In the early 20th Century, thousands of car companies were formed in the United States. Most of them came and went quickly, but about 20 brands existed in the immediate postwar period gradually dropping to today’s handful. Ten years ago, the final Oldsmobiles were built, and a 100 year old name joined the likes of Plymouth, DeSoto and Studebaker. There are certainly similarities to many of these endings, but with Olds, one thing seems a bit different.
In the past decade, Mercury, Pontiac and Saturn have followed Olds into oblivion, and like the demise of Kaiser, Edsel and the countless others followed a typical pattern. In most of these cases, several years of declining sales were followed by a quick corporate decision to kill the brand and then a short production run of new models designed to leave the dealers and the parent company with as few left over cars as possible.
In Contrast to this GM sent Olds out with at least a little bit of style. After several years of gloomy speculation, they announced in December of 2000 that Olds would be phased out, but gradually, and the last 500 cars of each line would be special commemorative editions.
First to go was the Intrigue. Production of these ended in June 2002 at the end of that model year. The V6 powered Aurora also ended with the 2002 models, but about 7000 V8 powered cars were made through March of 2003. Like the second-generation Aurora, the third-generation Bravada SUV actually went on sale after the announcement to discontinue the brand.
Assembly of the 2004 models ended in January of that year, with the final 500 making up nearly a quarter of total production. The Silhouette (The Cadillac of Minivans) had been around longer than anything else in the lineup, but lasted nearly to the end, with the last one built in March of 2004.
Fittingly, this left the Lansing-built Alero as the very last Oldsmobile, with the final one coming off the line April 29th 2004. After being signed by the plant employees, it was immediately placed on display at the nearby R E Olds Transportation Museum.
The final 500s were each painted dark cherry metallic with gray or tan interiors that included special embroidered logos in the seatbacks. The same logos were used as emblems on the front fenders and decklid or hatch. Most of them came with special wheels, and sedans included unique door sill plates and floormats.
In the last year I’ve seen eight of the final 500s equally split between a couple of shows and daily drivers. An Alero, Aurora and Silhouette have each eluded me in traffic, but this Bravada was actually curbside when I spotted it. I don’t suspect that these are going to be high end collectables any more than Corvette Pace Cars or the “last convertible” Eldorados, so it’s nice to see them being driven, especially since many seem to be in the hands of enthusiasts rather than ending up at the back of the sales lot with the rest of the orphans.
Those last Auroras were pretty cars. They look especially sharp in that color too.
+1 a sad end to a great car maker.At least there was something interesting unlike the last Plymouths and Mercuries.
the last Mercury was a Grand Marquis, not too bad
Sorry forgot about that one,I wrongly thought the Grand Marquis and it’s relatives had been dropped before Mercury was shut down.A Marauder has been on my wish list of Mercuries since I first read about them
The Marauder was dropped after 2004, while the standard Grand Marquis soldiered on until the end in 2011.
Despite the short production run it was a great car…I owned an ’03 Marauder from 2006 to 2011…wish I hadn’t sold it.
Sure the last Plymouth was a Neon, but that is not bad at all since Plymouth has always been the way to go for those who are thrifty shoppers.
The Aurora was a total piece of crap. Can you say oil leaks? Starter failures that happened, like clockwork, at 60,001 km, that took eight hours’ labour to replace? How about the same crappy strut mount as a Malibu, that cost three times as much? Malfunctioning ABS? SRS? HVAC? Well, with an Aurora, you got to experience them all.
One of the more noteworthy elements of the Oldsmobile Aurora was that it was one of the rare domestic vehicles that came equipped with rear fog lights. Unfortunately, just like the idiots who drive around mindlessly with their front fog lights on all the time, the same thing happened with the Oldsmobiles that had rear fog lights. In fact, it was worse because the bright red rear fog lights looked a lot like the brake lights were sticking.
It’s a shame US drivers can’t use rear fog lights correctly. They’re a great safety feature (and mandatory in Europe) but only if used properly.
I’ve never heard of rear fog lights. But I agree about the idiots who leave the front ones on all the time. Like it does any good to see what’s 20 feet in front of you as you’re traveling 70MPH.
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Almost all of the European makes have rear foglamp(s), and it’s typically only one lamp on the LH side. Common reaction in our country is: “Looks like their left-side brake lamp is stuck on.”
I’ve never seen a USDM car with a single left rear foglight (unless the right one’s burned out); it’s a common arrangement in Europe, along with a single one on the right for UK/Ireland, but cars set up that way are usually sent to the US with twin back-up lights instead.
nlpnt
I think that some of the Audi A6 sedans used to have a rear fog light on the left and the backup lamp on the right. I always thought it was kind of strange and used to bother me because of the whole asymetrical thing
The Euro rear fog lights are about the same brightness as brake lights. On my 1990 Volvo 240 they were as bright as hell.(sadly I cannot say the same for the headlights and they were replaced with new housings) and can be seen a good distance
2nd gens only, to clarify.
Sweet. I didn’t know they did this. I love it.
It seems unforgivable that a General Motors make of car would be left to die as if it were some disease. Was Oldsmobile perfect? No, of course not. But then what is? I was hoping that Buick would get the axe. They were showing nothing new and worthwhile. And Cadillac, while that brand has always been the fancy luxury car to have, in recent years, I haven’t seen anything interesting and worthwhile from them. So Cadillac should be next to get on the chopping block.
Buick was too popular in China to kill.
This also explains why the entirety of Buick’s current U.S lineup consists of a rebadged (and built in South Korea) Daewoo crossover, an Opel/Daewoo mongrel sedan, a rebadged Opel sedan, a slightly larger rebadged Opel sedan, and a comparatively ancient Lambda crossover.
We’re getting Chinese-market leftovers, basically. At least the Enclave was actually engineered in the States.
Aw, c’mon, tell us how you really feel!
the Lacrosse isn’t a rebadged Opel.
The Encore is the only Daewoo product, not quite sure what the problem with that is…
From an engineering standpoint, the Lacrosse (and Impala, and XTS) is merely an elongated version of the Regal, which is the same exact car as the Opel Insignia. All are on Epsilon II.
The Verano (which I actually kind of like, but for the GM parentage) is built off the Delta II platform. Though primarily engineered by Opel, Daewoo had its say on this and (especially) the Cruze/Lacetti.
I don’t mind global platforms, but the lineage here isn’t terribly impressive IMHO.
All that said, my biggest issue is that Oldsmobile – and Pontiac – were ultimately sacrificed to maintain a U.S. sales channel for cars catered more to Chinese tastes.
And what is wrong with that? The only reason GM turns a profit is its Chinese operations. Don’t like their products? Buy something else. Global platforms are here to stay. It’s the only way to make money in an industry plagued with over-capacity.
Well, perhaps GM should have gone to the Chinese government for that bailout, then.
In fact, the Chinese government owns 51% of GM’s China operations. GM has always made money in China, so no need for a bailout.
The only reason GM turns a profit is its Chinese operations.
Let’s keep our facts straight. In 2013, GM had a $7.6 billion profit on NA operations, and only $400 million in China. And the profit margin in China is slipping, as the competition heats up.
@ Canuck: Taken at face value, there is a LOT wrong with that. Why should we have to give up Pontiac so that Buick can lurch on to appease the Chinese?
As I see it, the solution with Buick SHOULD have went one of three ways, all involve burning them off the face of North America like a bad case of warts. No one buys them here in the first place. Id prefer that GM kept the jobs here…crank em out like Bic cigarette lighters and kick em across the ocean where someone will actually pay money for them. OR, go the Holden route, move the Buick operation to China. We can save a grip by building them in their own back yard. Or just sell the whole shebang to one of the Chinese mfg’s and let them have at it.
Way I see it, Buicks are just trash. If someone wants to pay good money for what amounts to garbage (in my mind, anyway) then I say we cash in and laugh all the way to the bank. Good riddance. The Silverados and the Camaro are whats selling here, which makes perfect sense.
Check out the Opel Mokka before calling Buick’s little crossover a daewoo!
It is why GM keeps Opel alive, to do the corporate platform development.
http://www.opel.ie/vehicles/opel_range/cars/mokka/index.html
Enclave is a Lambda platform vehicle, which is largely derived from the GM Epsilon platform, which was developed by Opel… so Opel designs the plaforms the division ‘style them’ and adapt them. Malibu, Impala, XTS and plenty of other GM vehicles are riding on Opel engineering, it is not just Buick!
