In the fall of 2011, I had reached the difficult decision to trade in my beloved but thirsty Marauder in on something newer and easier on gas, which would become my girlfriend’s car while I would take over her Oldsmobile Alero (subject of last week’s COAL). The only question was what would replace it. I solicited my girlfriend’s input, since she would be driving it, and returned with three directives and a preference—it should be good on gas (and not require premium), have an automatic transmission, and should be easy to maneuver and park. The preference? She would strongly prefer a coupe.
Not a coupe in the strictest sense, depending on your ideological purity about that term. Basically, two doors. Since the halcyon days of the compact coupe in the 80’s and early 90’s were well behind us, that narrowed the selection down a good bit. I started out looking at lightly used Civic two-doors, but the price that was invariably asked for cars that were a few years old and higher mileage seemed a little absurd to me. Such is the dilemma of the used-car shopper in that realm, I found out. Buying a desirable compact in the 1 to 3 years old range generally meant either accepting undesirable mileage or an undesirable price tag.
So I refocused. The more I thought about it, the more a lease seemed to make sense. I know the arguments against leasing are many, and in many cases it’s not the most financially sound decision. But it made sense at the time—I was looking for a low down payment and reasonable monthly payments, and with the changes going on in our life at the time (my girlfriend was in the process of selecting a master’s degree program in Occupational Therapy and I was planning to propose marriage) the fixed term and opt-out possibility at the end seemed appealing. Plus, at age 31 I’d still never owned anything less than three years old, and the idea of driving off the lot in something brand new may have played a part.
Obligatory interior night shot. Pardon the fact that it needs a good cleaning!
Proceeding with that idea, I narrowed down my list of possibilities further, and many contenders were crossed off for various reasons. Focus and Veloster (troublesome dual-clutch automatics), Scion tC and Subaru Impreza (thirsty), GTI and Civic Si (too expensive), and Corolla and Sentra (too boring) bit the dust, along with a handful of others. That left me with four main possibilities: Honda Civic, Hyundai Elantra, Kia Forte, and Mazda 3. First up was the Civic coupe, which was receiving quite a lot of negative press over the new-for-2012 redesign that seemed to be a retrograde step from the previous car. Having driven the older model, I had to agree with that assessment. The ’05-’11 cars were a fresh, almost futuristic design at the time, and had aged well in my opinion. The ’12 model just seemed more…ordinary. There was nothing wrong with it; it drove nicely, had the best dashboard design of anything I looked at, and was styled attractively. It just did nothing for me.
The Elantra was next, and I liked it better than the Civic. It was more expressively styled outside, with a nicely finished tan and black interior. Behind the wheel, though, it felt oddly tall compared to the other cars I was looking at, plus the suspension was clearly tuned for comfort at the expense of handling. It didn’t handle badly, but it just wasn’t sharp. And while the fuel economy was impressive (claimed 40 MPG highway) the 1.6 liter four seemed a little poky. Also, it only came in sedan format—the short-lived Elantra coupe was still a year away at this point. I had meanwhile been emailing back and forth with the local Mazda dealer about the 3i, and I was definitely interested. But I couldn’t seem to get a clear answer from them on lease rates, so I decided to stop by the Kia dealership next and look at the Forte Koup.
Leaving aside the intentional misspelling of “Koup”, it was another attractive car. The shape was reminiscent of the 8th-generation Civic coupe, but it wasn’t entirely derivative, with the Kia “tiger nose” front fasica, flared fenders, and a nifty faux hardtop roofline with concealed b-pillars. The standard alloys on the EX trim were finished in gunmetal rather than silver, a nice touch. Plus I’d seen an arresting shade of blue as one of the available colors on the web site. I stopped by my local Kia dealership and started a conversation about the Forte with one of the sales staff. He asked if there was one in particular I was interested in, and I asked if they had any Koups in Corsa Blue. They did, and we went for a spin.
Entering the car, I was greeted by an expanse of black. The Koup was only available with the black interior, and they were serious about it. A few chrome accents provided some relief, and the area around the center stack was finished in a shiny piano black rather than the matte of the rest of the dash. Other than the gray headliner, black was the order of the day elsewhere. I don’t like black interiors, never have, but I decided to give it a chance anyway. And the seats were comfortable, the controls well-placed, and it had an acceptable amount of room for a 2-door compact.
