There’s never been a car like the Prius. Not just because it was the first mass-produced hybrid, but because it arrived along with the widespread adoption of the internet, which uncorked a wave of tribalism and partisanship not seen before. The intensity of passions unleashed by this dorky little high-tech marvel of a car was truly mind-boggling, at least to me. How could so much hate be vented at it? And here I thought car guys would be attracted to its superbly efficient drive train. Not so, at least for a large segment.
Global Warming was a hot-button issue at the time, and a lot fewer folks accepted its reality than now. The Prius became a poster child of the divide around that issue, and it took a long time to simmer down.
And then Tesla came along to take the heat off the Prius, which is now so yesterday. Boring…
Have a friend who has the exact same color twin as this one (not sure of it’s year). It’s way past 200k, zero battery issues everyone frets over, and has held up remarkably well. In freezing Minnesota. Pretty remarkable for a first time effort.
At this points I have heard a lot more about fear of battery issues than I have about actual battery issues. Considering EVs often have better warranty on the batteries than ICE cars have on their drivetrains, it really doesn’t scare me.
I like a bit of oomph, and these cars just don’t have it. So they remain theoretically desirable to me. I certainly appreciate them.
The majority (probably something like 60%) of taxi cabs in Chicago were some sort of Toyota hybrid when I lived there 2014-2017. Camry, Prius, Prius V. They clearly did something right, and now with the Corolla hybrid, I’d image that will become the darling for Uber drivers.
Where I live at least 90% of all taxis are Toyota Hybrids.
Speaking to some old taxi friends, they are all preparing to switch to EVs when the cost structure works for them.
It’s all about cost. When an EV is cheaper to run than a hybrid, taxis will rapidly switch.
Well cost and these days image.
Here in Denmark it has taken a long time to go green for taxi companies. Hybrids have not until recently been tax exempt like EVs. Now we’re seeing all-EV companies.
The huge company I work for demands documentation for carbon emissions from the taxi companies they contract with. That caused their taxi company to produce these numbers, and that in turn got the taxi company more customers.
Over here the Prius was never a hit due to taxes.
It wasn’t a first-time effort, not really. Toyota sold the first 2 years’ of Prius in Japan only and made enough changes to the initial global model to qualify as a “second generation” according to some sources despite a barely-changed body. It’s coded as an update to the original in the Toyota chassis-code designation though (NHW10 vs. NHW11).
You are correct that what we got was the second generation with a significantly revised power train. Engine and motor power were increased over the NHW10. The battery pack also went from being cooled by a second AC evaporator to being cooled by the cabin air.
It has a 60s VW feel to it, this ad.
Absolutly, i think this play on words ist clever made.
The first gen Prius were pretty rare here in the Netherlands, the second and next generations were a big hit though.
Late yesterday evening, in te dark, the car in front of me had very weird taillamps. It turned out to be a new(ish) Prius. Never noticed these lamps before. I am not a fan.
I’m no marketing genius, but I have not figured out why the newest Prius (Prii?) have to be so weird looking. I had one behind me the other day, and the headlights were worse than the taillights. To each his own, I don’t want to offend any Prius owners here…..beauty is in the eye of the beholder, etc. \
But it seems like if the technology had been simply applied to the Corolla earlier than it was, or the Prius remained more “mainstream” in styling, it would have been a better bet.
It is often thought that 1 of the reasons why some hybrid cars (GM and earlier Honda hybrids) didn’t sell is that their potential owners wanted/needed? some way other than a tiny ” hybrid ” badge to prove how environmentally conscious they were. Also, the car’s shape is largely determined by it’s need to maximize aerodynamics.
I agree, the styling of the 2nd generation and subsequent generations appears just a bit too…intense? My sister has had 3 Priuses so far and loves them. I think they are bordering on ugly.
However, I have considered buying one but I am turned off by the styling, the information cluster being in the middle of the dash, and the (lack of) acceleration.
Now that Toyota has hybrid versions of nearly every CAR model it sells, and a few are even hybrid only, I would think Toyota will let the Prius just sort of fade away.
But hey, what do I know?
Well, if you don’t like the looks of a Prius, you can buy:
-A Camry hybrid.
-A Corolla hybrid.
-A RAV4 hybrid.
-A Highlander hybrid.
-A Lexus hybrid.
Don’t forget the Avalon and Sienna.