GM will invest billions in Opel in the next years. The goal is number two in Europe, Volkswagen being the undisputed number one. That means a market share of 8%. We will see the introduction of 17 new engines and 27 new models and variants in the next 5 years. (I’m quoting from a car magazine right now)
Opel is already on the rise, number three now in Europe. There will be no other GM brands anymore in Europe, only Opel. That’s Vauxhall in the UK. No more Chevrolet/Daewoo experiments.
FYI the European sales numbers 2013, source Autoweek:
1. Volkswagen 1,487,029
2. Ford 878,786
3. Opel 807,282
4. Renault 787,351
5. Peugeot 723,317
6. Audi 664,173
7. BMW 613,152
8. Citroën 588,088
9. Mercedes-Benz 594,876
10. Fiat 562,364
See what I mean with the “undisputed number one” ?
You haven’t seen anything interesting from Cadillac? The ATS and CTS are both pretty nice cars…Certainly the best Cadillacs in 40 years
Buick is the founding division of GM… Billy Durant started General Motors using Buick profits – killing Buick would be corporate matricide!
For many in China, Buick is the ultimate car.
Zhou Enlai’s Buick, reportedly “acquired” from the Last Emperor after the communist takeover, was the late premier’s prized possession. Today, Buick is one of China’s leading luxury-car brands and a status symbol for the young, upwardly mobile business elite. In 2010, Buick sold more than 550,000 vehicles in China.
Yeah well that’s fascinating… But Burt” Reynolds’ Trans Am, reportedly acquired from “Big” Enos Burdette, was the Bandit’s prized possession too, yet where’s all the Pontiac dealers?
The same place the mercury dealers are.
+1..
This site seems to slide down into ttac territory more and more everyday.
What exactly is bothering you? Seems like it’s mostly a pretty good conversation about an intrinsically controversial subject, one that folks tend to have strong opinions about. As long as folks stay on subject, and don’t attack each other, I have no problem with it.
It’s not like we purposely try to instigate controversy; this was a submission on an interesting subject. We shouldn’t bring up the history of brands?
I am in China a lot, and Buick is not “the ultimate car.” In fact, it’s the penultimate car. Any Chinese rich guy will buy German if he has the chance, 100% tariff aside. Buick in China is a joint venture with the Communist party of Shanghai (wrap your head around that, Teabagggers!) which means Buicks are the cars of middle to upper middle apparatchiks.
The small Chinese Buicks compete on price as they are locally produced.
Mercedes, BMW and Audi all build cars in China in joint-ventures. Not all models are produced there, but the percentage is increasing.
Unless I’m mistaken, the Chinese government won’t let you build cars there unless part of a joint venture with one of the domestic manufacturers, who are all associated with the Party. It’s the price of entry to that market nowadays–play ball their way or don’t play at all. Given the size of the market, it’s a persuasive argument.
Correct, Paul, but the cars made in Germany are infinitely more coveted. China is awash is easy money and eye-popping corruption. The country basically exists as a way for the government and wealthy to further enrich themselves. It’s much like America that way, but with less widow dressing. Anyway, it is considered that anything more money is intrinsically better, so if your German made BMW costs double the locally produced one, it is 100% better. And it is, because the car in China is not a transportation conveyance for the criminally rich and infamous, it is a status symbol, like everything around them, from their clothes, watch, furniture, you name it. It’s actually quite hilarious some of the time. Their houses are all IDENTICAL inside, right out of a magazine and there is no artwork in any of them.
High class all the way.
Not sure what the Tea Party slur is all about – I’m not a Tea Party guy, they’re a bit too Lefty (and “clubby”) for me but the Tea Party folks I know were mostly anti-bailout – primarily due to the total disregard for the rule of law aspect of the whole distasteful affair. Never the less, if we get a neo-Riv out of GM snuggling with this Chicoms it just might be worth all the statist nonsensense…but only if it’s RWD, comes with a manual trans, with a wagon version sporting a Diesel. Brown metallic paint, of course!
I worked at a Cadillac/Oldsmobile dealership in 2004 and remember the final 500 of these models arriving. I also remember having several sitting around the lot collecting dust until December or so. One Alero sat around until late the following January. The case of Olds seemed a lot different than that of Plymouth or Mercury, at least from my perspectve, as we always had a steady stream of loyal Olds customers till the very end, and I always thought that more could have been done to preserve the brand. Of course, living in southwest Florida probably contributed to this. It was a shame really, as I always thought that Oldsmobile, along with Buick, were ahead of the curve when it came to building quality American stuff.
Interesting side thought: After the “new car” smell wore off, the Intrigue’s interior always smelled like a nursing home’s bathroom. All of them did without exception, even if they were driven by obviously clean people. Why was this? Weird.
I recall a newspaper advert featuring some “Final 500” Oldsmobiles with gigantic rebates attached. That was pretty much SOP for Olds near the end, but you got the feeling not too many collectors were interested.
I think they also added an extended 6/60 bumper to bumper warranty as a consolation prize on the last Oldsmobiles, I almost considered an Alero coupe when they were fire selling them but I bought a low millage GTP coupe instead. I think I ended up better.
Like JG above, I had forgotten all about these (if I paid enough attention at the time to know in the first place). I wonder why they chose the least desirable car in the lineup to be the last in production. I can’t believe that the Alero had that many retail sales at the end, especially more than the Bravada or Silhouette.
Wow. 10 years already.
Because the Alero was a strong seller up until the end and was Oldsmobile’s best selling model in the end.
The Silhouette sold poorly(just like the Chevy and Pontiac versions of the van) and the Bravada did not sell because it was overpriced in comparison to it the GMC Envoy and the Chevy Trailblazer and did not offer anything special that would make somebody pony up more green stuff to buy it instead of the Chevy or GMC.
I still see a lot of Aleros on the road even today. A neighbor of mine bought one when she first joined the Airforce in 2000 and kept it until 2013 when she bought a Acura RDX. The Alero never caused her an issue at all and it was only replaced due to her wanting a new car after 13 years.
The Intrigue was a nice car and had they came out with it and the Alero a few years sooner it might have saved Oldsmobile.
The fact that rental car companies were buying Aleros is probably what saved it. I remember reading that, when the decision was made to pull the plug on Oldsmobile in 2000, over 1/3 of Oldsmobiles were being sold to fleet customers or GM employees.
I’m guessing that fleet customers weren’t buying too many Silhouettes and Bravadas, but were willing to buy Aleros…which is probably what extended the Alero’s stay of execution.
Indeed. My experiences renting an Alero coupe and Grand Am sedan were why I decided to buy a 2004 Grand Am. (Well, that and something like $6000 on the hood at the time.)
I would have preferred an Alero had one still been available in the spec I wanted.
I think Uncle Sam was a huge Alero customer as well – I remember looking for a van for work a few years ago at a GSA auction and they had a ton of Aleros. I think they went pretty cheap, too.
Aleros were built in Lansing, Olds’ hometown from day one. It just wouldn’t have been right to build the last one anywhere else.
As other commenters have stated, the Alero was still a fairly decent seller, particularly among rental fleets. I had an almost new one as a rental in January, 2004.
There are still plenty of them on the road around here, and they’re typically in better shape than the even more common Grand Ams of similar vintage.
My wife owned an ’00 Alero with the 2.4 for nine years. It wasn’t a great car by any means (the quality of the interior bits was especially laughable) but it did rack up almost 175,000 miles without any major repairs and with somewhat indifferent maintenance (before I showed up of course!). So I’ll say it was a decent car. And it looked good, and drove reasonably well. Maybe it was even a good car.
We finally got rid of it due to severe oil and coolant leaks that required a top-up every time you drove, but even then, as long as you kept the fluids full, it ran well.
Plant capacity may have been an issue. Something I read suggested that they actually made fewer than 500 of the last Silhouettes, because they needed space on the line for more Ventures.
What a great article and Oldesmobiles are not too common in Portland. The Silhouette looks especially good in this case and I like the Bravada which became the Rainer.
On a side note I believe Daimler Chrysler screwed up when they killed Plymouth. Daimler Chrysler should have turned Dodge into just trucks, SUVs, and cargo vehicles like what Ram is these days. Plymouth then would be all the passenger vehicles including the Viper and PT Cruiser.
It’s hard to believe that Oldsmobile has been gone for 10 years, and that the announcement was made almost 14 years ago.