As to driving impressions? The power was adequate, with the 2.0 liter four delivering 156 horsepower and 143 lb-ft torque. The engine was mated to a 6-speed automatic that went about its business with a minimum of hunting. The only flaw with the powertrain is auditory—the 2.0 is a rather coarse-sounding affair when worked hard, Handling was reasonably sharp, and the ride was better than I’d have expected for a car that size. Concluding the test drive we talked trade-in. I indicated that I’d be selling the Marauder privately, as I doubted I could get what I wanted in trade-in. “Try me” was the response, so I came back with a number a few hundred dollars less than what I thought I’d ask private-party. He disappeared for a few moments and, rather than countering, told me they could do that. To say I was shocked was an understatement (this was $2200 higher than the offer from Carmax, for comparison’s sake). I went home, I thought about it, I asked my girlfriend if she was interested. She was, so we went back the next night for a test drive, and a couple hours later, we were driving off the lot in a Forte Koup with 27 miles on the odometer.
If you’d told me five years before that I’d be buying (well, leasing) a Kia, I’d probably have given you a funny look, if not questioned your mental competence. Their compact offering in 2006, the Spectra, was a car that sold mainly on price. It was a world better than the horrid Sephia with which they’d come into the USA market in the mid 90’s, but to say it was nothing special is generous. But ever since Hyundai took over the company after a 1998 bankruptcy, Kia had been quietly upping its game. And when the Spectra gave way to the Forte in 2008, it was the vanguard of a transformation of the Kia lineup into the kind of cars you buy because they’re competent, well-engineered, well-equipped, even – at times – compelling. Plus the well-promoted 10 year/100,000 mile powertrain warranty helped a lot. Peace of mind is hard to put a price on.
Life with the Kia has been relatively uneventful, at least in the mechanical sense. We’ve had to take it in for warranty service only once. Sometime within the first six months, the front driver’s side tweeter speaker mount simply fell out one day when closing the door. The entire piece of plastic was left dangling by the speaker wires. Not a particularly good omen for quality control, but not exactly a big deal either. While there, I mentioned that the paintwork along the character ridges in the hood looked a little suspect, more of a “for future reference” in case it ever started delaminating or chipping there. They fixed the tweeter mount (I suspect it just needed glue) and made note of the paint.
And…that’s been it. 51,000 miles and a little more than four years in, nothing else. It’s needed only routine maintenance and, recently, new tires. Compared to the maintenance adventure that was the Alero, it was nice to have at least one car that was trouble-free. I’m a believer in Kia quality at this point. The bumper-to-bumper portion of the warranty expires at 60k, leaving the powertrain and corrosion coverages to 100k, but nothing leads me to expect trouble. The paint “problem area” looks no different after 4 years, so I don’t suspect it will ever be a problem. The engine does have a bit of a clatter on cold startup, but visiting the forums for these cars, evidently that’s something the 2.0 does pretty much universally. It doesn’t affect performance at all and the engine still has another 49k of warranty, so I’m not worried.
The other facets of life? In short, it’s been a great little car (with apologies to Mazda). My wife loves it, which is the important thing since her current job (pediatric Occupational Therapist) has her driving around pretty much all day. Between in-home visits for therapy, the car is her office, and has to be reliable. No concerns there and the gas mileage has been solid (tends to average about 27 MPG in mixed city-biased driving). I still think it’s a good-looking car, and in fact I like the looks better than the newer generation which bowed in 2013. And the paint color is fantastic—while it’s a somewhat unremarkable car in the grand scheme of things, the brilliant Corsa Blue paint gets a lot of compliments.
Despite not being the most generous in interior room, it’s also become our long-distance car, as it’s by far the most reliable and newest thing in our driveway. It does surprisingly well on the highway—while bad road surfaces (of which there are a lot in central VA) can make the ride choppy, other than that it works well. The A/C is cold and the heat hot, it has Sirius/XM radio (which I love despite the montly subscription being a bit pricey) and good speakers, and the seats are comfortable even on multi-hour jaunts. It took us to our wedding, to and from the beach countless times (a 3-hour trip from our previous or our current locations) and anywhere else we’ve cared to go.
Complaints? Very few. I wish the engine noise was a little less intrusive. The trunk is quite acceptably sized for a compact coupe, but the opening is on the small side due to the near-fastback roofline. As I’ve previously mentioned, I don’t care for the monochromatic black of the interior, and the rear-seat accomodations are tight. And I wish it had a sunroof, but that would have been a $1500 premium. All minor quibbles in the grand scheme of things.
Quietly, almost without notice, the Koup has been creeping up the ranks of long-term ownership. At four years plus, it’s graced our driveway longer than anything except the ’79 Malibu, Alero, or Marauder, and it will pass the Marauder’s tenure in November. The lease term ended last February, and looking at the buyout price versus the relative value of the car on the open market, it was a pretty easy decision to take that option rather than walking away.