A friend just bought a Camry hybrid and likes it. He is a big guy. He tried out the Prius and Corolla hybrid and felt cramped. Only after he was ready to walk did the salesman mention the Camry version. Not everyone researches and purchases entirely on the internet. The dealer experience and product knowledge (often missing) still matter, at least for older generations.
Oddly, I saw a first gen Prius yesterday. It’s been a while.
I had a second gen as a rental car once for there or four days and was impressed by getting an average of 49+ MPG. Sure… I’d need two of them to take our four kids and two retrievers on vacation rather than the one Honda Odyssey, but that is not the point.
Likely due to getting my license in 1972, just prior to the first oil crisis, or getting my first cat in 1979, just prior to the second, I’ve never had a daily driver that got poor fuel economy. The pipeline shutdown last week brought back gas line memories!
As with Tesla today, some of the “hate” has little to do with the car and more with the attitude of some of the owners (see the SouthPark hybrid episode from years ago for a laugh).
When battery tech provides significantly more range and shorter recharge time electric cars will eventually attract folks such as me; we often take long trips of 700-1800 miles. This was underlined recently: due to the pipeline outage, close friends drove their new Tesla from KC to FL last week instead of their Honda Pilot. Their comment: it made an 18 hour trip last 23 hours, and added a hotel stay.
“Their comment: it made an 18 hour trip last 23 hours, and added a hotel stay”
Which undoubtedly cost more than the gas a 40 mpg in real life sedan like the new Malibu would have used unless you pick a non-chain hotel. My concept of a road trip is to travel at an apprecialble speed and arrive in a timely manner, not stop every 4 hours for a 1 hour recharge.
Adding five hours to the Florida trip sounds better than not being able to go at all.
Absolutely true, Jim. They had intended to take their Pilot, but wisely choose the added hours instead of quite possible stranding. With only ICE cars I wouldn’t have had that option. They are having local charging issues in FL, but primarily use a golf cart to get around there so all is OK. In KC they put in a high-amp 220 line for the garage charger but never expected to take the Tesla to FL so haven’t done it there.
I’m trying to convince them to take the Tesla out to CO from KC in June; they’re using our house for a couple of weeks. We have a Supercharger in Silverthorne, so they won’t have any local charging issues as in FL. I did tell them to charge up as they approach Denver as the elevation rise to the Divide may be a significant drain. Very interested to see.
If they put the route into the navigation system it will show them where and when to supercharge and for how long based on the parameters, you don’t always “fill ‘er up” completely as you would in a gasoline car, I wonder if they did that for the Florida route and where they are that they can’t get to a Supercharger to fill up 300 miles worth. But even the trickle charger with the 220 or using the included 110 adapter in their charging cable bag should add enough for the normal daily (2-4miles an hour depending on the car, 48-96 per 24hr day that it’s plugged in. There are also cheap adapters so it works with ANY commercial charging station.
Yes, elevation gain will affect things more than 1:1. There’s also the (newer) Supercharger station in Idaho Springs, it has about 12 stalls from what I recall and is literally next to the offramp (behind that Kum&Go gas station right in town with restaurants etc within 100 feet. Super convenient.
I’m doing a trip from here to MN next month so that’ll be interesting to see for me too. Will it take longer than a gasoline car? Of course, but it’s a vacation and we’ll probably plan our meal, rest, and lodging breaks around the Superchargers, it’ll be interesting to see what is around them, the stops can likely be put to other uses besides just sitting there with the car, unlike at the gas station – we still normally stop to eat things other than gas station food. The days of me being able to drive 18hours safely solo by myself are long gone. With a second or third willing driver though I think there wouldn’t be any overnights no matter how far the trip was.
It’s been said many times before, but Tesla’s Supercharger network (and the way it’s linked into every Tesla vehicle to prevent running out of battery) is their ace-in-the-hole.
Yeah, having to drive to a Supercharger every couple hundred miles or so, then having to wait a minimum of 30 minutes to get to 80% capacity, isn’t nearly as time-efficient as stopping at a gas station for a few minutes with a longer distance between fill-ups, but it’s getting there.
Jim: They began by following the Tesla navigation plan you’ve described, but it had them stopping at odd times that seemed to make little sense. They ended up being more satisfied with some other app they’d learned about. I don’t know if they were exclusively using Superchargers, and don’t know specifics about what they didn’t like about the nav guidance.