I was a member of the Oldsmobile Club of America at that time, and I remember attending a summer show at the local Chevrolet-Oldsmobile dealer in 2000. One of the club members was apparently in contact with GM personnel, and he told me that the Oldsmobile styling studio or “brand center” (I can’t remember which one) had been shut down by GM. At that point, I figured Oldsmobile didn’t have much time left. It was still a surprise when The Wall Street Journal broke the story the evening before the official announcement that GM was shuttering the division.
The final Oldsmobiles were nice cars, but, in the end, the old Sloan brand ladder just wasn’t relevant to the American automobile market in the 21st century. Pontiac would go, too, and I find myself wondering why GM really needs Buick, aside from the need to keep the brand alive for the Chinese market.
I think you’re right. It seems so strange to me because in my midwestern youth, the local Oldsmobile dealer was HUGE! Collins Olds on the north side of Fort Wayne had a facility probably second in size only to the biggest Chevrolet dealers. That was in addition to a really big dealer on the south side of the city as well. Buick had only a single dealership in a smaller, old facility near downtown. Oldsmobile was “the Establishment” around here and found a home in garages of a wide swath of the middle classes. In the summer of 1974, Collins was completely sold out of 2 door Cutlass Supremes when my mother went shopping for a new car, and this was in a bad sales year for the industry as a whole.
My parents were Oldsmobile loyalists, although our local dealer also carried Cadillac and Chevrolet, and thus survives today.
Oldsmobile was a definite “step up” from Chevrolet and Ford (Plymouth barely registered on the radar by the mid-1970s), without being too pretentious.
Cutlass Supremes were hot with young college graduates, while Cutlass Cruisers were popular with young families. The Delta 88 was the car of choice for middle-age people with families, while the Ninety-Eight was a “reward” for those same buyers after the kids had left the nest. Unless they really went out on a limb and bought a Toronado.
Oldsmobile really suffered in the great downsizing of the 1980s. The front-wheel-drive Delta 88 and Ninety-Eight were initially problem-prone and just didn’t have the “feel” of the old rear-wheel-drive cars. Keeping the Cutlass Supreme around after the debut of the Cutlass Ciera watered down the power of the Cutlass nameplate, and confused some buyers. (Which one is better? Why are there two cars named Cutlass?)
Both the Cutlass Supreme and Cutlass Ciera were thoroughly eclipsed by the first Taurus, and then by the Honda Accord.
The bugs were eventually worked out of the Cutlass Ciera, but keeping it around so long hurt Oldsmobile’s image. It became a 1990s Plymouth Valiant, which was great for the people who kept buying them, but Oldsmobile buyers during its heyday would NOT have bought something as dowdy and dated as a Valiant, whatever its virtues.
That killed Oldsmobile’s image, and really made it hard to sell cars like the Aurora and Intrigue. It didn’t help that the Intrigue, which was the division’s most important car, debuted over three years AFTER the first Aurora. GM seemed to think it had all of the time in the world to turn the division around, but that wasn’t the case.
+1. Good comment.
I worked in a GM store the whole time the Olds axing was going on so I have a bit of a different take on demise of America’s oldest brand. Olds customers were incredibly loyal in the 1960’s as the cars were correctly considered to be more than worth the extra money. Old was right up in sales all through the 1970’s and well into the ’80’s.
The problem was GM didn’t have a decent entry level car. By 1980 or so the market had changed due to gasoline prices and when boomers started having pocket cash. Traditionally Olds customers started lower on the GM ladder and worked up, but GM didn’t have the product that appealed to this group. This worked fine until it became obvious that although Olds had a tremendously loyal clientele, it was the SAME clientele they’s had for two decades or more. By 1985 loads of them were gunning for their last car. As the “Greatest Generation” expired, so did Oldsmobile and the drop was precipitous. The FWD B bodies were solidly rejected by those still kicking, who went to Ford stores for their RWD fix.
GM didn’t help matters much since there was little to differentiate an Olds from a Buick anymore. Around 1995 crisis bells rang at GM (things move slowly there) and the tired out, “youth image” was pitched for Olds, and we got the, gasp, Alero, a car you could only like if you haven’t driven anything better. For the remaining elderly customers, we go the Aurora which although great on paper and the test drive was a total piece of crap.
The ubiquitous Ciera gets dissed all the time but GM made a load of money off of it. I remember a GM rep telling me on a $10k car there was $5k in it. After the 1989 redesign they had great engines and transmissions, good build quality and overall reliability was good. That’s what kept Olds selling to new customers. Now had Olds come out with a car that was as good as the Ciera in terms quality, they would have sold a zillion of ’em.
But GM didn’t. It was all SUV’s then and they didn’t give a darn about cars. They lost a lot of customers they never go back. Same old GM story.
Well remember Olds did keep the 88 around for a few years as the Regency for the real old school buyers, which had the 98 grille and interior on an 88 body, it even still had white walls, it was available until 1998, though I imagine most buyers that wanted that car were either dying or had moved on to a LeSabre Limited or a Park Avenue by then.
I had a weird attraction to those last Regency’s.
Something about the body style combo with the extra chrome and the whitewalls made them look pretty classy.
GM beancounters made many, many “profitable” decisions that resulted in the death of a longstanding model line or brand a few years later.
I also never saw too many new customers in a 1990s Ciera. Seemed to be a geezer special.
Indeed, Carmine, you are correct that GM kept the 88. Problem was it was targeted at a group of buyers whose numbers were reducing by several thousand ever day.That’s what doomed Oldsmobile and provided the rationale for the “youth image” they unsuccessfully employed.
Actually I think Buick is fine and is a strong seller that went from being the car most older folks bought as their last car before they passed on to making a cars a lot of folks want now.
Now I still cannot understand why GMC and Chevy make the same line up of pickup trucks under different names. Chevy Silverado or GMC Sierra? Whats the real difference save the names, small trimming differences etc. GM should have Chevy make all the pickup trucks and GMC make the heavy duty trucks because it seems that not only are GMC and Chevy competing with Ford and Dodge in the truck game but also with themselves.
I agree and sick of hearing how “Buick was old, should have been killed off”.
Buick was not always the boring beige car as in the 90s/00s. Gen X’ers have no memory of the road crusiers of the 20th century that pre-dated the 1990’s. Buick was #3 in sales a few times in the 50’s and was far from an “old timers car” then. That was Pontiac, before Wide Track.
Olds was redundant, clashing with Saturn, Pontiac, and Chevy. In fact, it was good to see the others go too. Some go on about Pontiac being ‘performance’, but in the end they had SBC motors, and not their own. Chevy now has a new Vetter, Camaro, and a version of the “G8”, which is getting axed anyway Down Under.
Amen to that. When I was a kid in the 1980’s the car I lusted after was the Buick Grand National. All black and could pretty much eat anything on the road for lunch in a race.
I also like the Buick Reatta and found the car to be a very nice driving and good looking car.
I drove a GN a couple of times. The brakes were scary compared to the velocity the brute motor could create!
In the United States, Buick 2013 sales totaled about 205,000 vehicles, which hardly makes it a “strong seller.” A fair amount of those sales came from the Enclave and Encore, which sell because they are riding the crest of the demand for crossovers, not because people have a hankering to buy a Buick.
The days when a Buick is more prestigious, or a “step up” from a Chevrolet or Ford, are long gone, at least among the general population under the age of 55.
Just as most buyers no longer remember the GTOs or Bonnevilles of the 1960s, or Cutlass Supremes of the 1970s, today’s buyers have no memories of the Centurys and Roadmasters of the 1950s, or even the Rivieras of the 1960s.
Wrong. Buick Enclave is $10k more than Chevy Traverse. Why would someone pay $10k more if it wasn’t more prestigious or a “step-up”? Increasingly more younger professionals ~40 years old are buying Enclaves. Enclave: attractive, healthy, professionally employed driver. Traverse: unkempt, overweight, oblivious-to-style driver.
Are those the real transaction prices, or the sticker prices? My parents bought an Enclave. They didn’t pay anything close to the sticker price.
Buicks are not more prestigious than Chevrolets around here. People looking for prestige from a GM SUV or crossover buy a Tahoe, Suburban or Yukon, not an Enclave. That’s what I see when driving or strolling through upscale neighborhoods.
If a crossover is parked in the driveway, it’s a Mercedes, BMW or Lexus crossover, or perhaps a GMC, but not a Buick.