So with all these positives you’d think we may have found another “keeper”? Sadly, I doubt that; the main reason lies in the coupe format. Having settled in Richmond after my wife finished grad school, and having bought a home, we’ve been considering that the time to start a family may be upon us. And while we haven’t quite crossed that threshold yet, the mere idea of trying to wrangle a car seat into the rather tight rear accommodations of the Koup gives me a backache. It’s just not suited to that duty, to say nothing of the large amount of Stuff that seems to follow modern children around. Plus, despite the FWD layout, it’s not all that great in snow (and we seem to have moved to a neighborhood that is lackadaisically plowed, if last month’s snowfall is any indication). So I think the Kia’s eventual fate will be trade on a small SUV/CUV.
However we’re not there yet. And I predict that until the time when rear doors are needed, the Kia will continue its residency in our driveway. The relationship between me, my wife, and the Forte Koup has been quite a good one, and buying it was a decision that has paid dividends in peace of mind, economy, and practicality with a dash of style.
I actually like the “Koupe” spelling, Then again I also kinda liked Plymouth’s “Expresso” name. It’s cute,but not over the top. I can only speak to the styling of this car. (My only “furrin” vehicle was a Honda, and it had 2 wheels…..) I think it’s a rather nice looking 2 door (the styling seems “tight”) The color is awesome (not 50 shades of boring….). Even a sedan guy like myself misses the coupes and 2Dr sedans (and,really CARS!) I’m happy to see a modern coupe (err,Koupe…) with a little style!
And, Natch… I misspelled “Koup”! LOL!
James Slick:
Yeah! Kind of like having “Kompressor” on
a turbo Mercedes trunklid. 🙂
My neighbor owns one this same color.
“Kompressor” is no typo.It is correctly spelled, just in a foreign language.
I think that VC means that “Kompressor” is on supercharged Mercedes models, not on the turbocharged.
I didn’t know that, I assumed turbocharged too, My M-B knowledge lacking. I guess Kompressor could reasonably describe a supercharger or turbocharger. Being a Buick guy I thought “turbo”, but then Buick did superchargers too.
I was agreeing with Slick that I thought
Koupe was cool – like Kompressor. And
who says Koupe was a misspelling?
That’s the problem with us Yanks. We think
any other spelling beside our own is “wrong”.
And it’s pronounced just like a FORT in the
military. Not “fort-ay”. UGG-gh-gh…!
Forte pronounced “fort” is French for strength. Forte pronounced “for-tay” is musical speak for “loudly,” and fits in well with Hyundai and Kia’s other musical names (Rondo, Sonata, Cadenza, Accent).
I’ve always pronounced it “for-tay”.
Yup, “forte” is one of those words that just drives people nuts! In the case of the Kia, you’re right. “fortay” would be the correct pronunciation, alluding to music, artistic names seeming to be Kia’s “fort”! IE: ‘Hitting the baseball is not that pitcher’s forte (fort), but he does like his tunes played forte (fortay)”
Well, we Americans ruined the word by
pronouncing it always as for-tay – including
the news anchors.
Oh,yeah, like when they say nevahda (Nevada), I’m from Pennsylvania (Pennsivania, if you’re a Pixburger, LOL) and even I know its neVADa! calling the composer Wagner anything other than “vaugner” is another.
Right, Wagner…also famous for his Germanic impression of the pizza.
Wunderbar!, or since this IS a car blog..Fahrvergnügen!
Yes, quite amazing. He was also capable of giving it a Texan twist !
LOL! But, as everyone “knows” American Pizza is either New York style or Chicago style. (unless Hawaiian style is real or is that only in Pittsburgh?)
I sell Kias and it is pronounced “For-tay”
I think that KIA still has a few more years “in the sweet spot” for buyers. That is, their reputation has not quite caught up with the current quality of their cars, This keeps their dealers willing to deal, and used prices somewhat surpressed, resulting in great deals on darn good cars.
I don’t know how much longer this situation will last though – KIA is selling some really beautiful designs now, and I am seeing more and more of them every day.
You can thank Peter Schreyer for that; he jumped to Kia a few years ago from Audi. I agree that Kia and Hyundai are one strong NHV lesson away from Toyota and Honda; their designs are certainly adventurous.
Good move on the Sirius/XM. I can’t live without it….commercial radio drives me nuts; one you establish listening patterns (the kid’s music on the way to school, mine on the way home), you really appreciate the no commercial life (unless you listen to any one of the talk or comedy stations). The variety on SXM is astounding, although they dropped the 2nd symphonic station a while back and that has aggravated me.
SXM is somewhat negotiable. At the end of your term call to cancel and they hand you over to a retainer agent. I feel $90 a year is a very reasonable swap of my money for their service. Oddly enough this last go around they insisted I pay $25 for 6 months, which again, I would have paid $90 for a year. You can also google for their latest deals out there in coupon land.
“NHV”.. that a radio station?
Noise-Harshness-Vibration
Thanks Dave M.!
