I’m not the usual car guy…where words like HEMI or SS454 would excite a normal person, it is “Tufted Velour” and “Padded Vinyl Landau Roof” that gets my pulse quickening. So, when my friend sent me a Facebook listing with both those things (and in my favorite color blue), I had to go see it for myself. The seller was listing it for her father, with the car being from his aunt in Georgia – it drove fine without any issue, only having 39k miles on the analog gauge cluster. The paint is faded, the headliner was replaced in a rather crude way, and the plastic wood trim pieces are missing from 3 of the doors – but the Ultradrive shifted smooth as silk with the torquey 3.3 providing the go power.
Now I have two other nice domestic Broughamtastic examples in the driveway – however, they are way too nice to drive in the harsh Western PA winter. PennDOT must get a helluva deal on salt because they throw it down like it’s going out of style. With that in mind, a nice front wheel drive winter beater would be a good investment to make sure the other two stay in good shape for many springs and summers to come. Plus, I owned a 1993 New Yorker Fifth Ave and enjoyed its take on traditional American luxury.
This example has very few options – no power recliner, no leather wrapped steering wheel, no power trunk pulldown, or even a power passenger seat! But as someone pointed out to me on Facebook, that is just fewer things to break down the road. ABS would be nice, but the car stops very quickly as it is – or I’m just used to the longer distances of the Fleetwood Brougham.
Chrysler kept comparing this car to the 89-93 Cadillac Sedan deVille in advertising – now, I owned a 1991 Sedan deVille and while both look comparable on the outside, under the skin the Cadillac is a much better car. That extra $9k got you rear independent suspension, standard ABS, a more powerful V8 with the same fuel economy as the Chrysler V6, and a wider body that could truly be called a 6 passenger vehicle. Oh, and the Caddy had the standard “Symphony Sound” AM ST/FM ST 5 band EQ cassette radio whereas the Chrysler has only an AM/FM ST radio as standard equipment.
Yes, the Chrysler has the better warranty and longer rear seat legroom, but as my dearly departed father once told me “Why do you care…you aren’t riding back there!” Promo videos also tried to sell the Chrysler as more traditional looking whereas the Olds 88/98 and Buick Park Ave looked like “dinner mints on wheels.”
The exterior has all the hallmarks of Iacocca – chrome trim slathered on everywhere, waterfall grille, pop up headlight covers, padded Landau vinyl roof. This car has the standard wheel covers instead of the fake wire wheels, so it doesn’t look quite as baroque as the same year Imperial. I think these types of cars look best in dark colors, with my car being painted Medium Blue Gray Metallic Clearcoat – wore off in some spots as Chrysler would need another few years of practice before getting clearcoat down to a science.
Inside, the seats are covered in tufted Midnight Blue Kimberly cloth (feels like velour to me) among the acres of plastic wood on the dash and doors – along with the tufted cloth inserts on the doors for the true Lido touch. Chrysler thoughtfully included cupholders in the front arm rests, however they are too small to be useful with the crazy sizes of most to-go cups these days. Unusual for a luxury car is the full complement of gauges – only a tach is missing to make it complete, but with the auto transmission it doesn’t matter.
My 93 had the digital cluster, but the analog unit is much more readable as the years have gone on. Originally outfitted with the premium sound system consisting of 4 speakers with an AM ST/FM ST tape deck and 5 band EQ (and a port in the back for a CD player), I installed an aftermarket Kenwood head unit as these tuners are not very selective on FM nor is the filtering on AM very good. A bonus of these cars is I was able to swap the radio in 10 minutes and only two tools – Philips head screwdriver and a 10mm socket. Only FoMoCo vehicles with the quick release tabs are easier to swap.
But how does it drive? Popular Science was not impressed when they did a 4 way shootout between the Chrysler Imperial (the Y body sister to the Fifth Avenue), Lincoln Town Car, Buick Park Avenue Ultra, and Cadillac Brougham – the results were not complimentary to the Y body platform. Popular Mechanics echoed the sentiments as well.
Granted the New Yorker Fifth Avenue was not marketed against the Brougham and Town Car, but the C Body DeVille/Park Ave/98 from GM was better in almost every aspect. The 3800 V6 produced more power than the Chrysler 3.8, the four wheel independent suspension provided a better ride, and while the narrower New Yorker is more manageable in city traffic, I don’t think it was worth the tradeoff in hip/shoulder room reduction. My wife jokes when we’re in the car that she’s never been closer to me – and while that is nice, I wish Chrysler had widened the Y body to at least that of the minivan (72 inches vs 68 – same as the K car).
