CC has covered the Talbot Tagora previously, when I last saw one, also at a car show. In that case, it was in France and the car was the top of the range V6 variant. That was the first Tagora I had seen anywhere for at least 10, possibly 15, years.
A sign of how rare this car is? In the space of 15 minutes, I heard 6 obvious petrolheads say a genuine “What’s this?” or “Don’t recognise this one”. Published numbers shown there are 9 Tagoras left in the UK, of which only 1 is the GL version, so this car is probably unique, as a right hand drive Talbot Tagora GL.
This time, it was in the UK, at one of my favourite car shows, the Classics on the Common in Harpenden, near Luton, just north of London.
In this case, the car is possibly even more interesting, for what it is and the condition it is in–a 1981 car with the base model 2.2 litre 4 cylinder engine, appliance white paint, basic GL specification–probably the cheapest Tagora you could buy in 1981, for around £7500, or say £23000.00 adjsuted.
There is no need to cover the Tagora again; to summarise, it was originally planned by Chrysler Europe as a top of the range car to complete with the Ford Granada, Rover 2600/3500, Opel Rekord, Audi 100 and Renault 20/30 range, as well as the Peugeot 505 and 604, which from 1978, were stable mates to the proto-Tagora in the Peugeot-Citroen group following the French government takeover of Chrysler Europe, and its break up into cars for Peugeot and trucks for Renault.
The Tagora was slated to replace the unsuccessful Chrysler 180 and 2 litre saloons, which were to all effect non-existent in the European markets by 1977. Chrysler wanted a 6 cylinder version, and the market would have demanded such an engine for the Tagora to be seen as comparable with the cars mentioned above. A Mitsubishi straight 6 was tried but Chrysler really wanted to get access to the Renault-Peugeot-Volvo Douvrin V6, which of course was available after the Peugeot takeover.
The car was launched in early 1981 and dead by the end of 1983. Peak production was 15000 in 1982, total production was less than 20000 and the business case had been made on a volume of 60000 annually. The Talbot brand itself died in 1985 (at least for cars; a rebranded Peugeot J5 van struggled onto to 1992 in the UK).
The feature car in last year’s CC was a 2.7 litre V6 SX model, the Brougham of Tagoras if you like, although Talbot never offered an automatic with the V6. This was a pretty basic specification; more like a taxi specification than the Brougham specificaion of last year’s car. Check out the moulded plastic Talbot vanity panel in the centre of the dash, the blank swithces and gaps in the instrument panel, and that huge clock where you might expect a rev counter, and no doubt got one on a GLS. And to save you zooming in to check, that is a four spped gearbox.
Styling apart, it could be a tidy two year old car on a manufacturer approved used car programme, given the condition and the mileage of just 23332 in 33 years. It even has the original dealer stickers, including the Talbot marketing strapline “Talbot Tagora – Luxury and performance redefined”. Hmm.
So, the car has done more than one mile for each copy sold of the entire production run, and looks like it is fresh from the dealer. Quite a surprising find.
Looks like an original number plate as well. The font changed when the registration system was overhauled in 2001.
Never seen one of these in the metal. However the proportions don’t measure up for me. It looks like a Talbot Solara that has been given the 150% treatment on the photocopier.
The same car got a mention on the Autocar website http://www.autocar.co.uk/blogs/anything-goes/spotting-classic-much-rarer-ferrari-local-car-show
I hadn’t seen the Autocar feature but thanks for the link!
Yes, rarer than an F50
To this Yankee, it looks like a Renault Alliance at the “150%” setting!
That’s exactly what I thought when I looked at the one in the “FLAGSHIP” ad!
Not even the stickers are faded. Rare indeed, but why would anyone keep an appliance white appliance in such a revered shape?
It’s an appliance, use it up!
That said: it’s nice to have a time capsule like this to look at.
Surprised to believe this could be sold as a luxury car. It could almost be an early prototype for the Hyundai Stellar.