Where is Geeberland? Where I live, practicality rules. 3% unemployment, no housing bubbles (continuous increases in real estate values however!), etc. We buy American brands (can I embolden and italicize this?). Buick is the choice for those who have a sense of class, style, and upward mobility. You can keep your harsh-riding BMW, over-priced Benz, and Toyota Lexus (these vehicles are more in line with Cadillac, not Buick). Enclave isn’t in the same class as Tahoe, Suburban, Yukon…why bring those into the discussion? Different lifestyles.
I live in Harrisburg, Pa.. Specifically, the western suburbs.
I’m glad you like your Buicks. My parents are quite happy with their Enclave (my wife likes it, too).
I brought up the big GM SUVs to show what people in upscale neighborhoods around here are parking in their garages and driveways. It’s not an Enclave, and it’s not because of a complete aversion to GM products.
The big GM SUVs simply have more prestige than the Enclave, even though lots of them wear the Chevrolet badge. At least, if we judge by what people who live in upscale neighborhoods are actually buying.
Suburbs. Suburbans. ‘Nuff said.
I would think that the suburbs would be a natural habitat for any crossover or SUV. Eastern cities tend to have narrow streets with not much on-street parking, so even an Enclave would prove to be somewhat cumbersome for a city resident.
Now I still cannot understand why GMC and Chevy make the same line up of pickup trucks under different names. Chevy Silverado or GMC Sierra? Whats the real difference save the names, small trimming differences etc. GM should have Chevy make all the pickup trucks and GMC make the heavy duty trucks because it seems that not only are GMC and Chevy competing with Ford and Dodge in the truck game but also with themselves.
The Buick dealers who (for the most part) inherited their GMC franchises upon the death of Pontiac would revolt if they lost GMC. The Sierra is consistently ranked around #20 or #21 in sales among all vehicles month after month. In MY 2013, the Sierra (#20 in sales for 2013), Terrain (#48) and Acadia (#52) all outsold Buick’s bestseller, the Enclave, ranked at #73 for last year.
Also, if you have a popular vehicle, selling more or less the same thing through multiple dealer channels gives you greater sales potential. That’s something pretty much all of the Japanese automakers have done extensively in the Japanese domestic market for many years. With a few notable exceptions, it’s not even a matter of having different brand names — it’s really just a way to get the product in more stores. It works as long as you have a marketable product; if the product isn’t competitive or if the market has dried up, then it becomes a pointless and in some cases self-defeating exercise.
I disagree. The Honda Accord and Acura took over Oldsmobile’s market and the Toyota Camry and Lexus took over Buick’s. The buyer’s profiles for the former perfectly coincided with those of the traditional buyers of the latter.
Isn’t it interesting that two Japanese owned companies figured out what Middle America wanted better than GM?
Well, in Honda’s case, the U.S. is a big slice of their total auto sales. Their JDM business has had its ups and downs, but the U.S. has remained pretty strong for them for many years.
Also, neither Honda nor Toyota had to deal with the generation gap issue that Detroit struggled with. Boomers didn’t have their parents’ generation’s hostility toward Japanese cars, so Honda and Toyota were able to increase the size and sophistication of their U.S. offerings more or less in proportion to the Boomers’ economic maturation and managed to avoid (until Toyota’s unintended acceleration scandal a few years ago) any really damaging pratfalls that would turn off Gen X and Gen Y buyers. If Honda and Toyota end up with a generational issue, it seems at this point it will more likely be that not many milennials are going to have the money to buy a new car any time soon.
Though I have overheard and been involved in occasional conversations involving some of these “milenials” and cars, and when names like “Accord” and “Camry” come up, some of these “milenials” makes faces and roll their eyes in what I imagine must have been a similar reaction to saying “Cutlass Supreme” to a person of the same age in 1985.
Sure, but there’s a important distinction between, “I’m 19 and if I could afford a new car, I sure wouldn’t want a big boring sedan like my parents’,” and the sort of generation chasm between the Boomers and their parents, which represented a big divergence in priorities and values. (Obviously, a lot of Boomers ended up backing into substantially the same values as the “Greatest Generation” after trading youthful rebellion for twice the greed and half the ethics of their parents, but still.)
I think the Japanese did an excellent job at figuring out what the two coasts wanted. Middle America is still full of Tauruses, Malibus and domestic trucks. The problem is, Middle America is no longer a large enough market to support the industry.
Sometimes I wonder if the Sloan ladder, while watered down by the standardization of so many features in low to high price cars, could still have relevance.
Simply put, with reasonable differentiation between the divisions, GM’s bets were hedged each year. Not crazy about the ’67 Olds 98? (I wasn’t). Perhaps the Buick Electra was more to your liking. Ford only got one crack at that customer with the Marquis, and Chrysler with the New Yorker.
Frankly, I was disappointed to see Mercury go simply because it was sometimes a more handsome and slightly better trimmed Ford. Some years I though the Ford looked better. But, sometime the option was nice to have.
Particularly if GM’s adminstration could have enforced boundaries between the divisions better. Buick and Chevrolet should not have been sharing the same basic car, ever. Buick should never have had a Cavalier clone, and there should have been no Chevy larger than a Celebrity/Malibu. But the problem was that Ford had no such brand restrictions, and Chevrolet insisted on trying to match Ford, which resulted in Chevrolet covering way, way more price territory than Alfred Sloan had ever imagined.
The dealer bodies played a part in the process, too. If I recall correctly, the decision to spread the original Nova to Pontiac, Oldsmobile and Buick was in response to dealer demands for a compact to sell.
One of the driving forces behind the introduction of the Cadillac Cimarron was that dealers wanted something to compete with upscale imports, and also had better gas mileage. They were taking on other franchises to obtain this type of car.
That is one challenge GM faced. State dealer franchise laws were tilted in favor of dealers, and the corporation was unable to prevent dealers from taking on other franchises.
That is what helped Honda obtain a foothold in Harrisburg. Two established, successful local GM dealers – one for Pontiac, and the other for Oldsmobile – added a Honda franchise in the 1970s, which gave Honda much more credibility in this market.
See, the problem with enforcing divisional boundaries, as GM found out, is that it puts you at an immediate disadvantage against rivals who don’t have those restrictions. It becomes very frustrating for the individual divisions and for dealers if they can’t offer popular options that direct rivals do simply because of an arbitrary corporate policy decision. (“No, you can’t offer in-dash navigation — only Buick and Cadillac can have that.”)
It also presupposes a kind of top-down management, which isn’t necessarily healthy. GM’s strongest period was when the divisions were more autonomous than they later became and when there was active and often ferocious competition between them. They were making enough money that the corporation was willing to allow them to make their own engines, dictate their own styling, etc.
Obviously, there were other issues at play like historically based perceptions of brand position, but the reason GM’s divisions were able to maintain those positions as long as they did was that the corporation gave them a substantial budget and a decent amount of leeway to make products that justified whatever marketing tack the division was taking. Take that away (or never provide it in the first place) and you end up with a lot of arbitrary hairsplitting and the dangerous idea that brand marketing strategies translate directly into consumer perception.
The alternative would be to back away from the idea of any serious hierarchy and just let your divisions sell as many variations as they and their dealers want, supplemented by a few division-specific specialty cars as showroom draws. If a particular variation doesn’t sell, so be it — the dealers won’t cry as long as they have other competitive products, and you can reinstate a similar variation in the future if market demands change.
The Buick and Olds Cavaliers were somewhat different in that the instrument panels were different than the rest. Buick’s Skyhawk also offered automatic climate control which was otherwise only available on full size Cadillacs and Buicks.
Sometimes I wonder if the Sloan ladder, while watered down by the standardization of so many features in low to high price cars, could still have relevance.
Seems unlikely. While the lower rungs of society still buy Fords, Chevys, and Dodges, the middle class (what’s left of it, anyway) have moved on (and are firmly dedicated) to Camcords and Corollavics.
That transition didn’t happen overnight. It took at least a quarter century for it to happen and GM simply didn’t have the time or resources to invest to get the markets back that had always been the core of the Oldsmobile and Pontiac divisions, as well as the now defunct Mercury brand. Chrysler, as usual, took a different approach and, rather then cancel mid-range Dodge, eliminated their slow-selling economy brand, Plymouth, and moved Dodge down market.
Chrysler did keep Plymouth low end, not letting the Breeze have leather or a V6 option for example and their vans were plainer, and that didn’t work out for them either, when the “mass market” divisions started to creep upwards, it started to blur the lines of whats is what.