Chrysler also pushed that the 5/50 “Crystal Key” warranty (7/70 powertrain) as a response to the Ultradrive fiasco in the advertising – a quote from the movie “Tommy Boy” comes to mind: “Because they know all they sold ya was a guaranteed piece of s#it. That’s all it is, isn’t it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will.”
While I don’t believe the Y body is awful, like I mentioned above it keeps coming up short when compared to offerings from Ford or GM. Which is a shame because with a little more effort on the underpinnings (and a little less worrying about the chrome) the car could have been a more serious competitor instead of being the queen of Dollar/Thrifty rental lots.
Oh yes, back to how it drives – Chrysler’s home grown 3.3 V6 is a good fit for this car – it has plenty of torque off the line and has no issue getting up to highway speed or passing, even in the hills of Western PA. The Ultradrive shifts smoother than the 200R4/4L60 in the Cadillacs, and aside from some worn out door seals causing wind noise at highway speed, cruises nicely. Unfortunately the rear air ride failed leaving the rear end sagging – a set of heavy duty springs and Gabriel Hijackers later the rear is now lifted and not looking ragged out. Still rides smooth on the highway but now without the wallow or long recovery times from the stock setup.
With all the snow we’ve gotten lately, the Chrysler has seen daily duty – even on the Hankook Optimo all season tires it gets around like a mountain goat. It only loses traction if I really try to cut it loose – perfect for winter beater status. About the only thing on this car that doesn’t work is the blower motor – it comes and goes, but eventually will stay on. The AC has a slow leak, but that’s a “future Tom” problem…if we keep the car that long. Given how uncomfortable the car is for two on road trips due to how narrow it is (and how wide I am), the fine little Chrysler will most likely be sold sometime this spring or summer.
Overall this is not a bad car, just not a car that was better than the competition in any measurable way (aside from the complete instrumentation – which Jon Davis pointed out when MotorWeek reviewed the 1990 Chrysler Imperial). Unfortunately, this car carries the baggage of The Old New Chrysler – Lee’s cynicism about the consumer shows even down to the “Euro Style Soft Touch” climate controls – the controls internals were the same as before, just with different styled controls. Same cheap feel, but rounded buttons. Slather enough chrome, vinyl and plastiwood on it and people might not know it’s a warmed over K Car.
There are people who love these vehicles, and I can appreciate its charms on a good day, but when it comes up short in so many ways (room, ride, comfort, handling, economy, and overall quality) you can completely understand why only the Pentastar Proud bought them instead of anyone cross shopping Olds/Buick/Cadillac or the imports.
The LH generation New Yorker would fix all of these issues (except for quality), but those sold in even less numbers than the C/Y New Yorker did. Chrysler mercifully mothballed the name in 1997, leaving those wanting “traditional luxury” to grab an LHS with the bench seat option. I should be thankful to Lee for his cynicism for one thing – it allowed me to have a cheap winter beater to save my other two cars.
Great find. To help insure long transaxle life, it would be a good idea to change the fluid and filter. Be sure to use the correct fluid, I believe it’s ATF+4. A flush would not be advisable however, just drop the pan.
Yeah, just “drop the pan”. Whatever else you do…”just drop the pan”.
I remember really wanting to like these. They came so tantalizingly close to being a legit luxury cruiser but fell short in almost every metric, as you have ably noted. And when age and unpopularity pushed values into the basement, they did not even make good cheap luxury because of their tendencies to break in expensive ways.
You raise a great point – the K car begat the minivan, and it is a shame that they could not have started with the wider minivan platform for this car’s basis. That extra width would have solved much of what was wrong with these, at least when new.
I must not miss the chance to blow kisses to the 3.3 V6, which would go down as one of the great engines of all time if only the cars they were placed in had the ability to last for 300+* miles. Unfortunately these became roulette beaters, where every day brings a chance for something bad and expensive to happen.
I worked in the car rental industry during the era of these cars. From the Dynasty to the Imperial (the Boss drove that one). I LOVED these cars. Make mine black cherry in color please!
Thanks for the great write up, you got me thinking of a car from long ago in my family…
As a teenager, I got to borrow often Grandad’s loaded Dynasty- this car’s cousin. Comparing it to the cars my skinflinted parents had, Toyota Corollas for Mom and 6 cylinder three on the tree trucks for my Dad- it was a real revelation. Power seats and windows! Tilt! Really scoots but quiet! Luxurious velour instead of vinyl or burlap! I thought it was quite stylish in metallic beige with wire hubcaps. I loved hooning on it. I still love old man cars to this day.
