right back out through the breather, i.e., the system reverts to a basic direct-vent mode. This causes objectionable odours in the passenger compartment, and releases unburnt hydrocarbons into the atmosphere, where they create photochemical smog.
So, starting in 1964 in California and ~1968 nationwide, the (truly) closed positive crankcase ventilation system was introduced. On this system, the breather vents via a hose to the air cleaner. Most of the time, this is just exactly the same as venting to the atmosphere: air flows into the crankcase through the breather, and out via the PCV valve. But under those low/no vacuum and high-blowby conditions when an open system just vents off into the atmosphere, there’s still suction above the throttle plate due to the influx of air through the air cleaner and into the carb, so the crankcase gases are still drawn off out of the crankcase and consumed in the engine.
The closed system constitutes an improvement,but in extreme conditions, high volume crankcase gasflow out of the breather can oil down and ruin an air filter element. Heavy-duty vehicles sometimes had a foam or gauze wrapper around the dry air filter element to stave off filter wetdown (until the wrapper disintegrated or got thrown out and not replaced). Obviously not a problem with oil bath air cleaners.
Thank you for that explanation.
I had wondered why, in vehicles from the 70s as I recall from my days working at gas stations in the 80s, some cars had a tube from the oil cap into the air breather, and why the mesh in the oil caps was so often full of oil.
My F100s had that type of system I believe, but previous owners replaced the air breathers with simpler circular ones and removed the extra plumbing.
I used the jumper cable trick on my ‘81 Datsun 310 years ago. I did it for a week or so before taking it to a garage that specialized in electrical issues. Turned out it was a problem with the ignition switch. The mechanic simply wired in a pushbutton to the dash that did the same thing – turn the key on, hit the button and away it went. Simpler and cheaper than replacing the ignition switch, and it worked fine for the rest of the time I had the car.
In the late 90s I was living in Portland, OR and noticed the water pump on my ’47 International pickup was leaking at the bearing. I decided to try the big NAPA parts store in NE Portland and the guy behind the counter told me to wait. He was gone a good ten minutes but came back with a water pump. I was amazed, but as I installed it I remembered quizzing the mechanic in Dorris, CA where I bought the truck. He may have been the only mechanic to ever work on it (it was purchased new from the dealer just ten miles away in Klamath Falls). He told me he had replaced the water pump, taking one from a ’36 International. I still have the water pump he put on, because a machine shop could probably replace the bearing. Nice to have a 73 year old truck and an 84 year old water pump on the shelf just in case.
THE CC EFFECT AGAIN!
Just last week as I got into my 24 year old Aerostar to begin my 1500 mile trip from Florida to VT, I turned the key: click click click. This had never happened before. The near 9 year old battery had always powered a fast, immediate start. (I didn’t think of the solenoid).
I jumped the battery with one I took from my solar system, and away I went.
Stopped at a rest area in NC the next day (meanwhile, immediate starts, every time) and when I turned the key: again, click click click. Before I jumped it in FL the battery read only 10 volts, so, despite acting normal again, I was prepared for a battery purchase. (I got it going again by scumptiously cleaning the terminals, once again). Found a Walmart outside of Roanoke, VA and bought a new one. Has run fine ever since and got me safely to VT. (25.5 mpg with a Kayak on the roof).
But your experience has me wondering about the Solenoid. Except for the 10 volt reading, there were none of the usual symptoms of a dead or dying battery.
Will keep you posted.
A 9 year old battery is on borrowed time. They lose the ability to hold as much charge as they age. Then, they go poof. I once had a battery crap out while I was driving the car (1967 Charger). It was the battery—alternator was fine.
I hate electrical issues something else always goes wrong to compound the problem you start with, my last one melted all the ammeter wiring in my old car the electrical system is of course Joseph Lucas built actually its two halves from seperate cars made into one which is likely the source of any problems, something blew a fuse while rewiring the trailer plug and of the ammeter wiring burnt out to protect the other fuse, fixed now but a total pain sorting it all out
There’s a reason Joseph Lucas is known as the Prince of Darkness. Ask anyone who rode British bikes at night.
Bravo Paul! Precisely why I went back to a Detroit-built daily driver. Plentiful available parts and simple maintenance. Mild downside is MPG, offset by smiles per mile in a 1969 Cougar Convertible. My new morning ritual is Curbside Classic with a strong French Roast cuppa Joe.
Thanks, Paul. Nice to hear of yet another instance where parts are available for an older vehicle at a reasonable price. I noticed from the photo of the distributor that it happens to be a “loadomatic” distributor. This was an unusual design by Holley and was used on some 1950s and 60s Fords. This system has no mechanical (centrifugal) spark advance mechanism, all of the spark advance is applied by vacuum. The carburetor has a special valve which sends a modified vacuum signal to the distributor. If your truck runs well, let it be. Should your engine ever suffer from loss of power under load then check this spark advance system. Over time the distributor advance diaphragm and the valve on the carburetor may wear out.
“I’m impatient, and just want my truck to work when I need it for a job.”
“I double checked everything, to make sure all the connections were tight, and probably emitted some choice words, but that didn’t help either.”
And THAT’S how a “5-minute job” can easily turn into an hour (or more)–I know your pain all too well. Oftentimes a loose connection is all that’s needed to knock out an otherwise functional system. For example, I had my backup camera, backup alarm, AND the reverse prong on my 5-flat trailer connector all fail on my 2011 Ford Ranger this past Sunday. It somehow started when I was getting fallen tree limbs around my church’s parking lot with the Nissan Trailer–EVERY time I went to back up, the backup alarm wouldn’t make a sound. And I had tested EVERYTHING beforehand to be sure it worked too! STILL no backup alarm even after unhitching the trailer, and then I noticed I had no display on the camera monitor either–sometimes the reverse lights on the trailer use enough power to make the alarm sound weird or very weak. That left only the reverse prong to test (all 3 are wired on the same circuit); got out the circuit tester and…NOTHING! If the Ranger’s reverse lights still worked–they DID–why is everything else with the same function dead as a door knob?! I checked all underneath the truck for loose wire connections, traced the reverse wire all the way back to the left tail light, gave the spliced area of the tail light reverse wire a good pinch, and…BEEP BEEP BEEP–it finally worked! The culprit turned out being the splice connector (image below) I used to attach the reverse wire had somehow broken on the inside while heading to the church, and therefore cut the contact between the 2 wires in the process. Removing the connector (carefully) & TIGHTLY reattaching the stripped parts of the wires directly together with electrical tape solved the problem. I no longer trust any connectors of that type to this day. If anything, I try using wire nuts instead–they work better for me even if they’re not meant to be used with automotive/trailer wiring; haven’t failed me yet! 🙂