I’ll argue that even low end isn’t low end any more, you can get leather and USBHBO sat nav screened Ford Fiestas and leather lined Cruzes, adaptive cruise controlled Impalas, etc etc, were’s the room for 2 or 3 “mid market brands” when you can do that? I disagree that Ford or Chevy is bought by the “lower rungs” of society, you’re telling me that the person that spent $32,000 for an Impala or Taurus isn’t middle class, but the person that spent the same for an Accord or Camry is?
What about those low rungs of society that spend $40-$50,000 for Camaros, Challengers and Mustangs? Is a $70,000 King Ranch or Suburban bought by “low rung” members of society?
Seemed typical GM to me when they killed Olds off. *Finally* one of the divisions was getting cars that looked unique to that division, cars one could look at and see styling sues from the Aurora and know that you were looking at an Oldsmobile. It was refreshing after coming off off of the height of the badge engineered eighties and early nineties. It was starting too look like it would be possible to see a resurgence in Oldsmobile – and I was see A LOT of Aleros and Intrigues on t he road
Was anything as boring as the Buick offerings when this announcement was made?
With Olds and Pontiac gone I say there is a hole in GM’s line-up. For nearly thirty years my mom bought her “sporty” cars from Pontiac (maybe not as special as her ’63 409-powered Impala, but she liked them.) Last car shopping go-round we went through all the Chevy, Buick, and Cadillac offerings – none were what she was looking for.
She seems happy with her Camaro convertible, but misses her Bonneville GXP. I’d expect she’d have a G8 GXP now had they still been available when she purchased.
The Chevy SS is basically the same car as the G8. The Cadillac ATS is sporty I think but small perhaps.
“… in the end, the old Sloan brand ladder just wasn’t relevant to the American automobile market in the 21st century.”
True, the last Olds was merely an N body GM car, sold many to fleets, and was not a stand alone ‘car maker’ anymore. The Grand Am had its cladding removed for 2003, and had Alero lines underneath. Even no more Oldsmobile built engines. What was the point?
Some loyalists defined Olds near the end as ‘import fighter’, but wasn’t that Saturn? Or Pontiac? or even Chevy, since Toyota was #1?
To modern shoppers, badge engineering is ‘silly’ and dated from the 1950’s. No need for differing looks and 3 page ‘brand management’ memos.
Being an old GM fan, I disliked seeing all the 90s/00s Olds rentals, BHPH beaters, and look alike cars. And this whole trying to keep brands going got GM bankrupt, so don’t suggest anything otherwise.
Designating Oldsmobile as the “import fighter” and putting the Intrigue up against the Accord and Camry shows how out of touch GM management was by this point.
By the mid-1990s, in the passenger car market, the Toyota Corolla and Camry and Honda Civic and Accord were top sellers. The “imports” were now the mainstream, at least in the passenger car market.
If badge engineering is “silly” and dated, why do Kia/Hyundai practice it? Hyundais are more “luxury”-oriented and Kias are “sportier” but just about all of their cars have a cross-division equivalent. (Though I do think the K900 muddles Kia’s image somewhat, if Hyundai wanted them to have a Genesis derivative they should have shipped the coupe over to Kia. Maybe they’re staring to make the classic mistakes.)
Really, Lexus and Acura are simply badge engineering as well, even if they shapes aren’t as slavishly copied as they used to be at GM. Heck, Dodge and Chrysler are the same way. It may not be the best idea but it’s far from dead…
It is not that badge engineering is dated and silly only that the way GM and Chysler put that practice into motion was silly.
To use your example of Kia and Hyundai, look at the Kia Forte and the Hyundai Elantra. Both cars built on the same platform but look different. same with the Accent and Rio(actually the current Rio looks like a Ford Fiesta clone) same thing.
Take the Honda Accord and the Acura TL, both are made in the same factory and both look very different.
Now look at Chryslar and its first generation Neon. It was offered in Plymouth and Dodge guises and unless you saw Dodge or Plymouth on the trunk lid you could not tell the two apart. same went for the 1984-2000 Voyager and Caravan and the K cars like Aries/Reliant and the Sundance/Shadow, Acclaim/Spirit and the Omni/Herizon etc
On the GM side it seemed that every division needed a Nova derivitive or an A body or a G body that looked so much alike.
When employing badge engineering the trick is to make each car look different so that it is not stealing sales from its other stable mates.
A pre-06 or so Lexus ES is as blatantly badge engineered as any GM ever was. I’d also argue it’s a very recent trend among Japanese and Korean automakers to camouflage their platform mates, their differences were much less apparent in the 90s/early 00s.
Except the Lexus has a much nice interior than anything GM could offer. The blue-rinse crowd went wild for them and still love them since they are easy to drive, comfortable, powerful and reliable as rocks.
Kind of like a 1960’s Buick, come to think of it.
The Japanese have a different approach to platform mates because for the most part, JDM automakers’ different dealer channels are not branded differently from one another (there are exceptions — there is now a JDM Lexus channel). The different networks have different product mixes — with some identical models, some unique ones, and a few that are the same basic product offered at another network but with minor styling changes — but they don’t necessarily carry different badges at all. The distinction is that for the most part there wasn’t a suggestion that one or the other version was better, because a lot of the prestige of domestic makes was based on the size and engine capacity of the individual model. (The main reason for offering the platform-mates in the first place was to maximize the number of sales outlets for each platform.)
I suppose I see your point. My wife’s current car is actually a ’12 Forte Koup, and I cross-shopped the Elantra; not only do the two cars look totally different, but they even felt significantly different, and (at least at that time) used different engines. Were it not for the fact that they are almost identically sized, no one would guess they’re related. Badge engineering done that way is a fact of life..but done the “the public won’t notice, it’s exactly the same car with different badges and trim” is a big part of what got the Big 3 in such hot water.
(I’m something of a 78-87 A/G body fan, and to me many of those cars look totally different…no one would confuse a Monte Carlo with a Bonneville G for example…but your point still stands.)
In the early days of GM (pre 1910) the concept I think was to have a collection of brand names that spanned the price range from low to high. I think the idea was to use as many common parts as possible to lower the overall cost of building the cars. But also the idea was to provide a range of cars to move up to as ones income permitted. Looking at the Classic Car Database website I can see that after 1910, when Durant regained control of GM and brought Chevrolet into the lineup, Cadillac was at the high end and Chevy was the low end. However the mid range models seemed to be a mishmash of Oakland, Buick and Olds, with Buick spanning the price range most of the time and Olds drifting up and down the price range.
The current model that Toyota uses is basic plus luxury. GM could probably get by with Chevrolet and Cadillac, but dumping Buick would be bad in China. Buick would not work here as a replacement for Cadillac.
Here’s the thing I don’t get about GM killing brands: why not let the good vehicles live on under a surviving brand?
The Aurora would’ve been a lovely Buick; if not for the FWD configuration and smooth shape, it would’ve been a credible Cadillac.
The G8 should’ve continued as a Chevy, perhaps replacing the Impala. (I know we have the SS now, but it was a long wait, and the car as moved significantly upmarket.)
The challenge is that selling the same vehicle under a different label further cements the idea that the GM brands really don’t mean anything anymore.
Yes, in fact I agree with you: GM should consist of Chevrolet, Buick, and Cadillac. Everything else has become meaningless… the sooner they acknowledge that, the better. (Heck, they’re almost there already!)
Well, by the time the bean counters got done with the divisions in the 70s and 80s the divisions, uh, excuse me, “brands” were meaningless. Once darn near every component was shared (corporate engines, etc) and any other meaningful difference between a Caprice Classic and a Bonneville (or Chevette and T1000) had been beaten out what is the point?
At least in the 50s and 60s Fisher body was able to differentiate the same basic body structure between the divisions and the divisions were allowed to further differentiate their offerings.
Shame the money that Roger Smith poured into Saturn was not used instead for product development for Oldsmobile. What *lasting* value did GM really get out of their Saturn experiment?
What *lasting* value did GM really get out of their Saturn experiment?
About $12 billion in total losses.
The problem is that the market and regulatory environment has changed dramatically since the 1950s and 1960s.
It was easy to give each division more leeway in engineering its own vehicles when it only offered 1-3 vehicles, and two of them were based on the same basic architecture and used the same drivetrain (for example, a Ninety-Eight and Delta 88).
By the 1970s, however, the dealers wanted to sell as many types of vehicles as possible, particularly in the wake of the first fuel crunch in 1973-74. They wanted to be insulated from swings in market demand.