Part of their problem in FL is the lack of a higher-amp circuit for 110 handy to the exterior. I suspect they’ll address this. When both the Tesla and the golf cart were plugged in the draw was immediately too much. They never imagined they’d drive down in the Tesla and weren’t prepared there.
Thanks for the Idaho Springs info; I wasn’t aware they’d built one there. Enjoy the MN trip. I’ll look forward to hearing how the range worked out.
The boss of one of the biggest Toyota dealers in Europe imported a Gen.1 from Japan and showed it off to staff. As it backed out the show room it nearly run down a staff member. No noise see. ” Dangerous, won’t take off”.
Sorry, but I disagree.
The Wankel. The Turbine car.
We know how Mazda nearly went out of business over the Wankel, can you imagine the commentary Chrysler would have had if they mass produced the Turbine engine? Mazda survived with the Wankel about a decade before reintroducing the GLC without one and saving the business.
Toyota had enough big bucks to survive the typical shake down period the Prius faced. Other engine technologies attempted to be mass produced, or were massed produced, rose or fell during the initial shake down period each faced. No internet was involved in their demise.
I don’t follow. Mazda, yeah I guess to an extent they tried something new, but there were critical flaws which the Toyota hybrid system never had, and they didn’t die out. “No internet was involved in their demise”
What exactly are you disagreeing with or getting at here?
Mazda tried an idea that had already failed elsewhere and kept going with it Ford bailed them out and rebadged a lot of cars out of that deal.
“demise”.
Hell, Toyota and Mazda are literally sharing tech in this day and age. Where is this demise premise coming from? Toyota owns Mazda stock just because?
What VanillaDude was referring to (and he can correct me if I’m wrong)
was Paul’s statement about the internet haters.
“There’s never been a car like the Prius. Not just because it was the first mass-produced hybrid, but because it arrived along with the widespread adoption of the internet, which uncorked a wave of tribalism and partisanship not seen before.”
Yes the Mazda and the turbine were automotive dead ends, but they didn’t have to put up with internet hate when they were new.
And no-one has yet brought up the website I first heard about on “Click and Clack”
The “FU – H2” where you could post pics of yourself giving the finger to H2s. I did find it amusing for various reasons.
What VanillaDude was referring to (and he can correct me if I’m wrong)
was Paul’s statement about the internet haters.
The Mazda rotary and turbines never generated hate anywhere, except maybe those that bought early rotaries and had them crap out all too soon.
The Prius was in a completely different league, because of the intense partisanship over its environmental image.
There was plenty of partisan/social divide “hate” long before the internet. If you lived through the late 60’s and early 70’s, you’ll understand. Hate wasn’t invented by the internet; it just made it a lot easier for everyone to feel they could express it. Everyone now felt like they had a soapbox of their own.
My post was to expound on the “no internet was involved in their demise”.
However, Paul, I do agree with your above post. And will add that I personally, have not seen such division since the late ’60s and early ’70s in the USA.
Of course, hatred did not start with the internet. (or even in the 1960s)
No one ever said or even implied that it did in this series of posts.
It has been around as long as mankind.
I think electric cars are 90% there and range anxiety will be the next hurdle which like battery-fear, will be worked past. I was just thinking of the current crop of muscle cars, SRT Dodges and whatnot, with the painstaking efforts to extract every bit of horsepower – all squashed in 2.4(?) seconds by a Tesla in Ludicrous mode.
My partner was telling me that while he understands the art and passion in automobiles – also consider the age of the ICE, the interstate system and cardom in general as a large scale social experiment that turned out to not be such a great idea and… while it wasn’t what I wanted to hear, it was a fair statement I couldn’t really argue with. I no longer consider myself a Luddite, but just simply appreciative that we will get to see probably the greatest vehicles before transportation becomes autonomous travel boxes.
As to the Interstate system being not such a great idea I must disagree. President Eisenhower saw first hand when he was General Eisenhower just how effective the German autobahn was at moving goods and its military value to the German war effort. He knew that the US needed an interstate system for national security as well as an aid to interstate commerce. If a war was ever fought on American soil, the interstate highways would be used for military purposes and guarded. You wouldn’t stand a chance of getting your car on it.
I’ve regularly talked to older relatives who lived without cars in a small-town during the pre-interstate era. Reliance on the bus or train to get where they were going wasn’t all that great. Neither was taking two- or three-lane state roads – that invariably went right through the downtowns of every town along the way – when one wanted to get out of town.