Sorry, I ‘don’t do’ acronyms. 😉
I really think the argument against leasing is propounded largely by people who are bad at math, or don’t actually do the math. Or is aimed at the person who could buy an Accord and drive it for 12 years rather than lease a BMW 3 series and pay out the nose forever.
I have a friend who leases a Cruze and I think he pays something like $99/month. I’ve seen Advertisements for the Sonata lease at $159/month. Down payments can be negotiated down/away and mileage can be negotiated as well. Let’s say, for example, you lease a Sonata for $159/month and negotiate 0 down and an acceptable number of miles/year. You end up paying $1,920 in lease payments for the car for the year, for a perpetually new car.
Compare that with the Dave Ramsey Beater that he is always touting. That $1000 beater (in Atlanta is dead) so to get a car that runs at all will be $1500. Then, that $1500 beater will require another $500-$1000 worth of new tyres and other repairs within the next 6 months to keep it running, so now you are at $2000/$2500 per year. Assuming said beater lasts a year. It could last longer, but I think really a year is about what you can get out of a $1500 car. You could save money, but your other problem is that what are you going to drive while the beater is being repaired? Plus, you are faced with the worry of constant breakdown and is this a $150 fix or a $1500 fix?
Then there’s the new car alternative. I’m not sure how much a Kia Forte costs new but let’s say around 25K, if you keep it 12 years, which is about normal life expectancy, without major repairs, you’re at the same cost per year.
Even the 2 year old used car, which Dave Ramsey is always touting as an alternative, with 30K miles (you know those were hard rental miles) has, at 12K average miles a year, 2 and a half years of use on it. If you figure by above calculations each year of use at about $2k, you need well over a $5k discount from new price to save any money, and with incentives, rebates, and lower financing costs, used cars can be more expensive than new ones.
I, personally, drive too many miles to consider leasing and would either buy a new new car and drive it into the ground or a classic car and expect to dump money into it as a used purchase, but I do think leasing makes sense.
It does only work if you can stay within the mileage limit (12k/yr is pretty common, and you can negotiate more but it’ll cost you). That wasn’t an issue, as we were only at 36k of the allowable 39k when the term ended. Since then, as my wife now drives all day for her job, we’ve put another 15k on the car inside of a year. So the eventual replacement for the Koup won’t be a lease!
Also, from personal experience, don’t ever lease a car if you plan to move across state lines. Good. F$@king. Grief. Trying to get the registration moved from North Carolina to Virginia on a leased vehicle was one of the most colossal PITAs I’ve ever been through. I think it ended up requiring about a month and 9 different trips to the DMV.
I had a vaguely similar experience about 6 months ago. I had a 97 Civic that was closing in on 300K miles and seemed about ready for another $500 repair, as seemed to be the case every 8 to 10 months. Then, while on my way home from my father’s funeral (a round trip of nearly 2200 miles) I had a ball joint break apart. I reluctantly had the car fixed but started looking seriously at a new or at least newer car. Thinking I wanted another Civic or a comparable small car, I combed through all available sources and came to the same conclusion you did: for the price I wanted to spend, any 3 year old compact 2 or 4 door had more mileage than I was comfortable with.
I would have looked at a Kia Koup, or any Kia as there are 3 dealers within 45 minutes of my home but after looking at the online reviews for all 3 (universally poor), plus the 2 dealerships closest to me have very “fishy” looking tv commercials (they are currently promising to give an extra $7,000 for ANY vehicle you trade) I went the exact opposite direction that you took and bought a reasonably well-kept ’09 Ford Crown Victoria ex-police car.
I am strongly considering replacing it with another, new (er) Ford, though. My next car will be a red Fiesta “similar” to the 1980 model I had 30+ years ago….or a Mustang, that part hasn’t been nailed down yet
A very nice looking Koup indeed! Given that Kia designer Peter Schreyer recycled the whole roof (and other aspects) from his Audi A5 coupe, why wouldn’t it be? Hiring Schreyer away from Audi was a brilliant move by Kia, and now he’s in charge of both Kia and Hyundai design.
Who would have thought that cars like Kia would have world-class design 15-20 years ago?
Interesting, I had always thought that Walter de Silva was responsible for the A5, or at least seems to be widely credited for it. He also seems to take credit for it, being quoted as saying it’s his favorite design work. Shreyer did the A2 and the TT.
You’re right; i should have said “the” Audi coupe, not “his”.
I don’t mean this as a disrespectful view towards this post but an exploratory look into mine or others hatred of this brand…. or maybe it’s just me. I’m not a badge snob by any means and I tend to have a love of the lesser-loved and the underdogs of the car world; but I have a burning hatred of Kias and, to a lesser extent, Hyndais. They’ve always been, to me, the anti car lover’s appliance for getting from point a to point b. And when they were designed with some personality, they looked like a Chinese knockoff of a better Japanese car. The Forte can easily be confused for a Civic while the Soul (the way-too-popular model in my area of SC) looks to have some character until you look at the foreign market Daihatsu Materia or Suzuki Swift.