Too bad your New Yorker’s original buyer didn’t splurge on the premium sound option. To this day, I consider that Dynasty’s Infinity sound one of the best I’ve ever heard outside of Lexus’ Mark Levinson. I recall the Infinty system had special planar (Emit?) type tweeters like their home speakers- back when they were still considered audiophile. Much better than Bose at the time, those didn’t even use tweeters or had a separate sub. Just full range paper drivers super equalized. And that Mopar deck even had a special noise reduction circuit for AM.
And that Dynasty dodged the bullet: no Ultradive issues, or any other problems.
For better or worse these were all around me in their time. My grandparents had an ’89 New Yorker Landau, passed on to my former mother-in-law. My father leased 3 of these (I think) from ’89 until the last one was replaced with a ’94or5 LHS, which then led to three consecutive 24 month leases of those. His were company cars, leased for 2 years from his best bud’s dealership. And yes, it was a matter of loyalty to his friend (not the brand, per se) that led to our household owning every iteration of Chrysler’s finest from the late ’80’s on. Since all but one were short term leases the quality problems were mostly avoided. The one long hauler did have the Ultradrive replaced around 100k. I found them pleasant for what they were. All of ours were of the fully loaded variant, so in their time they were well equipped and pleasant for long highway drives. Turning and stopping were not their strong suit. The tufted leather power seats were superbly comfortable for average size folk, the factory Infinity sound systems were excellent at the price point. The early ones with the Mitsubishi 3.0 could have used some extra grunt, but when the Ultradrive was working it was well mated to the engine and they worked nicely if not always very quietly together.
Dad was an insurance agent in a rural area and was extremely hard on his vehicles. They were always leased in a color that “doesn’t show dirt” because they were never clean. The leather passenger seat was always stained grayish from newsprint rubbing off the 3 newspapers he picked up every day and drove around with “until he had a chance to read them”.
The last of these, in a sage green metallic color, with tan (and newsprint gray) leather interior had an issue with the automatic leveling pump that would cause it to run (or not run) at various times whether the car was running or not. For some reason this could never be properly addressed, so for those 2 years it was not uncommon to see Dad coming down the road with the rear end jacked up like an early 70’s hotrod, or to see the car in the parking lot of his office with the ass end almost on the pavement, or vice versa. It was at least a source of comic relief, and at some point he just gave up on trying to get it addressed, since he would eventually turn it in and forget about it.
Obviously I still have a soft spot for these, I guess.
I had an ’89 NYer and a ’91 Imperial as DDs. You have to appreciate these for what they ARE, and their unique, desirable qualities. On paper, the competition was slightly superior, but they looked so generic!
The Imperial had air susp. replaced w/ Strutmasters, which greatly improved the ride! My biggest criticism would be the imprecise steering response, which could have been sharpened up without increasing mfg. cost.
Awesome writeup. Your comparisons to the Park Avenue are very timely, I myself scooped up this ’91 right before Christmas as a cheap tinkering project. 122k miles, a few more issues than advertised with (then again I bought it for half of the advertised price). Biggest issue was a two cylinder misfire (started with a new coil pack, ended up buying a whole junkyard ICM and coil set), welded up exhaust, replaced leaking transmission lines, replaced valve cover gaskets, reupholstered the rear pillar trim and pinned up the headliner. On deck are some more fluid replacements and taking a look at the rear air shocks (not collapsed but the compressor doesn’t run either). Far from a thorough “restoration,” but she’s got an immaculate leather interior, and as I’m buffing the cracked/weather-checked paint she’s really coming back. The wheel/tire set were a junkyard find, polished up perfectly, tires are frankly older than I’d like and two have slow leaks but we’ll get around to that. Worst is a rotted out driver side rocker panel by the rear door, not really visible from the side but I’ll weld that up sooner or later and try to get some somewhat matching paint.
Was going to do a quick flip but kind of fell in love with the old gal so I’ve got her titled and registered, and am planning a nice relaxing road trip east along US40
Not seeing the pic show up, here’s another try…
Try reducing the file size if the pic isn’t attaching. I reduce picture sizes to a max. of 1,200 pixels (in the bigger dimension) — usually posts that way.
Or the first or second smallest choice if your “resize” request gives you four options like mine does.
perfect that did it, thank you for the tip
resized:
Perfect for me to demonstrate the current “10 footer” nature of the paint lol
This is one of the few large American Luxo-barges of the era that I for some unknown reason secretly (not so secretly anymore I guess) covet. Does yours have the leather with the 1″ or so ribs? Is it an Ultra with the supercharger? Either way, it’s a fantastic engine as in my LeSabre T-Type or Regal GS and I can just imagine this floating up I-69 in your neck of the woods. Make mine dark blue but the color of yours is perfect for covering road debris. You’re going to regret selling it.