There is one absolutely positive point to be said about the Tagora : The 2.2 liter engine was used for Citroëns BX 4TC, the Group B rally car .
Furthermore, this car never stood a chance, Peugeot were boss in PSA (Peugeot Societe Anonyme) over Citroen and Talbot.
They were not waiting for a 505 competitor nor Citroen were waiting for a CX competitor.
It is as simple as that, probably lessons learned from the British Leyland era, where BL cars competed more againt their sister then the other competition.
Peugeot had no intention to take over Chrysler Europe but were forced by the French government, the Simca Talbot Horizon successor was adapted by Peugeot and launched as the 309.
A rare sight when new,I remember seeing a battleship grey one in the mid 80s and thinking there was no way I’d swap my Mk2 Ford Granada(Euro model) for one.Thanks for another great feature Roger
I remember the years when Talbot’s were usual daily drivers in respectful numbers. Especially the Horizon, Rancho and Solara. But the TAGORA was a rare kind of animals. I had seen only 2 or 3 of them in my entire life. TAGORA has represented a quite unique design among other competitors. Thanks for posting this article.
The 2.2 liter Tagora shared its engine with every Peugeot 505 Turbo produced. Peugeot used the Talbot/Simca engine because it was fundamentally stronger than their own engines.
I know I’m in the minority here, and I’ll admit to its plasticky nature, but I am quite fond of the interior design. I enjoy the forward slope and low mounting of the instruments, the big gauges and their font, even if it’s not as ergonomically correct as the high mounted designs popular in such cars as the 604.
Thanks for keeping the Chrysler Europe flame alive, Rog.
I do not see that as a minority position, and agree that this has the potential to be very attractive interior. I like the “open” style of it, and I can also see a bit of series 1 Rover SD1 there, which is always a good thing.
Personally, I find many current interiors with the large central stack with vents either side somewhat generic. Please don’t mention this to Jason Shafer though – we have enough trouble with wide consoles.
Agreed – really cool dash, much nicer and far more adventurous than the early Peugeot 505 dashboard.
Appears to have started its life in salty Glasgow as well. Melvin is still a Peugeot dealer, but changed its name a couple of years ago.
And what is also related to Talbot’s (and Simca’s) in my neighbourhood only very few of them are still on the road in 2014. I’m talking about Europe. A little Samba and believe it or not two K-Cars. An american Plymouth Horizon and a Dodge Omni.
Did Ital have something to do with that design? Looks very much like an alt-universe Hyundai Stellar to me.
Ital did not have anything to do with the Tagoras’ design. It was designed by Roy Axe and his designers at Whitley in Coventry,UK. BTW Whitley is now Jaguar Land Rovers Research and Development Centre.
I think it was a design led by by Art Blakeslee rather then Roy Axe, but was certainly an in-house effort
A compromised car launched into a dying segment – the large, mass-market “luxury” sedan. The fleet ad says it all – The Tagora is basically a 6-cylinder Solara, itself a notchback Alpine.
Not dying by the late seventies/early eighties. The Ford Granada and Opel Rekord still sold well. And the very successful Renault 25 had yet to be launched. So did the Ford Scorpio, Opel Omega, Peugeot 605 and Fiat Croma. Citroën, Alfa Romeo, Lancia and Saab also offered E-segment cars. The early nineties, around then the writing was on the wall for all of them.
From front on, it looks like one of those space age Mazda 929s from the 80s. Keep it up, Roger, obscurantism rules!
There is some 929 in there, isn’t there? I actually quite like the design of these–it looks of its time, but works well for me. I also see some Peugeot 604 resemblance in the nose, with the wide rectangular lamps. Haven’t ever seen one in the metal and probably never will, but like it nonetheless.
I know they obviously would have been the least popular model in Europe at the time, but the Tagora only makes sense to me fully decked out and with the V6. I mean, I totally understand why they flopped and got shitcanned so quickly, but I can see at least some appeal in one of the high-spec cars. And still, I’d probably rather have a 505!