I know that their dependability has greatly improved and that they’ve actually become more competitive against Japanese and American cars and CUVs, but I just can’t get past that hokey KIA badge and the memories of the first generation Sephias and Sportages.
Is there anyone else that feels this way towards Korean cars or am I the only one?
You’re undoubtedly not the only one. But I would respectfully suggest you try to move on from that perspective. While both Kia and Hyundai still have room for a bit of improvement in certain respects, they truly are competitive world-class cars.
And Peter Schreyer (former Audi design head) has done wonders with KIA’s designs; some of them are the best in their class. Obviously, that’s subjective, but the only derivative aspect of Kia’s design is the influence from Audi, which is hardly a bad thing.
I am truly impressed at how quickly these two companies have improved over such a short time frame. Burt then look at how well other Korean companies have done in smart phones, other electronics, appliances, etc. Koreans are very competitive, and the fruits of their hard work are all-too obvious.
I still have a Samsung microwave oven I got in the early 1990s, So certainly South Korean products are the equal to any on earth (and better than some).
I only need to step out of my house and walk around to see how far Hyundai and Kia have come. I live in an area with a strong union tradition and as recently as the mid ’90s imports were few and far between. Even with a Toyota dealer in town (which for years was a sideline business for the local Dodge store) there just weren’t that many on the road. Today imports are as common here as anywhere else, with an especially large population of Kias. Thanks to an nearby dealer that opened up a few years back, even oddballs like the Koup are a regular sight on local roads.
As for the Dodge/Toyota dealer, they lost their Dodge franchise in the purge of 2009, moved the Toyota side of the operation into the palatial former Dodge showroom and haven’t looked back.
Nick,
I used to feel the same as you regarding the early Kias; especially the early Sportage. I thought they looked like gussied up golf carts. Then I saw the consumer reports on them…..ugh!
My opinion changed when my friend and co worker got a new 2008 Sportage. Before that he had a 2001 Ford mini van (Windstar?) that was fading fast! For less than the used three year old Accord I had just purchased, he got a brand new vehicle that was attractive, roomy, and more well equipped than my Accord, including remote start!
I’ve ridden and driven in it many times over the years and it continued to impress me. In my friend’s seven years of ownership, nothing ever broke…and he treated it like a “work truck.”
During the years of his ownership, I asked him to sell to it to me several times but he always refused saying he was enjoying it too much. The only reason he parted with it last Spring was because his father in law was experiencing financial difficulties and needed a vehicle. So Kevin, being a good son in law turned the car over to him. The last time I saw it, it looked and drove as fresh as the day he bought it new.
That Sportage impressed a lot of people at work so much so that another co worker bought a fully loaded Sportage….with very comfortable leather seats!
When it came time to replace my Accord, I looked seriously at a Kia, something I thought I would never do. I would have bought one but the Honda dealer presented me with an offer I couldn’t refuse.
Ex-G.F. had a Festiva back in the day and I was impressed with it’s efficiency and ruggedness. From that point on Kias would be on my “could own” list.
I used to think the same thing, Nick. I would never have considered going into a Kia dealership. When we were last looking, the Mrs. stopped into one and made me come and look at the Sorento she had test driven. Completely by accident, I saw a Sedona parked next to it. We bought one.
The Sedona (ours is a ’12 model) was one of their older designs, that was a good car for its price. Newer ones have become appealing cars that do not have to be cheap to be attractive.
I genuinely like driving my Sedona. And in a jarring realization for me during a rental experience last summer, I discovered that I would not trade my Sedona for a Grand Caravan without a five figure bribe.
In response to Nick G., the Excels came out in ’85/’86 and the Sephias around ’96, and that was thirty and twenty years ago. A lot happens in 20 years; a kid goes from a helpless babe in arms who needs changing, feeding, and 24/7 care to an obnoxious know it all college kid able to annoy you by majoring in medieval structuralist phonetic art (made up). Hyundai/Kia made some awful cars a long time ago but they took their punches, learned how to improve quality, came back with a lot of it’s not quite as good as a Civic/Corolla/Camcord but for the price and warranty, why not cars, and then around 2010 came up with some really class competitive if not particularly innovative cars.