Each division wanted to sell 4-5 different vehicles, and, by the 1970s, not all of them could share a common platform, or even be a derivative of an existing platform (as the Mustang was of the Falcon). The rise of SUVs and crossovers has only heightened that challenge, as dealers want to sell those vehicles, too.
GM, for example, couldn’t simply downsize the rear-wheel-drive Cutlass Supreme or Buick Century to compete in the subcompact class. Vehicles in that class were moving to a front-wheel-drive layout that required a whole new architecture. Even Buick and Oldsmobile dealers still wanted a fuel-efficient subcompact to sell if gas prices suddenly spiked upward, as they had done twice in the 1970s.
Add to that federal requirements that each individual drivetrain must be separately certified for CAFE and clean air regulations, and even mighty GM has to start looking for ways to reduce costs.
Another challenge was the rise of the imports. Suddenly, there were several available cars with REAL differences in style and driving feel available to buyers in all prices classes. The differences between a Chevrolet and a Buick don’t seem so profound in that type of environment.
Saturn aggravated the problem, but, in the end, the old Sloan hierarchy simply wasn’t adaptable to the changed environment of today’s auto market. Particularly since Ford and Toyota, and even Chevrolet, have proven that a “mass market” brand can sell fairly expensive vehicles.
A big part of the reason Saturn existed — which shouldn’t be overlooked — was as an attempt to bridge the generation gap. By the mid-80s, a lot of Boomers wouldn’t even consider a GM model except maybe a truck; they’d either gotten burned by the problems with GM’s small “import fighters,” knew people who had, or had simply compared the opposition and found it superior, all of which left a lasting negative impression. Half the point of setting up Saturn as a separate division was the hope that if it was a new brand, it wouldn’t have that ingrained resistance. Given the number of times GM insisted this time its exciting new import-battling small car was really, truly, you betcha world class, the logic wasn’t hard to understand, although there were various obvious criticisms to be made.
Lets face it: GM’s divisional structure didn’t really make any sense in the post war era, as Ford and Chrysler soon discovered at their peril. GM could keep it going, because of their massive market share. But once Buick started selling Specials at Chevy prices, and Chevy started selling Nomads at Buick Century prices, the futility of it was inevitable.
Yes, inter-divisional competition made so much sense; spend money fighting each other! With V8 engines that were different, but no typical consumer could really tell the difference, except in their imagination. Brilliant!
It was destined to collapse, just in the way it did. Sloan created a logical structure out of a bunch of rogue independent car companies under one umbrella, in the 20s, and that worked well for the times. But it was not a logical structure for a future where technological advances would quickly become available on the lower end cars. And we’ve seen that become fully realized, in the high-content entry level cars of today.
The evolution of the automobile market did not support GM’s structure.
The Sloan Ladder concept was probably doomed in the long run, but I think it (and GM’s success) could have lasted longer if there had been fewer stand alone dealerships.
Chevy dealers sold volume, and Cadillac dealers sold price, but the other 3 were kind of caught in the middle.
With dealers selling several (or all) the steps in the ladder, they could have eliminated a lot of the overlapping models.
In the
70’s Trim Chevy & Pontiac back to one B body each, Olds and Buick don’t need a X and Really dont need a H.
Imagine a world in which the Cimmaron didn’t seem like a good idea at the time. 😉
The problem is, to make this work they would have had to start consolidating dealers in the ’50s or ’60s and back then, who would have immagined that the growth would end.
Well said, Paul, and of course, GM couldn’t keep doing it forever. Read DeLorean’s book and you’ll see him spend a lot of ink making just this point. When GM started to feel the pinch of legacy costs and competition from imports, the writing was on the wall.
That said, there WAS a dynamic difference in GM cars until the FWD cars came along. A B-Body Catalina with a Pontiac 400 drove a whole lot better than an Impala with a 305. And Oldsmobile was also different, with different torque curves, suspension settings and most of all, interior trim quality.
The X and J bodies signals and end to this unique feeling.
Because Cadillac already had a Seville and a DeVille, which were the same car underneath with Cadillac styling already applied on top, what would have been the point of the Aurora in the Cadillac line up.
The Bonneville, which also shared the Aurora platform did get the seats and a Northstar in the form of the Bonneville GXP.
The supercharged 3.8 was the one to have on the Bonneville. I had one as a rental during a Rocky Mountain road-trip circa 1995 and I thought it hauled pretty well. Excellent, flat torque curve.
I sold them when new and I had a 1996, they were nice, I had a black 2001 SSEi as a demo for the weekend, it was a nice car. I liked both the 1992-1999 and the wilder 2000-2005 generation, my 1996 SLE went about 130,000 trouble free miles before we sold it, I still miss it.
GM never made any money on the Aurora. The cars were not well tested when released, common for GM, and running changes were made to improve the cars. The biggest issue was the small North Star V-8 and the “Short-Star” V-6, which were real nightmares. They’d leak like crazy and it usually started after a major repair like an intake manifold gasket, which was a notorious $1500 job on these cars, usually right after the warranty up. GM was incredibly stingy with goodwill and always has been. Many Aurora customers traded the cars in right after the warranty was up and eat a huge loss, as the cars were not cheap. When I was at GM, the Aurora had the highest warranty pay-out rate in the system.
This is why it was canned, it just cost too much
I owned two Intrigues with Shortstar 3.5’s and both were absolutely bullet proof and went under my ownership well over 150K miles without as much as a wrench turned in the engine bay unless you count oil changes and air filters. I heard the very early 1999-2000 engines could give some troubles however.
As with so much GM stuff, the Shortstar was working pretty well by the middle of the second year. Like you said, it was the first two years that really caused trouble. By then the reputation of the Aurora was shot.
The Intrigue was indeed intriguing. A very nice car but whoa, Nellie, not cheap when they were new. The ones with leather were nice but the GM cheap-ola mouse fur that attracts dirt like a magnet was dreadful.
And GM Canada acting like total dipsticks when refusing to do goodwill extended warranties didn’t help a lot.
I’ve owned four Oldmobiles, two ’91 Cutlass Calais, one ’96 Ciera and a ’92 Achieva. All were decent cars and pleasant on a road trip. The most trouble I had was that one of the Calais liked to consume ignition modules. They didn’t nickel and dime me like my ’07 Ford 500 or my late mother’s ’87 Cadillac DeVille.
All of GM’s new offerings leave me cold. I lust for precisely zero of them.
The final Olds line-up was probably the strongest it had been in several years – except I thought the second gen Aurora was a disappoint compared to the first gen. If I recall correctly, Olds actually experienced an upswing in sales after the end was announced – a combination of product and perhaps some nostalgia. Pretty good for a soon to be orphan brand.
Dat colour seems to be a GM favourite for end of production vehicles, A workmate had a 1982 Holden Premier V8 sedan nothing unusual you say except production of large F body based Holdens ended in 79 with the exception of the WB Statesman and some specially built Premiers my point is it was this colour a rich burgundy metallic they must keep it for end of the line cars.
“This is not your father’s Oldsmobile”
Probably the dumbest tag line ever since at the time, they were peddling the Calais, FWD 88s and 98s and the ugliest ‘Cutlass’ in history while my father had great cars like Rocket 88s, 442s and Vista Cruisers.
Olds died a typical GM mismanaged death and so did Pontiac. I hate what GM has become.
I’ve got to agree on the dumbest tagline. My father’s Oldsmobile was a Delta 88 with a high compression 455 4 barrel. He had others, but that’s the one I remember best. A buddy’s dad had a ’68 4-4-2, and another had Vista Cruiser. All great cars, and Oldsmobiles had their own “feel” back then. You wouldn’t mistake one for a gussied up Chevy. Back then when you paid more, you got more.
It’s too bad Olds, and GM in general, forgot that for so long.
When that tagline was around in the ’80s, I remember ranting to anyone who’d listen, “My father’s Olds was a ’59 88 with a big, lusty 394, a ride like a magic carpet, and enough room in the backseat for me to set up a little folding table to build my models cars on during road trips. To the best of my recollection, it required no servicing other than tune-ups and one respray in 12 years of daily use. My father’s Olds, despite its gas-guzzling ways and other flaws, was a more appealing vehicle than anything in Olds showrooms now. And the ’59 wasn’t even a particularly brilliant year, and I’m not even counting Olds’s Greatest Hits, like the Hurst 4-4-2, or the first-gen Toronado. If you guys still built cars like my old man’s old Olds, I might be car-shopping in an Olds showroom. Instead you build a hideous four-door fastback X-car that looks like it has a hatch but doesn’t; and would lose a drag race with a Pacer.”