I do think it’s cool though, and any one of them at this point is an amazing find. What kind of remarkable person keeps a car like this in such good shape for 33 years?!
Someone with a heated garage and a pronounced aversion to car salesmen?
Ironically, it rather appeals to me as a “stripper”: The Talbot Biscayne. It’s a type of car that was not terribly common in Europe, a large but very low-end one.
hehehe. Talbot Biscayne; sounds like a hero in a romance novel. I’m picturing Fabio with Colin Firth’s head.
I can see the appeal, and maybe it’s a natural fit since the Tagora’s styling is so minimalist… but the other two cars fitting this description did it so much better, IMO: the taxi-spec W123s and 505s.
Those how many left numbers often seem implausably low but for a Talbot… There must be some story behind this car! Apparently Mitsubishi made a 6cyl version of the Saturn four, a lucky escape for Talbot perhaps.
I remember those well from my days in the motor trade in the UK (early 90s) – they were seen as the 80s equivalent of the Austin/Morris 1800 “Landcrab”, nobody wanted them by then and a mention of one usually resulted in disparaging remarks. We used to go to the car auctions to find cars to do up and flog and those came up occasionally. Bidding would start at 10 Quid and rarely pan out at more than a 100. Totally outdated stylistically. What was daring in 1969 on the Tatra 613 was old hat by the time the Tagora came on the market.
In my view Chrysler got into dire straights not a little bit due to failing to inject any pizzazz into its range – the cars were seen as extremely dull (albeit worthy). My recollection is that in the UK they were thought of as old age pensioner’s cars – they failed to obtain any of the youth market like Ford or even Vauxhall. Chrysler should have gotten into motorsports a lot more, possibly by having local racing shops prepare Plymouth Barracudas to challenge the Mustangs and Camaros which were taking over local saloon car racing in the 60s, as well as having something like the Escort Cosworth to sell on the local markets. A large E-segment model would also have helped but that needed to happen 10 years earlier.
After the Humber Hawk was killed off(there were a few small block Mopar V8 cars built) Australian Valiants were imported to the UK but were very expensive and dropped in the 70s.That seems to have been the total big(by European standards) car effort of Chrysler,the Talbot Tagora was at least an attempt to make a new car and not a warmed up older model or captive import.
I’m aware of those but a possibly more sensible option would have been the Spanish Dodge 3700GT (which might have been also too large, but at least saved on shipping costs from downunder). Obviously a Humber Hawk-sized car would have been ideal and I cannot see why the Hawk could not have been modernized – its engine still had some life in it being an efficient design which would have responded well to being fitted with something like Bosch’s K-Jetronic fuel injection. Again, this could have only worked as a part of a coherent strategy to lively-up the full range…
Actually, I was going too far… The C car and/or the Simca Project 929 could have been ready at the right time but Chrysler killed them, stupidly. See here: http://www.rootes-chrysler.co.uk/simca-cars/simca-929.html
And there was the R429 (http://www.rootes-chrysler.co.uk/chry-r429.html)… Instead they kept producing these dreary Avengers, assorted Humber Scepters and Simca 1100s (again, good car but hardly exciting).
A fascinating car – I am not usually drawn to designs from the early 1980s. They seem so stark and minimalist, all hard angles and edges, and lined with stiff plastic of varying colors. But I am strangely drawn to this one – and have no earthly idea why. Maybe I share PN’s affinity for big strippos. Although, I would tag it as the Talbot Fury I, both as a hat tip to the Chrysler heritage and fact that the clunky name fits the clunky car.
Not far from the Fairmont sedan in some ways, particularly the roofline; this despite their having completely different target markets.
I always thought the Tagora was a lemon – poor name, poor design, poor shape, poor build quality too I assumed.
I had a cousin who always drove Humbers. After the Super Snipe died he had a Chrysler 180 or 2 litre ( from the Humber dealer) for a little while, and then bought a straight-six Mercedes.
I see a Talbot Alpine from time to time in town.