Hyundai/Kia wrote the book on how to revive brands that had been written off. GM should have copied that book and come up with dull cars with much better quality and warrantied the hell out of them and they might be worth considering today, but they didn’t, and although a GM loyalist for 25 years, we didn’t even look at any GM cars when we were considering a new car for my Dad in 09-11. We looked at Dodge and Honda and Toyota and Kia and Hyundai. He ended up with a Charger. I’d definitely look at a Sedona when it comes time to replace the Caravan in 3 years and might look at a Genesis/Equus. The previous generation Sonata had breathtaking styling inside and out. Perhaps they’re not quite enthusiast level but the vast majority of cars are appliances, which – – – 90% of my driving is done stuck in traffic on 285 at 10 mph anyway so carving corners at .97 g and such is as irrelevant to me as a car with built in closets. Appliances are ok.
I cannot be mad at Hyundai/Kia, everyone builds a few crap cars at some point. Even Honda had glass transmissions for many years. Hyundai moved past that, and I’m willing to move with them.
I was just more curious than anything about whether or not car people like the products of Kia and Hyundai.
I always been at odds with my car buddies when I bought an 80’s Peugeot, a Volvo 240, a few VWs, a 70 or 71 Corolla and a 320k mile Miata… all of which I had great fun with either due to their poor condition or underpowered engines or constantly troublesome electronics (unsurprisingly the MI-16 and surprisingly the Volvo). They all had character. Throw in a “Smokey and the Bandit” wannabe Trans-Am, an embassingly large amount of Jeeps and my current slant-6, four door Plymouth and I’ve pretty much run the multicultural smorgasbord of automobiles. I’ve coveted an MG-B and an Austin but just never pulled the trigger on buying one.
All that’s to say that country of origin nor lack of popularity, power or any shred of dependability or engineering goodness has ever affected my interest in a certain car or brand. But I just can’t make myself like Kia or Hyundai. To each their own.
Interesting perspective, and despite being strongly-held, expressed with a consideration of others.
My ownership history is a bit like yours; I’m not likely to be buying a new or near-new car in the foreseeable future but I have been asked by friends looking for a new car what they should consider. I’ve mentioned the Hyundai i3 amongst others; the carmaker has been getting good press for certain models in more recent years. One friend took the plunge and has not looked back, the other decided the Mazda 3 was worth the extra $5k. To each their own.
I think this Kia is attractive without being too distinctive, but as the market shifts (and shifts again) maybe that’s what the general punter is looking for right now.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/12/automobiles/wheels/carmakers-retreat-from-quirky-designs-as-millennials-embrace-mainstream.html?hpw&rref=automobiles&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=well-region®ion=bottom-well&WT.nav=bottom-well&_r=0
“car people” is an undefined term. There are ‘tuners”,”rodders”,”broughamantics”,ETC. There is, I’m sure a “fan base” (for lack of a better term) for lovers of either Kia or Hyundai.
I respect your viewpoint, and I think you’ve expressed it well without descending into mean-spiritedness. In fact I felt a similar way until the late ’00s; my mind really began to change in 2010 with the release of the new generations of Elantra, Sonata, and Optima. (The Forte had flown under my radar when it debuted in ’09 but I did notice it when checking out the others.)
Truthfully, as good a car as the Koup has been, it’s not an enthusiast car. It’s the (almost) perfect commuter vehicle, with better-than-average styling. I’d stop short of saying they don’t make vehicles enthusiasts can appreciate–witness the Optima SX turbo, Veloster turbo, and Genesis just to name a few.
True dat. A friend had budgeted <$45k; we test drove anything and everything including Acura, MB, BMW, Audi, Subaru, Fiat, Lexus, Infinity, Toyota…and she finally decided on a Hyundai Sonata Hybrid. With the Ultimate package it was far more luxurious than any of the others; being the scientist type she loves the hybrid part. She paid around $30k for it….
It's a very impressive car.
I’ve always liked these Koups. I’m actively helping my younger sister look for a car she is going to purchase this summer before her move to Miami, and these have made it on her short list of possibilities, along with the related Elantra coupe. You can actually find the two doors of these used below the cost of the equivalent four doors, at least in our searches so far (we found a 2013 Elantra coupe with 34,000 miles for $9,200 last week, and its not a salvage). Kia reliability is not a concern; My sister bought one of the first Souls to hit our shores in the spring of 2009. Other than the USB port acting up toward the end of her ownership, she put on 99,000 trouble free miles by the time she sold it off in the fall of 2013. Of course she just had to put “rims and tint” on her Toaster. Here is a photo just before the new owner came to pick the car up:
Chris, I think this car was a perfect selection for the purpose.
“Great Little Car” appears to be a fitting attribute. In my opinion the Forte is the rightful substitute for the Mazda Protege and 3 since Mazda’s corrosion protection went AWOL in 1999.
I always liked these, and that color is awesome. I remember sitting in one at the autoshow when they came out and it actually one of the most (realistically) desirable cars there. I loved how clean and simple the interior was compared to some of the obnoxious spaceship designs that proliferated in the early-2010s. Besides the Jetta/Passat it was the simplest and most ergonomically pleasing interior I remember sitting in that year.