Of course, insulting your own product history — and thereby also implying that your earlier customers who bought your “inferior” products from previous decades were fuddy-duddies and/or suckers — is never a good idea to begin with. But it’s worse to do it at a time when your current product line-up is noticeably inferior to past glories.
Instead you build a hideous four-door fastback X-car that looks like it has a hatch but doesn’t; and would lose a drag race with a Pacer.”
I’m not even sure what model of Oldsmobile you’re describing here.
The Aeroback cars weren’t X-car based, they were A-bodies, and they were out of production for 8 years when the “This is not your fathers Oldsmobile” ad campaign appeared in 1988.
The first time I saw that ad, I knew Oldsmobile was dead. And using Ringo Starr and his daughter smacked of absolute desperation.
I remember seeing the Final Editions on the stand at the ’04 Chicago Auto Show. Other than one of each model and a vertical sign, there was little there–not even a brochure or live people staffing it! It reminded me of a picture of the Studebaker stand at the show during the 1964-66 period. It too had a rather sad, about-to-turn-out-the-lights look.
But the Final Editions were pretty sharp at least. GM is so stupid! Kill Olds when they were still selling respectively–not like 4000-6000 cars a year, for crying out loud!–but keep stupid Saturn. Then in ’09 they did the same thing: Killed off Pontiac and kept…GMC?! A Cimarron-ized Silverado? What?! Arrrgh!!!
Oldsmobile’s execution by the powers that be was the point where I started getting hostile towards the Mark of Excellence’s business decisions. I LOVED Oldsmobile…
As opposed to what? An “Excitement” themed Malibu? GMC makes good money and it provides non-Chevrolet dealers with a truck line. I don’t agree necessarily with the decisions that were made, except for Saturn, which really shouldn’t have existed and maybe Hummer, but I don’t get the then “turning” on another division, like GMC for example, which didn’t cause Oldsmobile or Pontiac to get discontinued.
I know. But that was my gut reaction at the time when the decision vis a vis GMC and Pontiac was announced. Then again, I’m not really a “truck guy” either.
I was going to say GMC does quite well for minimal cost. There are many of us who would not buy a Chevy but would consider a GMC.
Sometimes the styling difference is minimal – re Silverado/Sierra, and other times it is appropriately differentiated re Traverse/Envoy.
I personally know three Denali drivers (two Yukons, one Envoy) who could afford pretty much anything they want. The Escalade is too flashy, and Ford doesn’t truly offer much through Lincoln.
I don’t miss them. Olds was just another buick, really. Mid level cars that were too broughammed out to appeal to the blue collar set, and not luxury enough to appeal to the high end buyer…no meat on the bone whatsoever for the performance enthusiast. GM had 2 brands for old people, so this was inevitable. It was just one division too many and with a name like ‘OLDSmobile’, who else besides geriatrics would really feel that this was their brand?
Of course, GM totally shit the bed after the Obummer bailouts. Keeping GMC (total retread of Chevy’s truck division) and Buick (entire demographic 5 years from the grave or the nursing home) were total bonehead moves. Chevrolet has the Archie Bunker set covered, no reason why the Impala and Malibu cant reach up a bit into the Olds/Buick zone…those 2 cars are all you really need for mid level luxury. You can offer a tarted up volume car in the same line and it’ll do fine. See Mercury.
Saturn could’ve been the exclusive small car division, with Pontiac covering the sporty high performance models and sporty high end imports, Hummer could have taken over the SUVs (GM’s Jeep), Caddy of course taking on the formal car luxury duties.
But hey, if car enthusiasts actually RAN the car companies then American cars would be the envy of the world once more. Cant have that now, can we?
If car enthusiasts ran car companies, said companies would go belly-up in very short order. I mean, how many of the regular posters here are driving Vipers?
The sort of people that bought Oldsmobiles now buy Toyotas and Hondas. Chevrolet was the brand for the lower-middle class, and IMO part of why it doesn’t compete well with Toyota and Honda. Chevrolet filled a market back then that buys used today, IMO. There are no new cars cheap enough to sell to that market. The lower middle can’t afford new cars.
I would agree with the notion that Olds buyers went to the Japanese. Olds towards the end was trying a half baked effort to compete with the imports. I always found that to be laughable since GM isn’t exactly known for cranking out dead reliable cars that cater to the appliance crowd. But then, Ive always found it ridiculous that the Big 3 chase the Japanese in the first place.
Diddly little fwd sedans that have little character/personality yet are dead reliable and efficient are NOT what people have ever looked for in American cars. That market does in fact exist, but its a very non-enthusiast type of buyer. Here, we do big, powerful, flashy and fast. Whether its the ‘traditional’ luxury sedan, the loud badass muscle car, the ballsy indestructible 4×4 or the humongous pickup or SUV, that’s the type of buyers that buy American. Chrysler proved that with the LX, strong and solid sales of the 3 ponycars, the ever more popular Wrangler, and steady pickup sales have always been proof of this.
By the same token, you don’t see Toyota trying to build its own Challenger. The Tundra and Titan are buy minor players in the f/s pickup market. The Ridgeline is a joke. The FJ Cruiser is about the billionth *failed* attempt at out-Jeeping Jeep.
The lower middle class could very well afford a new Korean econobox, but the question is do they actually WANT one? Why pay $14K for some sketchy tinny little car that looks like a light switch, when the same money or less can buy something youd actually want?
Interesting ideas, but when it comes to cars, the appliances are by far the biggest sellers. Cars like the Camry, Accord and Altima move tremendous volumes. Cheap financing, and expensive used cars can put a lot of butts in seats. Heck, you can lease a Hyundai for five years, with a full warranty for the whole time, for less than $200 a month. That’s dirt cheap and it puts a lot of iron on the road.
The really cool thing is there is a lot of choice out there now and few new cars are truly bad. The only really awful one I’ve had recently was a Sentra, the best hands down was a Mazda 3. There is very possibly a Mazda 3 in my future, I was smitten by it.
I was going to say there are perhaps 3 areas where domestic still dominates – pick up trucks, SUVs, and ‘pony cars’. The 2nd and 3rd categories are slowly contracting sales-wise.
I love the new Fusion. But after test driving several mid-size models, the Camry SE and Accord Sport are far superior in a many ways.
The domestics gave up a number of automotive phylum 25-35 years ago, and they aren’t going to get them back any time soon. Too many bad memories associated with inferior product.
A few more large recalls (especially safety related) and GM is toast.
This is bogus. American car-buyers have never been a mostly enthusiast crowd, and both the Japanese and Europeans have their own, and sizable, enthusiast followings. The appliance cars are the bread and butter of every volume make and always have been. The problem doesn’t come down to whether a car is an appliance or not, it’s whether it’s any good or not.
I do totally agree that we should have (lots) more RWD cars in the vein of the Chrysler LX. The 300/Charger/Challenger should be the model for the bigger and pricier modern American cars, but for smaller cars – which is where the volume is – FWD and inline fours are the most sensible choices for packaging reasons. That doesn’t mean they have to be bad, boring or un-American, it’s just that most have been that way.
Oldsmobile lives on to this day, or at least lives on several times a month. In the Crossword puzzles. Typical clue is “Last Olds” … with the 5 block answer of Alero. And it is literally correct. nice to see that photo of the Last Olds.
Yes, but that may be due more to the fact that crossword-puzzle writers like words with lots of vowels, and “Alero” is 60% vowels. This is also why the word “aerie” (a remarkable 80% vowels) comes up a lot more often in puzzles than this fairly obscure term for an eagle’s nest otherwise would: it’s just convenient for the man or woman behind the puzzle.
It is interesting that they did a special ‘send-off’ package rather than letting it fade away. Did they cost more than standard cars?
Ford Australia is currently selling the last 500 ever Falcon GT F (for final) edition, there may be literally one or two not sold despite the fact they haven’t been built yet, and many dealers are asking for a markup on the $78k MSRP. It remains to be seen what they, and Holden & Toyota, will do with the last of the local production cars. I don’t remember Mitsubishi or Nissan doing anything special when they ceased local production.
Some of the best cars I have ever owned were Oldsmobiles. I have currently a mint yellow 1979 2 door A/G -body Calais with Olds V8 and love it to death. It rides and handles like a dream and gets loads of attention at car shows. My last Olds before the Calais was a 2002 Intrigue which was one of the best riding/handling and feeling W-bodies ever and that 3.5 Shortstar was very quiet and smooth and loved to rev and suited this car to a tee.