I was ambivalent about the Prius at first, with concerns (aka doubts) about its complexity, but eventually became the owner of a Gen2 for over 100K trouble free miles. I remember the hate, or perhaps merely derision, from many friends, but also remember some serious tech guys and car guys who were early adopters. I think ICE/electric hybrid will be around for a while; despite everything Tesla has been doing to improve charging infrastructure and range, the combination of the two doesn’t always work out in the rural West of the US. Yet.
Toyota chose to under-promise and over-deliver on battery life.
This was becoming clear by the time that infamous hit piece attributing a higher lifecycle carbon cost to a Prius than a (’00s gas-powered) Hummer was published, more than a decade ago; not only did the think tank attribute the mileage lifespan of a hot-seated fleet rig to the Hummer which was purpose-built as a lifestyle bauble but they used Toyota’s original conservative battery-life estimate from 6-8 years and one full redesign before, on top of comparing it to the H3 but usually using a picture of the H2.
A couple years later the Prius became the go-to taxicab.
It was obviously false if someone is using a 6-8yr battery life to make their argument given that the federally required battery warranty is a minimum of 8 years/100k (and 10yrs/150k in CA) that would be a spectacular self-own by Toyota and a boon for any owner to have it fail and be replaced for free just before the warranty ends.
I don’t see many early Priuses anymore but I see just as few Hummers of any stripe so yeah, that didn’t seem to work out based on my anecdata.
The Prius definitely changed the world and deserves a place in any car museum next to the Model T and Beetle.
To clarify, I wasn’t saying that the battery-life estimate was 6-8 years, but that it was the one made by Toyota at the original Prius’ launch some 6-8 years prior to the hit piece being published.
As a first-time owner of a 2006 Prius, I can definitely attest to the hate it inspired. More than a few times I was flipped-off for what appeared to be no other reason than the vehicle I was driving. A very strange phenomenon which I guess comes along whenever there’s a popular niche vehicle.
I’d imagine VW Beetles got flipped-off in the sixties, then Honda Civics in the seventies. For a while, no one seemed to much like the BMW 3-series and, today, Teslas aren’t exactly popular.
I have the terrible feeling that some people just need a thing to hate, whether it’s a particular car, sports team, what have you. You could be driving a vehicle powered by a literal perpetual-motion machine and which cures the common cold in everyone it passes, and somebody would still flip you off.
Sadly, this is all too true. Human nature is such that when someone spots another human who seems to be ‘flaunting’ their intelligence, I guess some sort of jealous rage takes over, and rather than trying to understand, it’s much easier to make it known how angry they are about their own insecurities.
It would seem to go a very long way to explaining the dramatic political polarization of the US today, as well.
Gotta love the somewhat misleading statement in the ad that the battery “never needs to be recharged.” Wonder how many buyers interpreted that as saying it was some magic source of perpetual motion.
The reality is somewhat less gee-whiz. With the exception of whatever charge is put in the batteries at the factory, all of the energy in the batteries of a non-plugin hybrid comes from gasoline you pump into the tank. Even the energy that regenerative braking puts into the batteries is energy that originally came from that dastardly fossil fuel; you’re just not losing as much of it as dissipated heat. A non-plugin hybrid is merely one way of building a particularly efficient fossil fuel car.
Exactly. The hybrid system is actually just a variation of a more typical add-on system to the drivetrain like a turbocharger, the difference being that a turbocharger adds power, while a small, rechargeable battery and electric motor adds efficiency.
That’s missing the point, though. Toyota is telling buyers who’ve seen GM’s EV experiment/Toyota’s own Rav4 EV that this new, technologically advanced hybrid-electric car will give them some of the benefits of “going electric” with all the convenience of a normal car. I interpret that as telling potential buyers exactly what it is: a gasoline car with an electric drive system and battery that doesn’t require external charging. I don’t think anyone assumed Toyota developed magic, but getting 50+ mpg was unheard of in the US back when it first launched, so that figure would have stood alone regardless of if buyers thought it was “perpetual motion” gee-whiz or not. Besides, this was the defacto hybrid tech for nearly a decade before PHEVs became a thing, and again, I’d imagine most buyers would care more about mpg figures when shopping rather than actually puzzling out their energy usage across powertrains.
I hated it then and hate it now and the all electric bunch as well. For reasons Jeff and dman cite. For me in the west a gasoline Corolla is ideal.