It’s a shame that this was a one-generation wonder and that this type of car is basically extinct now. It seems like a lot of compacts tried to make a coupe version briefly but they only lasted a single generation because the sales couldn’t justify their continued production I guess (Focus, Elantra, Forte, no Cruze coupe to replace the Cobalt). 2-doors with a trunk have a very limited appeal, but I like the look a lot.
The Forte Koup is still available on the refreshed 2014 platform, and can even be had with the 1.6 turbo mill from the Hyundai Veloster.
“2 doors with a trunk”, love that description! A lot of discussion has happened over the years about what a “coupé’ is VS 2dr sedan, I can deal with either one, But I can NEVER use the term “4 door coupe”! It hurts my head almost as bad as the term “gifting”!
Nice write-up on a nice car (I especially like the color). I am impressed with how far Kia has come, with competitive quality and economy as well as some of the best styling on the market for mainstream cars (Honda and Toyota should take lessons…). These cars remind me of the time when the Japanese brands started gaining a major foothold in the market–people were pleasantly surprised/impressed with how good they were, and the rest was history. If you do wind up with a CUV, I imagine you’ll give the Sportage a look 🙂
We certainly will, especially once the recently revealed 2017 models start appearing on lots. Though the Mazda CX-5 may be a tough act to beat!
I fully understand the allure of driving a cheap, well built little car on the cheap.
With a lease, you’re effectively borrowing a smaller amount of money and therefore pay less interest. At the end, you either keep it or pass it on.
My Kia costs me $1848 a year in lease payments. The insurance is $1200, and fuel about the same. That’s a new car with a warranty for $4248 a year. It is $0.26/km.
I challenge anyone to run a beater for less.
You’re right. In Pittsburgh a bus ride would cost more for a lot of commuters (unless you add in $200/month parking downtown) Any “beater” that is remotely “modern” will likely cost more to keep alive than just leasing a new economy car. IMO, Bad credit keeps some folks buying “beaters”, OTOH, Daily driving an ’85 LeSabre, and doing ones own servicing is a labor of love and a hobby. That offsets the disadvantages.
If I had the time, talent, space, and tools, I would certainly love to have a black 1985 Buick Le Sabre Collector’s Edition sedan as a daily driver. Unfortunately, I have none of those things. But it makes for a nice fantasy anyway.
Seriously, after a long succession of beaters (which had to be replaced every 2 years at the most) and a long commute with little time, space, and talent; driving a new Accord has saved me time, money, and aggravation.
Somewhat dismayed at the way “beaters” are viewed, but not surprised. That’s quite alright though; I love having the large selection of good cheap cars to choose from due to the lack of competition for them.
For example, I got a beater for free 16 years ago (I gave the guy a case of beer just because) and I still drive it. I do all my own wrenching and can locate cheap or even free parts when needed (never even so much as had the valve cover off), so no down payments or financing or depreciation, virtually no maintenance or repair costs, it now has collector plates so no registration costs, insurance is dirt cheap, and it gets over 40 mpg. I don’t quiver in fear about the (imagined) prospects of a breakdown or expensive repairs and history has backed me up on that.
Canuck, I haven’t run all the numbers lately but the last time I did, it was darn close to only the cost of fuel for cents/mile.
If you have the space, the time, the tools and the inclination to do your own repairs, then beaters are a way to go. This, however, is not the situation that everyone has.
In my case, I have neither the time, space or the inclination to wrench on a car. It is actually cheaper for me to a) get someone else to wrench for me, or b) lease a cheap car with a warranty. This is because I can turn my time into money any time I want, and that time pays me more than I would have to pay a mechanic.
I also like having multiple airbags, abs, esp, and other associated safety gear, not to mention better fuel consumption.
Stay tuned next week for my current DD, which is a pretty clear example of the other side of the “new car vs. beater” coin. They both have their virtues…
Well, I have owned my 1995 Deville for 2 years. (Jan 2004- Current)
The first year I had the following costs (Jan 2004-Jan 2005)
$1000- Cost of the car
$300- Taxes, tags, registration
$500- for car insurance for the year
$500- Tires and repairs( Oil changes, replacing front wheel bearings and a 2 oil cooler line Orings)
$1800- gas ($150 x 12 months)
This comes out to be $4100
The second year (Jan 2015-Jan 2016) I have had the following costs:
$500- Insurance
$2400- Gas ($200 x 12 months)
$500- for repairs (brakes, plugs/wires/coil/cap/rotor/ oil changes and a Hall Effect Sensor)
I did not have a car payment/cost of buying the car or to pay for registering the car(it is a 2 year thing in my state)
That comes out to be $3400
This year (Jan 2016-Jan 2017) i will need to buy a new battery as I feel it is missing some of those Cold cranking Amps due to its age and snap cold fronts that have gone through) but that is about $100. I will also have to pony up $200 for tag renewing.