Yup mine’s got the earlier-year style 1 inch ribbed leather. Since buying it I’ve definitely started to learn a lot more about the specifics of the inter-generational changes 91-96. Mine’s a “regular” Park Ave with the non-supercharged Series I with the cast “Tuned Port” intake manifold. I do have the optional dual zone climate control system. Performance wise, the final 95-96 cars got the full 240hp from the Series II Supercharged 3.8L. The benefit of the Series I however is you avoid the intake gasket leaks and EGR-melting-plastic issues, as well as simpler access on the drive-belt side of things for example popping off the camshaft position sensor is trivial, iirc Series II have it obscured behind the water pump pulley, and I think a serpentine belt change requires popping off a motor mount(?). Stupid-easy motor to wrench on. Excellent plug access, parts cost pennies, etc, etc. The one caveat is for junkyard bits, the Series I is much rarer than Series II donors from what I’ve seen locally. For the ignition module/coil pack for example, I upgraded to a later Series II style module, thankfully it’s a plug and play upgrade.
Cup holders are an interesting “technology” that deserve their own write-up some day. All of our 1990’s cars were Toyota’s, and their retractable cup holders of that era were complex, fragile … and not very good at actually holding cups, especially full ones. This Chrysler design looks equally complex but perhaps sturdier. It took a while, I think before manufacturers realized that a simple molded bucket works best.
Jeez – a cassette deck wasn’t standard in a Chrysler luxury model, circa 1991?
The base model came standard with an AM/FM cassette & 4-speaker sound system. The upmarket Infinity system was standard on higher trims.
You might want to check out the blower motor resistor block to see if it has continuity. Passenger side at the top of the engine compartment. I had one on a Dynasty that had a rusted out resistor, causing intermittent blower.
Those darn blower motor register blocks. Will get ya every time.
My Grandpa was a mechanic and when I was growing up his vehicles of choice (for the entire family) were Mopar’s that were 10-15 years out of date. I grew up riding around in a slew of K Cars, New Yorkers, LeBarons and even an old Big Horn. But when the Intrepid came out he fell in love with it. He held off on buying one but couldn’t help himself and when the second generation came out he bought an ES, in Deep Cranberry Pearl. After that my grandma got tired of the ’87 LeBaron she was driving around in, so he decided it was time for her to trade up to a Fifth Avenue. This was around 1999 and he found a blue one, same colour as the example above with that same blue interior (digital dash though) that was being sold by an elderly widow. She wanted $5000. It only had 23,000 KMs and even had the original tires on it. It was mint. He tried to lowball her for an entire year but she wouldn’t budge, the car was even appraised, but it was valued at $6000. Soon afterwards the lady gave up driving and her son sold it to my grandpa for about half of the asking price. The Fifth Avenue took up daily duties while the Intrepid was a garage queen up until I got my license. Eventually it developed some transmission problems and a sinking rear end and he wasn’t interested in fixing any cars after retirement, so it went away, replaced by… a White Fifth Avenue. Exactly the same but it wasn’t optioned the same, it had an analogue cluster. Someone in his church needed a car so he sold it to them and then bought a red one. He must have really liked those cars because there was one on his driveway for a solid 10 years. To this day the story of him trying to buy the old lady’s Fifth Avenue is one of my favorite antidotes about him and i think about it every time I see one (which isn’t very often anymore).
I have no real love for these cars but recently came across oen in a junk yard that looked like it had been taken directly from grandpa’s garage and brought to the junk yard. beautiful metallic gray paint and gleaming chrome…lots of it! Perfect condition other than the damage they inflicted moving it with a forklift. Just sad. I removed my cap for a moment it it’s honor.
This was my Grandfather’s last car. His was that ice -Sinatra-blue that Chrysler so loved in the late 80s and early 90s. Well, it WAS a pretty colour.
I don’t care what anyone says. Lee hit the marketing nail right on the head with his Kadillac. This car more than any other one I can think of says “Greatest Generation.” It wasn’t designed for sniffy automobile reviewers interested in G-forces and polar moments of inertia. It was designed for the boys of Pointe du Hoc, the kids who at 17 stormed Normandy beaches and did submarine duty with depth charges exploding around them in the Atlantic and fought now forgotten campaigns in Burma and India and raised the flag on Iwo Jima and watched planes take off from nameless Pacific Islands to bomb Japan until two final planes took off, two final bombs dropped, and the war ended and they were free to come home.