But the hate comes from the the non-luddites too. I’m sure that those driving where that pipeline closure disrupted their lives noticed the smarmy comment by the energy secretary that you could have been driving an electric car. Nice. Eat your cake.
You’ve piqued my curiosity; as you know I like the Corolla as well, but I wonder why a Hybrid Corolla would appear to be a non-starter, I’m not seeing the downside assuming the cost is similar and it be engineered to provide basically the same power output. Likely greater usable power at our elevation due to not having losses because of that. In the end, hybrids are primarily gasoline powered.
I didn’t hear the comment but I’m guessing the energy secretary relished the opportunity to for once be able to respond to the incessant commentary of the anti-EVers that are convinced there is no force on earth that would ever stop them from being able to fill their tank with gas any time they desired. And then it was something as mundane as a cybercrime disrupting the supply chain, likely not for the last time. The same thing could of course likely happen to EV chargers, or the entire electric network, but still.
Toyota make a hybrid Corolla, Camry ,Estima and Aqua and more.
” In the end, hybrids are primarily gasoline powered.” Other than what was put in when the battery was manufactured Hybrids are solely powered by gasoline. All charging is done either directly by the ICE or from regen braking recovering stored potential energy that was originally created by the ICE.
I meant when you step on the throttle in a hybrid the motive force is provided by either the gasoline engine or the energy stored in the battery (or both concurrently). It is able to move without using gasoline if there is a charge in the battery which is an advantage at elevation due to the power remaining at it’s sea-level rating unlike the gasoline engine’s power.
The way he wrote it, it seemed like Constellation wasn’t aware that Hybrids ARE gasoline-engined cars (I’m sure he does know that), there is nothing in the design that inherently makes them less usable or having tradeoffs due to the tech involved beyond however a particular maker decided what traits should be prioritized, i.e. economy or power. Either or both can be far greater than an ICE only vehicle. and there is no external charging objection for those long trips to be brought up either. I don’t see any downside in a Hybrid whatsoever.
There are a couple of downsides to a Hybrid vs the ICE only version of the same vehicle. #1 is the higher purchase price, #2 is the reduced cargo volume in the older models.
The higher purchase price can be offset by the reduced fuel and maintenance costs. Some of that can also be recovered in a higher resale value depending on the price of gas at the time and the recent trend in gas prices.
Hi Jim: Thank you for asking. Yes, I understand the Prius mechanical set up – a gas/electric hybrid. I did not like it at first as I felt it was complicated without the need to be so, the potential cost of replacement electric guts, the dorky look of the car and image of the initial drivers. I did like the look/utility of the now obsolete Prius V wagon.
As for a current Corolla hybrid versus gasoline versus electric. Electric – range in the west, as in “made an 18 hour trip last 23 hours” (as Jeff wrote eloquently). Hybrid – why bother when gas Corolla gets great fuel mileage and is fun to drive (six speed manual)? On our last highway trip Corolla gas delivered 41 plus mpg eastbound with wind at back, 34 westbound into the wind and gets about 35/36 around town. Why get a more costly, complicated hybrid Corolla with an automatic?
On 11 May, at a White House press briefing on the pipeline cyber attack, the energy secretary said “If you drive an electric car, this would not be affecting you, clearly.”
Constellation, will you please—and thank you—back off from posting selectively-lifted soundbites and lobbing (now deleted) accusations to try to advance a particular political point of view? This really is not the right place for it.
Whoever is interested in what the Energy Secretary said and how she said it, in reply to the question she was asked and in context of the greater conversation, can read the transcript and form their own opinion on what she meant and how she meant it.
Think whether there’s any downside to a hybrid vs. ICE only version of same model vehicle depends on driving profile. Hybrid should use less fuel in city driving due to regenerative braking. This doesn’t happen on long highway drives, and the extra weight of the battery may reduce mileage slightly compared to that of the lighter ICE version of the same car. Couple of the car magazines compared mileage of Prii and diesel Golf/Jettas on long highway drives some years ago. I’d have to dig a bit to find them.
The current RAV4 AWD is available in both regular and hybrid, both use a 2.5l 4-cylinder. The Hybrid gets 50% better mileage in the city and 10% better on the highway (41/38 vs 27/34) for what I recall was a $600 cost premium which I believe is generally retained through the average ownership period as increased resale and not just a sunk cost.