Now to be really fair, I have both the tools, knowledge and space to work on my cars that a lot of folks don’t have so that saves me a bundle over a lot of folks. I also have a second vehicle that I can use if the Deville is going to have some down time.
But yes it is possible to own and run a beater for less then your amount.
A lot of it depends where one lives. Where I live, it simply isn’t worth driving beaters since the lower cost of insurance doesn’t make up for the higher fuel consumption. I am also not able to drive a Big Sled where I live, since there would be so few places to park it.
Finally, I am a businessman. I cannot miss an appointment due to a broken down car, nor can I have greasy hands in a cashmere suit.
A while back I spoke to a guy who would buy a new Hyundai Getz (now replaced by the i20) each year, for about AUD$13k. His changeover cost was about $1000, but he did not renew the registration ($700 with 3rd-party injury insurance), or even service (12 month interval) the car let alone have to replace tires etc. Pretty hard to beat for an around-town commuter, although I drove one (hire car) on a 6 hour round trip on the highway and by hour 4 I was ready to get out!
ps James, It is a bit hard to ignore the parking cost!
If I had a Hyundai Getz, I’d have no choice but to name it Stan.
I didn’t think much of Kia or Hyundai for a very long time. I guess it was the beater Hyundai Pony that I picked up for my brother who at the time needed cheap a to b transportation that fueled my bias against these two brands. That car eventually became my mother’s car for a few years and I was able to spend a lot of time with it. It drove alright as long as you weren’t in a hurry and knew how to plan your left turns. She had to replace it because even she complained how slow it was.
For me was the ’04 Accent that I test drove and promptly bought that changed my mind. Sure it was a bottom of the range econobox and by no means sporty but the 1.6 was torquey and the whole package reminded me of the ’77 Honda Civic without all the rattles and buzzing. Winding it out while rowing through the gears it really popped along. So much so that I got my first and only speeding ticket ever. I began recommending Hyundai to others who were looking for no nonsense transportation and taking seriously the anecdotal evidence of Kia and Hyundai being solid reliable cars. Co workers actually had Accents, a Scoupe and even a Kia Rio and had nothing but good things to say about them.
When the Subject car came out I found myself drawn to it at the auto show. There was just something about a car with no hoop around the window that appeals to me. So much so that I was almost willing to overlook the fact that the rear window was fixed in place on a hidden b pillar. Had there been no b pillar and a rear window that rolls down I would have been handing over cash on the spot. I already liked the new Hyundai styling but the Kia Koup blew me away and the whole Kia lineup lacked the blobbyness of their previous models. That year while everyone else brought grey, white and darker grey cars Hyundai and Kia brought their full range of colour to the show and it was refreshing. One more brand on my list of choices should I ever need to replace the Sentra.
These are nice looking cars. But like most Korean products, everything Ive ever read on them say theyre basic transportation as opposed to any kind of performance car. Shame, because if this were packing a turbo and somewhere over 250 hp, this is pretty much what Id want the current Dart to be…
Obviously, you’ve never driven or been in a Kia K9000.
The Dart is about to be discontinued.
Obviously not as there is no such thing.
No, but there is a K900, which is obviously what he meant.
You missed the obvious irony.
Doesn’t matter anyway–less than 30% of dealers are selling these dogs (no pun intended). Have they surpassed 1000 units per year yet? Lol. No wonder MoparRocker hasn’t gotten any seat-time in one!
I can see Hyundai/Kia dethroning Toyota and Honda for the top spots in the next 10 years. I think that offerings from Hyundai/ Kia are very comparable to Toyota and Honda and in some cases better. The current Rio is so much better then the Yaris.
I had a 2010 Forte sedan for a while. It was a “stripper” with manual trans/windows/locks (though it had USB and Bluetooth capabilities)
It drove pretty nice and the dealer experience was 2nd to none. The local Toyota dealers are arrogant but the local Kia dealers are pleasant experiences. I will never buy another Toyota product and that stems from the dealership experience but I will give Kia another try when I am in need of a new car
Interesting read, and proof that a lot of pre-judgments on a Kia are out of date and invalid.
Kia and Hyundai may not be drivers’ cars but they are fully class competitive with Japanese and European brands, and probably American compacts and sub-compacts too.
OOI, what are the cars in the background in pictures 2 and 3?
As to what those cars are, your question will be answered next week and the following week, respectively. 🙂
My Rio is a driver’s car. A really good one, too.
Amazing how KIA improved the quality of their cars. The Koup is a gorgeous car and I think it was a wise choice. I just love the looking of modern 2 doors Asian cars.