My 2000 blue Intrigue was also awesome and never gave me any trouble along with my 3 W-body Cutlass Supreme’s, a 1994 white loaded sedan with the 210 Hp 3.4, another 1994 tan SL sedan and a 1995 green 3.4 equipped loaded coupe with leather and roof. Other than minor issues they were all good cars and the power trains never failed or left me stranded on any of them.
Also owned and admired, a 1981 silver blue Cutlass S with 231 V6 power, a 1981 tan 2 door coupe with bucket seats and Old V8 than ran well over 200K and last but not least my grandfather’s 1985 gold 2 door Cutlass with 307 and every power option available.
The only one out of this long list that ever gave me issues was the 1981 231 sedan as it’s computer carb was tough to keep in tune and the backing plates rusted out which also revealed a cracked retaining bolt on the limited slip differential which required replacing the entire rear end.
It would be interesting to see what and Olds lineup would look like today if one existed.
At this point, there isn’t much more I can really add to this conversation. I did attend the Oldsmobile Homecoming last weekend in Lansing. I will say that of all the car shows I have attended, the Olds people are some of the nicest, and you can really feel a sense of community amongst them.
Regarding the last few years of Oldsmobile, I really think they could have been winners, but the small details are what did them in. The styling was good, and cohesive across the line. Sadly, the quality of materials and some assembly issues screamed “typical GM”.
Back in the 1980’s in Michigan, I remember as a kid that owning an Olds meant your family had class. My parents had a 1986 Cutlass Supreme Brougham coupe, black with claret leather and chrome Super Stock wheels. It turned heads everywhere we went. I was consider a nerd in school and was generally a bit of an outcast. but, whenever I was dropped of in front of school in that Cutlass, even the snobbiest of kids would nod in approval at me, and treat me a little better. Till this day Olds is my all-time favorite brand, and the 80’s Cutlass is my all-time dream car.
Many of you will recall that I have owned three Oldsmobiles, a 1987 Cutlass Supreme Brougham, and two Aleros, a 2004 and a 2001. Were they perfect? Hardly. But I enjoyed every one of them. Sadly, in the case of the Aleros, typical GM electronics reared their ugly heads.
A couple of months ago, I had no choice but to do what research said most Oldsmobile owners of the last decade did…I bought a new Honda.
Sorry I didn’t see you this year. You will probably recognize that about half of those shots were taken at the Homecoming this year and last.
In May I bought a ’95 Ninety Eight, and am definitely enjoying the Olds experience so far.
I don’t know if Olds collectors have any more community than other brands, but I do think that Curved Dash owners have more fun than any other group I’ve seen at shows. It’s like they all have 100 year old go-karts.
Dan, I’m sorry I missed you too!
Perhaps you might make it to the Dream Cruise…I am hoping to have a group there representing The Brougham Society (and by relation, CC)!
Definitely hoping to make Woodward this year. Let me know where the Broughams will be. 🙂 I’d guess you can get my email from Perry.
Dan, I should still have your email…it got caught up in all my car show stuff from last year. Either way, as I get the details finalized, I’ll let you know!
I agreed Olds was considered a car for a family of secure means.
What always gets my goat is that the Cutlass was a top-selling car for a few years in the late ’70s. How could you fritter that away? You have to work very hard at it…and GM did…
“A couple of months ago, I had no choice but to do what research said most Oldsmobile owners of the last decade did…I bought a new Honda.”
Richard, Out of curiosity, what made you choose the Accord over a Malibu or a Regal? I’m not very current on the mid-size ranks so I’m genuinely curious what GM continues to do wrong in that segment. As my wife owned an Alero for nine years, I can sympathize with some of the common issues you might have seen there, but I wonder what else went into that decision.
“What always gets my goat is that the Cutlass was a top-selling car for a few years in the late ’70s. How could you fritter that away? You have to work very hard at it…and GM did…”
Dave, no, not really. You don’t have to work hard at all…in fact one of the better ways to lose that is to not work hard and to become complacent. Others will be glad to take your place and GM let it happen. It’s debatable whether the mid 70’s Cutlass was actually a good car, opinions on the Colonnade seem to be sharply divided, but there is little question it was what the public wanted at the time. The public’s tastes changed, as they are wont to do, and GM was slow to react.
Actually Chris, I went with a Civic EX. I like what I saw with the Accord, but I decided that I just didn’t want to spend the extra $$$.
Initially I did look at the usual Domestic models. Over at Ford, I frankly don’t like the new Fusion. The Focus was to me, “meh” at best. The dash was too gimmicky for me, and I didn’t care for the Powershift transmission. I tried out a Cruze, it was very quiet and smooth, but between my concerns about the turbo over the long term, and GM’s woes of late, I decided against it. The Malibu seemed overpriced for what it had to offer.
In the end I narrowed my choices down to the Civic and Corolla. Despite what the naysayers say, I found the new Corolla to be a very comfortable and competent feeling little sedan. Sadly, the dealer nearest me soured the experience. The salesman kept wanting to talk payments while I kept insisting on OTD price…it drove me nuts! I kept saying I wanted to pay cash, but it went in one ear and out the other :/
The Civic won out by being quiet, reasonably comfortable, and I got a killer deal. I was going to get a 2014 model, but the dealer here in Ypsilanti had a leftover 2013 in a seemingly unpopular color called Kona Coffee (dark brown metallic). Combined with it having a five speed auto as opposed to the new-for-13 CVT, and the much more user-friendly radio/nav head unit, I just liked it better. The fact that it was almost a year old and was pressed into light demo duty and had 1590 miles on the odo, I didn’t have much trouble getting them to take $4300 off the sticker!
In the past two months I have had it in seven different states, and it has no problem achieving 43 mpg on the highway.
I’m really happy to know that when I am finished with it around the 200k mark, it will still be worth something! My poor Olds, which I kept immaculate, and had all of 123k on the clock, was valued by the dealer at scrap value. (Thankfully I sold it to a Very happy guy for a LOT more).
I love classic cars, and classic Oldsmobiles in particular, but for daily drivers, I think all my cars from here on out will have either an “H” or a “T” on the hood now…
That’s SWEEEEEEEET! Never saw a Civic in this color and the hood ornament is a very nice touch. Good choice, I love the Fusion but it took me a long time to warm up to that grille – plus my primary interest in them is the Hybrid/Energi models, the other ones aren’t as interesting to me and I’d probably rather have a (even better looking) Mazda6. Rented a Focus when this generation first debuted and I thought the transmission was a little too herky-jerky/choosing it’s shifts in an odd manner. Figured it might just be that particular car (being a rental) but maybe not, otherwise I loved it too. Don’t know much about the Cruze, but it looks nice and I know there’s a diesel model so that’s cool. The Corolla seems OK, but I’d much rather have the Civic!
What happened with the second Alero? I remember you getting it not too long ago! You should put some money aside for an 80-something Cutlass Supreme to take out on nice days. They’re still pretty cheap and the older ones can be put on classic car insurance.
Thanks!
The Alero started to have problems stemming from the typical GM electronics from the era, and the engine was starting to leak various fluids. I took that car on a LOT of long distant trips in the year and a half that I owned it, and it suited me rather well. But when it got to the point that every long trip I went on resulted in me having to visit a mechanic, it was time to bid my traveling companion farewell.
When my finances and garage space improves, I would very much like to have an 80’s Cutlass again! Preferably a 1985 Supreme Brougham coupe in burgundy. Most likely I think I would have to find the nicest shell available with a factory moon roof, and just have the rest of the car “built” the way I would want it. No, it wouldn’t be original, but it would look it, and be the car of my dreams…just like this…
I owned a first gen Aurora. Most problems were covered by the warranty (a leaky valve cover, sticky brake pads). I caught the water pump leaking before the engine overheated. No problems with the starter. I think the first generation Aurora’s styling was better than the second, but the second was intended to replace the Olds 88. While the front end was an interesting style with no radiator grill, this did lead to the engine running a bit warm in stop and go traffic on hot days.
Over the years I have owned mostly Buicks and have been happy with them. I also owned a 78 Olds Regency. I have to say that the Aurora was an interesting car, but I really liked the 95 Riviera better, and my 86 Electra was a nicer car than the 78 Olds.
When GM (in the late 80s) decided that Olds should be European style sedans and Buick American style, the two divisions should have gotten completely different platforms for their cars. This is not where GM wanted to go. GM was all about having 5 versions of the Cavalier.