@Peter N Yeah for hwy MPG the TDI was the real world winner at prue freeway MPG back in the day but that doesn’t mean that Hybrids don’t do better at freeway speeds than a gas powered version of the same car.
As Jim pointed out the current Toyotas where both gas and Hybrid are available the Hybrid wins out in the hwy numbers as well. The effect of the extra weight is minimal as the power needed to maintain a fixed speed on flat ground is only dependent on frictional and aerodynamic drag.
Weight does play a difference in stop and go and elevation changes but that also results in more kinetic and potential energy that the hybrid system recovers a large portion of.
The early Prius had a very low maximum engine off speed and thus didn’t provide as much benefit at high speeds.
It isn’t just the regen braking at play in a Hybrid’s fuel economy. Energy recovery can occur from elevation changes as well w/o touching the brake. The Atkinson like cycle improves the thermal efficiency of the ICE at high and low speeds. The increased maximum engine off speeds improved on the earlier designs too.
The published weight difference (per Car&Driver) when comparing RAV4 AWD in LE trim for regular and hybrid versions is 220lbs (3490 vs 3710lbs), so about the difference of carrying one adult male of approximately my size.
I don’t get this comment. A plug-in hybrid would mean I drive electrical nearly all the time as I rarely drive more than 10 or 15 miles in a day. Plug it in every night and I’m 100% electric except for trips to visit family.
My first ride in a Prius was shortly after they came out and I caught a ride in one while Casual Carpooling across the SF-Bay Bridge. I was lucky to be first in the wait line that morning and thus snagged the front seat when the car came around, by the time we got past the toll plaza I just couldn’t contain myself anymore and broke the cardinal rule of casual carpool – don’t speak unless the driver speaks to you first. I simply had to ask how she liked her new hybrid Prius, her face absolutely lit up, she was thrilled I knew what it was and she spent the rest of the ride demonstrating the screens and explaining everything about it to me. Within a few months they were everywhere to say nothing of after they got the carpool lane exemption; in the early days that was not yet a carrot for hybrids and thus they still casual carpooled. History was made, and I was amazed at how quiet, modern, and efficient it all was while riding in it with beautiful build quality of the minimalist interior.
The Prius ‘experiment’ is truly fascinating and, frankly, nothing short of revolutionary in terms of personal transportation. I seriously doubt there would have been any sort of real alternative to internal combustion engine (ICE) propulsion without the Prius. Or, more accurately, the 2nd generation 2004 version which truly perfected the concept. That car, alone, got everything right. Even without Toyota’s Hybrid Synergy Drive (HSD), the 2004 Prius was a pretty good car in its own right.
The bottom line is would there have been a 2009 Tesla Roadster, 2011 Nissan Leaf and Chevy Volt (the car that proved GM could still make a superior vehicle if they really tried), or 2012 Tesla Model S without the success of the 2004 Prius (let alone any of the myriad hybrid or plug-in vehicles of today)?
True EVs were always the Holy Grail, and GM’s 1997 EV-1 really kicked that into high gear. The availability of lithium-ion batteries after Sony’s introduction of them in 1991 kicked that into high gear. The true impetus for the Tesla Roadster was the 1997 AC Propulsion tzero roadster, which was converted to lithium-ion batteries in 2003. The Prius, with its NiMH battery had essentially no influence on the tzero, and the Tesla Roadster that it inspired.
First of the hybrid synergy breed it succeeded like few other new ideas this country is geared to cars public transport is haphazard and unpopular it seems and COVID social distancing hasnt helped, petrol retails around $10 per gallon imp, diesel is cheaper but you get nailed with road user tax, hybrids are popular I spend my days in Auckland traffic jams and Ive started noticing the huge range of hybrids we have here Toyota make a hybrid everything it seems, Nissan isnt far behind plus they have pure electric cars and vans using Leaf like tech Hybrid trucks from Toyota(HINO) are here and some have clocked massive mileages as rentals.
All brought about by this Prius.
Hybrid and eventually full electric are where things are going, it is just a matter of how quickly we get there. I had no interest in the early hybrids, for the multiple reasons as stated above. My wife’s 2021 rav4 hybrid has no downsides, 0-60 in about 7 seconds, awd, and average lifetime mpg of 42.9. I don’t really think anyone will really miss internal combustion once that sun sets.
