This is from the “PS” feature on the last page of the March 1966 Road & Track. And does it ever speak to me, as one who has perpetually had issues with useless dead-air overhangs. And yes, only the front and rear overhangs were cut in this fine pre-PS chop. The trunk would have been smaller, but fold down rear seats would have mitigated that. And in the front, it was all dead air up there.
One can only speculate how much better the handling would have been. As to its looks, try to erase you mental image of the real Totornado, and just pretend that this had been it instead. It might take a minute or two, but it will probably grow on you. Or shrink, I mean.
That shorter Toronado reminds me of that one mentionned on Hemmings blog. https://www.hemmings.com/stories/2008/10/31/toronado-serendipity-the-long-and-the-short-of-it-hah
I’d have guessed the “long of it” to be the George Barris creation:
In the Summer of 67 or 68 I saw a “stretch” Toronado in Wheeling, Illinois just S. of the Pal-Waukee (now Chicago Executive) airport. I think it was either silver or light gray. It was filling up on gas at the next pump to me. I was just amazed at this car as I really liked Toronado’s and a limo was beyond my imagination. This was a local Chicago area car as about 2010 I saw an ad in a local car paper for the same car as it had small coach lights right behind the rear doors which looked kind of “tacky” considering how classy this limo was. No idea what happened to it or where it is now, but it had been in the Chicago area about 10 years ago and was for sale.
They did build an even shorter version to use as a push car at the plant in Lansing.
Flat bumpers on both ends & shortened in the middle.
https://images.app.goo.gl/Hi7QomGTd4xbRcQcA
And let’s not forget the ones used as float plane tugs.
That image from Road & Track just doesn’t do it for me. The one in Hemming’s is compelling though. Bill Mitchell may have been on to something with the station wagon. How about a hearse with an Eldorado drivetrain but the standard Fleetwood body? The commercial body companies could have also adapted the clamshell tailgate from the later GM B-body station wagons. Did someone say body? Yes, three times and none referred to the passenger who had passed.
Shorter overhangs (at least in front) would have helped, but the Toronado really should have been a sedan or even a station wagon, and I would have stretched the rear seat area a few inches as well for better rear seat legroom. In that car the flat floor would have been a significant advantage, as the front and rear center seating positions were routinely used in those days before crossovers, four-door short-bed pickups, or minivans took over family-hauling duty.
It’s not just the overhangs, it’s been shortened anywhere the body lines were straight. It’s lost a foot of cabin/door at least. The problem here isn’t the idea, only that they went too far, just like the Toronado itself. Ideal would just be somewhere in between.
I think the ideally proportioned Toronado is… a 68 Cutlass!
https://www.hemmings.com/stories/2014/11/17/driven-front-wheel-drive-1968-oldsmobile-a-body
You have a point. All the positives of the Toro and none of the negatives. The R&T photo screams AMX at me – which may very well be where AMC got the idea.
Yes, and then Hornet:Gremlin. Mercedes C230 sedan:C230K coupe. BMW 3 series sedan: 3 series hatchback.
The other way too – Mercedes R107 SL: C107 SLC.
And back to Toronado, there was the Toro based Jetway 707 six wheeled airport limo.
I thought AMX the second I saw it.
The R&T stubby looks shortened for shortening’s sake. Like there was a page that the editor had to fill in a hurry with zero thought going into it.
I could knock out a publication-ready version of that in Photoshop fast. In 1966, it took a whole lot more than the ‘zero thought’ idea that it appears to be today. However it was done, it was doubtless a whole day’s work.
My understanding from what’s printed is that the illustration was crafted and submitted by (reader) **Dr. Engstrom** rather than an R&T staffer. Preliminary Googling suggests he could still be with us, 55 years later, living in PA or NJ…….
That’s really cool, it’d be really nice if he finds this and comments. I would like to know how he did it.
If Joh Beltz, the general manager of Oldsmobile had his way, the Toronado would have probably resembled something like this. He wanted it to be a smaller vehicle but was over
ruled by GM management.
Actually the original design was a little better apportioned than the picture. The original “Flame Red Car” design was intended to be a mid sized car. Per Ed Cole’s request, Olds had to stretch the design so it could share the “E” body of the Cadillac Eldorado. Olds did a pretty good stretch job, but it would have looked better as a mid sized car.
It’s too bad that Oldsmobile didn’t win out entirely there. The Eldorado and Riviera would’ve been improved by moving to Cutlass-sized. That’s where they ended up, a tidier package.
I wonder if it was just too many “firsts” to swallow for GM management, intermediates were still basically mass market sedan variations like Cutlasses for pretty much the rest of the big three, andthe only coupes in 1966 that used a body with no sheetmetal shared with its segment sibling were the Mustang and the full size Rivieras and Thunderbirds. FWD was daring enough, but the additional notion to put a prestige car on a smaller platform in addition probably didn’t go over too well. GM never did that until the 69 Grand Prix which wasn’t anything special mechanically.
It looks like they enlarged the wheels/tires.
I’d like to see the original-length trunk with less slope, so it doesn’t peter out as much. That would be more modern (but less distinctive).
Thank you for finding that R&T page, Paul—I’ve had that image in my mind since 1966, and despaired of seeing it again. The car is stubbier than I had recalled, but my approval remains intact. As an aid to our mental comparison to the original design, here they are together.
To compensate for the illusion that, at the same scale, Dr Engstrom’s version looks taller, I have actually reduced his car by a couple of percent from its correct scale; measure wheel diameter and overall body height in the two images to confirm that. To the eye, the wheels appear identical in size (though GM might have ovalized them slightly in their image ?).
If the Toronado had simply been done on a smaller scale, it surely wouldn’t have attracted this sort of thinking, which hasn’t a zot of the sheer elegance in the over-dimensional original.
Be fascinating to see the front of this theoretical model, though. I understand Mitchell specified those poking-forward wing blades because he thought the tall powerpack of the Torrie would make the front too bluff if it stopped about where the engine did. And for sure, the side view of the modified one gives a hint that that may well be so.
Drop a turbo Buick V6 in there, and you could shorten the front overhang like that.