Nobody under the age of jitterbugging and Boogie-Woogie Washerwoman would want this car, (except for me, perhaps) although you can see younger people driving something like a Town Car or Brougham or DeVille.
Yes, when we rode in it, the thinness of the K car doors was evident; the chassis creaked, rattled in that uncoordinated K car way, it wasn’t as smooth or wide as the GM C and H bodies . . but Granddad did not care. These things were heavily rebated when they hit the showroom floor; Iacocca knew his customers and he knew that to people who grew up in the Great Depression, seeing a 21k sticker marked down to 15 impressed the people who would drive across town for an early bird special at a restaurant they didn’t really like. I remember these things being advertised in their day for around 17 fully loaded, which would barely get you into a base model LeSabre or 88 or a Sable with a few power options. Any Cadillac was at least $12,000 more and still didn’t have quite as rich interior appointments. To people who paid $7500 for their first house in 1950, that was an ungodly sum of money.
Grandma would not allow Granddad to buy a car with wire wheels (they’re too hard to clean!) she said and would not allow him to buy anything fancier than a base model Reliant. Then she passed away in 1993 and he was free to indulge his sybaritic fancies. This car totally fit the bill. Iacocca plastered every single luxury cue he could think of inside and out, with opera lamps, half vinyl top, lots of chrome, hidden headlights, button tufted velour, gobs of chrome, and Granddad LOVED it. For a little bit more than a Buick Century or an average Dynasty, he got a car which cosseted him, had lots of fancy winking lights and fancy electronic gauges and FELT rich. What did he care about handling and understeer and polar moments of inertia and grip? He was driving the car from Columbus to Atlanta, it cruised comfortably at 80 in rich, soft, leather lined, air conditioned, stereo comfort, and he looked good in it after a lifetime of hard work and being denied what he really wanted.
If Iacocca had invested in developing a wider, better chassis for this car, would it have sold any better? Would it have been as profitable? Considering that this cannot have cost much to develop, and ladling on the glitz doesn’t cost much compared with what can be charged for it, probably not. The Greatest Generation who bought this car would MUCH rather have a few hundred dollars shaved off the price or have it put into softer leather and thicker carpets than a more sophisticated chassis. As pointed out, this sold better than its successor.
Of course, the problem with that philosophy is the boys of Pointe du Hoc and PT boat pilotsand B 29 ball turret gunners make their final departures at some point to rejoin their fallen comrades, never to return. Given wings, they shall no longer need wheeled transportation, and then what have you got? But let’s not worry about this, let’s just be happy that a car was made for such a deserving market.
Wow! That was a very insightful, well worded comment. I’m just totally impressed!
This comment and Tristan’s above (as well as the piece on the car itself) are what I come to CC for
“Nobody under the age of jitterbugging and Boogie-Woogie Washerwoman would want this car, (except for me, perhaps) although you can see younger people driving something like a Town Car or Brougham or DeVille.”
Add me to the list as well, or I wouldn’t have bought the car – don’t get me wrong, I do love the car for what it is…but I can’t help but look and see what it could have been as well.
These cars were also favorites of The Silent Generation, of which two of my grandparents belonged to. Pap couldn’t care if the car cornered or had rear independent suspension – was it powerful? Comfy? A good deal? Those were the qualities he wanted in his “Sunday car.” The last car he bought (used) was a 1996 Cadillac Sedan Deville – he loved it, but it was a second choice as he couldn’t find a decent 1990-1992 Brougham with the 350 Chevy.
My Gram, who just turned 90 on Sunday, had the same outlook – her last car was a 2007 Mercury Grand Marquis LS. Big, powerful, comfortable – “it’s an easy driving car” is what she always says about it.
I’m sad that the 21 Century expression of these cars is no more, as Cadillac has killed the XTS & CT6.
Maybe someday tufted velour bench seats will come back into fashion…thank you for your wonderful comments!
Thank y’all!
Probably one of 10 left with a functioning Ultradrive but then again very low mileage sure helps. Its also comical to see what looks like a K-car derived land -o plastic steering wheel, no cassette and these always looked like a bad caricature of a 1985 GM downsized C-body but with all the gingerbread left intact. Still these had comfy seats, acres of chrome and were more interesting than most of the boring crap currently available or not currently so for that it deserves a place in someones driveway that will appreciate it.
It is a K-Car.
I can’t get around that K-Car steering wheel and that dash.
I find a real K-Car far more attractive.
Ya know Tom,
From the time these things rolled off the assembly line, I could never get over the front overhang. I know that’s the way everything’s built nowadays but it just seems everybody and their brother hid the overhang better.
Hope you get a lot of use out of it!