It’s kind of hard for car guys to embrace something a sizable portion of the then buying demographic of Priuses believed the worst thing to happen to humanity and planet earth was the proliferation of the automobile. I wonder if the Prius would have been such a lightning rod had it retained the dorky but in reality rather invisible first gen styling, the much more identifiable second gen is where all the scorn really went in my recollection, in the great automotive polarization of the 2000s I imagine a light blue gen II Prius at one end and a bright yellow Hummer H2 at the other, pretty solid odds that the drivers of either wouldn’t become friends on first impressions.
South Park summed up the Prius phenomenon pretty perfectly as the hybrids much of the town went gaga for went on to create a severe smug problem among residents, talking down to wasteful SUV owners and giving a closed eyed “good for you” and “thaaaaaanks!” to each other whenever they’d cross paths.
The juxtaposition of a light-blue, 2nd gen Prius and bright-yellow Hummer H2 is perfect. But the most ironic thing is the rebirth of Hummer as a full EV.
Looks like we know who won that battle…
Excellent point!
I’d say neither won really, Hummer got killed off in the bankruptcy but retained enough interest and demand in used models in its wake to spur a revival (albeit under the GMC umbrella), while the Prius’s then socially responsible image has been largely passed to Tesla, the hybrid concept itself may stick around for a very long time but it’ll be more akin to fuel injection in the ICE engine’s history, the Prius as a model however loses its purpose in life every year EVs get better.
Perhaps the Hummer EV is a case of “we’re not so different, you and I”. A sizable portion of the Hummer demo wanted them for the brash look at me image to exert masculinity and toughness, and and a sizable contingent of the Prius demo wanted to project knowledge and consciousness.
I’ve been very happy with our 3rd-gen Prius, with over 63,000 trouble-free miles and a lifetime fuel economy of just under 46 mpg (calculated the old-fashioned way: miles driven divided by gallons consumed). The hatchback body style means it can hold an surprisingly large amount of cargo with the rear seats folded.
Pictured below is the car (a 2014 model) being driven by our younger son last week back to his home in Brooklyn, NY. We donated it to him in exchange for his aging 2004 Toyota Camry with over 213,000 miles.
In the Phoenix area a majority of Uber & Lyft cars are Prii.
On an oil & gas job I was doing in West Texas about ten years ago, a Prius was all that the rental car company had the day I needed a car. I reluctantly took it. I thought I was driving a tin can powered by a trio of firld mice. I got laughed off the drilling site.
I suppose these cars had their purpose, but certainly not at job sites where construction was going on. I made a promise to myself that I would never again be caught dead in one of these tin cans.
Pray do tell, what will you be caught dead in then? (Major eyeroll) So people who make fun of you become your go to as to what you do and don’t like? Prius all day, every day. Period.
I wonder what people in the oil trades such as who Anthony describes will make of things like the upcoming F150 EV – It’s a “real” truck and Ford presumably thinks it will eventually supplant the regular ones to some degree. Yet it doesn’t use petroleum products for propulsion. So is it Yay or Nay? The same goes for the already on sale Hybrid version of it.
Regarding the Hybrid and the Texas petroleum industry employees, considering what happened last year with the power outages and extreme rates if you did have power, the Hybrid version might be popular so that those people can have gasoline powered homes.
You got “laughed off the drilling [site]”, eh? How did that work, exactly? They laughed so hard you…what? Had to turn around and leave in fear for your life?
Or did you actually get to the site (in the Prius), accomplish whatever it was you needed to do there, and get back to the airport (in the Prius)?
What is it like to invest this heavily in others’ opinion of what car you’re driving?
The fact that the one person who took the Prius hate side in this comment thread got ganged up on for saying so is kinda why people like Anthony don’t like Priuses.
Have to agree with you though I like the new Priuses. Its an attitude thing which I dont get. Battery production pollutes the same as oil extraction in the main. I think everyone needs to relax about this stuff.Nothing I like better than a high mileage vehicle but I’d also drive a sixties Pontiac any day of the week. Life is short.
Had a 2000 in grass green as a nearly new company car. I loved it. More people stopped to ask and admire it than the 66 Mustang or the 71 SS Chevelle I had a the time. Never had a lick of trouble and it drove very nice. Still see one occasionally on the road. Never understood the hate – jealousy really.
Hybrids drew hate in the early days, and even now in their apparent twilight. For the first decade, I was one of those haters. Though I liked the idea of mixed gas-electric propulsion, I hated the Prius itself for all its futurism and “extremelining,” as I call it. I didn’t even want to fold myself under a shoulder-high roofline to drive a sports car, let alone a slow car. The Japanese comic-book styling only got worse through the years. Even though I’m an unapologetic environmentalist, I became so disintrested in the Prius that I forgot to hate them.
Today, any day, I could spend hours on the net defending my own despised hybrid, the Ford C-Max. (Forgotten now, it was actually the second-best selling hybrid in the US). Now the hate comes from Tesla owners and other EV True Believers. Hybrids are a halfway measure, they shout, and a half-a##ed compromise (and you know how Americans love compromise). Every vehicle should be all-electric, everywhere, ASAP! And I would answer that my plug-in Energi has given me 65 mpg over 50K miles and dropped my combined gas/juice driving expenses to 3 cents per mile. I point out that my car’s EV battery weighs only 250 pounds, so it claims a quarter of the natural resources of a long-range EV’s battery. I report that it’s been quick, quiet, roomy, smooth-riding and trouble-free. Best of all, unlike an EV, the car demands zero operational compromise from me, meaning it’s always ready to go any distance at anytime.
But nobody’s mind has been changed- except for mine. The people I’m talking to have either invested in an EV and need to defend their choice, or they’re arguing abstract engineering principles about cars they haven’t driven.
Ten years ago I wouldn’t have expected to be driving a hybrid. But that’s how I roll- just slightly behind the times.
Never hated them, but always preferred the look of the Honda Civic Hybrid. Unfortunately, unlike Toyota, Honda seemed to have trouble with its battery technology.
It was not just battery technology, but an under engineered product. A heavier, less aerodynamic car with the original Insight system and a bigger engine. I wanted one, until I looked into it. A flywheel mounted motor-generator would never come even close to Toyota’s brilliant Hybrid Synergy Drive.
Re: EV recharging- In an essay for The New Yorker, the noted environmentalist and carbon-killer Bill McKibben reported on his own recent experience trying to drive his electric Kia Niro for long distance through New England.
“I was going to have to use a public charging station along the way. If you take a casual glance at the various apps designed to help you find chargers, it appears to be no problem—pins pop up on the map all along the obvious interstate highway routes. Further investigation, however, shows that most of them are, essentially, useless: they’re slow chargers designed for overnight use, or they’re in lots next to businesses where employees park in the spaces for the day. I’d been experimenting the week before, visiting a charger a few towns away from my home. After twenty-three minutes (I got bored of waiting), it had added only enough juice to drive me fourteen miles, and at a cost of $4.13, which is equivalent to buying gasoline for twelve dollars a gallon.”
He goes on to recount his nervous return journey, which depended on the sole public (non-Tesla) recharge resource en route, a Whole Foods charger that was in use when he arrived. “I had, it turned out, enough juice in the tank to make it to a shopping mall near my mom’s house. In the vast parking lot, there was one fast charger, and, miraculously, it was available. So I filled up, and we had our celebration. The next day, on the way home, I tried again to stop at the Whole Foods in New Hampshire. The plug was in use once more, so I swallowed hard, did a little math, and drove on, arriving home with red lights flashing on the dashboard and a display indicating that my range was down to two miles. That’s cutting it close—almost as close as we’ve cut it on climate change. It’s time for our leaders to step up their game.
“Apart from the early adopters, people will not buy E.V.s as long as the charging situation remains a mess.”
Sadly, this sums up, all too well, trying to make a long distance EV journey in anything other than a Tesla. It’s just not feasible without any kind of major anxiety. Non-Tesla DCFC stations are few and far between and, even then, there’s a high probability they might not even be available, anyway.
Until that situation is resolved, non-Tesla EVs are going to be limited to local urban use.
I’m sorry but that sounds like a very lopsided article in the anti-EV direction. Fact is the popular 3rd party apps for finding charging stations have filters, for plug type, network and charge rate. They also usually have pricing info and current availability. Of course you can also use the provider’s app/web site for the specifics of their stations and current status.
So either he is really lazy or he had the conclusion in mind and sat out to gather the data that supported it.
I cannot see one of these early Priuses and not think of “Curb Your Enthusiasm”.
As we didn’t get them here that’s my major frame of reference as well.
One of my tenants worked for Toyota HQ in Torrance and brought home one of these in the other popular color, tea green. Instead of him driving it to work everyday, less than six miles, she commuted to Irvine, 40 miles. It was ugly, but worked flawlessly.