Škoda, the Czech automaker that has been wholly owned by Volkswagen since 2000, has recently been filing trademarks applications at the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. While automakers regularly do this even in markets they are not planning on entering, it opens an interesting discussion…
Škoda, first established in 1895 (not a typo), in fact has sold cars in the United States before, back in the 1950’s with its Felicia sedan for a few years before taking its ball and heading back home without having had much success. More recently, it has pretty much served as VW’s entry-level brand in Europe. Last year (2015) they sold just over a million vehicles globally, which I believe is a bit more than Subaru did, however Subaru sold just over half of those in North America.
Yes, many of you may think that VW is itself an entry-level brand but both Škoda and Seat rank below VW in their internal hierarchy with Audi one step above VW and then there is Porsche and Bentley above that (as well as Lamborghini and Bugatti of course as far as passenger vehicles are concerned).
Over the last few years Škoda has been increasing its status and generally now is seen more as a VW with a little more space/size for about the same or a bit less money which as a general concept is usually a winning one in the U.S. In any case, I recently came across these pictures I took of a Škoda Yeti (pre-facelift version) in Iceland at the beginning of this year and thought this might be an opportunity to use them even if they are a little blurry due to the dampness.
This particular one appears to be owned by Isavia, which runs the public airports in Iceland. I have no idea what it was doing in downtown Reykjavic.
The Yeti has been quite successful for Škoda . Introduced in 2009, it is basically a reworked VW Tiguan and about a foot shorter but almost as wide as a Honda CR-V and looking a bit like a slightly raised Kia Soul or 2nd generation Scion xB. Engines in Europe are typical VW fare with a whole range of 4cylinder gas and diesel engines ranging from 1.2l to 2.0l in displacement.
The highest current output (if I am not mistaken) is 170hp which would be more than enough for the North American market but any drivetrain that fits in a Tiguan or Golf should fit without issues. An available AWD system is Haldex based (so a slip and grip system) and it has garnered high safety ratings in European crash testing.
I’ve been in a few modern Škoda’s over the years and the feeling is a bit weird at first if you are used to VW/Audi. If you are used to or familiar with modern Audis, getting into a new VW feels familiar but a little off, most things look and feel very similar but are slightly different and generally a small step down in perceived material quality.
Getting into a Škoda is a bit less of a step down from VW, overall they are quite close in overall look and material feel and like the Audi to VW relationship, the available technology has tended to lag behind by about one generation.
Personally I love the look of the Yeti, it’s small but looks purposeful, chunky and bigger than its numbers suggest. Supposedly it drives similarly to a Tiguan and Golf (which makes sense being based on them), and should be of similar quality – I realize this means very different things to different groups of our readership and I don’t want to get into a pissing match regarding if they are or are not durable, reliable, and well-built.
Suffice it to say that VW’s can rack up some very impressive mileages overall but perhaps may need more care and feeding than some of the class leaders. They tend to do best in the hands of fans and not just as an alternative to five other similarly sized vehicles.
Note that Škoda’s are nowadays very common, and have sold very well in places with inhospitable climates and geography including Iceland and Russia as well as locales that we are generally more familiar with such as England and the rest of Western Europe. Seeing a Škoda is no more remarkable than seeing a Kia here in North America, in fact in Iceland I would say I saw more Škoda’s than VW’s which are themselves very common.
If nothing else, the Yeti tends to stand out visually, at least to me. When in Europe (or Iceland in this case) with many different cars than I see at home but a lot of them still looking somewhat generic, the Yeti is one that I instantly am drawn to and recognize.
The problem that VW would face is how to position it; some have spoken of just replacing the brand’s offerings in North America with the equivalent Škoda versions. This would be somewhat do-able as the Škoda range more or less duplicates VW’s (with the exception of the Touareg and the supposedly upcoming even larger SUV; the new Škoda Kodiaq 7-seater on the other hand is basically a stretched next-generation Tiguan) but perhaps it might be better to start as a secondary offering at existing VW dealers.
The biggest hurdle would most likely be pricing. While Škoda’s are generally seen as less expensive than their “donor” VW, making them even less expensive than many of VW’s stateside offerings would seem to be a challenge. Perhaps with a much longer warranty and an emphasis on the more “established” technology they could make some inroads here. So, what do you think, would you ever consider a Škoda Yeti (or any other Škoda offering, see them at www.skoda-auto.com/en) as a realistic option or dismiss it out of hand as if it were a Yugo?
I was just in Iceland last month! What a beautiful place!
Yes, I would be interested in a Yeti. It would make a good competitor for the Mini Countryman and the Jeep Renegade.
This was our second trip after going in summer ’14, and it was equally beautiful in a completely different way in the winter. The winter was NOT terrible weatherwise compared to here at home but the sights look completely different, seeing Gullfoss waterfall with ice all over it and walking around Reykjavik with snow falling in marvelous. Icelandair offers some extremely inexpensive package deals in February, we went for five days and it was perfect. Everything is much cheaper off-season as well.
If they are sold in the US, it would make the most sense to sell them through existing VW network. When I was working for VW the packaging for replacement parts were marked VW Audi Seat Skoda from the VW warehouse ten years ago.
It is hard to see how they could be priced much lower then the US produced Jetta/Passat versions only sold in North America we have now.
It would give VW a much needed product expansion. The fact that they often are based on older platforms is something the US has been provided from VW anyway. We are always the last to get a updated platform or model anyway.
I think badging them as VW’s would probably be a better way to go.
Skoda and Seat have some good looking models and seem to have a good reputation quality and value wise where they are sold now.
Minor note: unlike the US-built, North American Passat, the Jetta is made in Mexico and is sold all over the world. Both the Jetta and the North American Passat are “behind” one generation in terms of VW platforms. Europe’s Passat is now MQB-based, but ironically it is only in China that an MQB-based Jetta-sized sedan exists!
You are right, it is only the Passat that is US designed and built.
Skoda has a reputation of a good disposable car, i.e. a car that you buy new and try to trade-in early, before anything goes wrong. If you’re looking for long-term durability and repairability, avoid VW (and related) products at all cost.
In areas of the UK where purpose-built taxis are not required by licensing regulations, Skodas have been the most popular choice of taxi and private-hire operators for at least a decade.
Presumably they don’t choose them for the styling.
Same in Israel.
Same in Spain, too. I was surprised to see more Škoda than Seat in the taxicab fleet. I queried a driver why would he choose Czech-produced Škoda over home-grown Seat: he replied Škoda and Seat are mechanically the same but different in price.
My comment was a bit oblique, I should add that 500,000 miles is not unknown for a diesel Octavia, and ex-taxis are regularly advertised with 350,000 on the clock which is presumably the point where operators aren’t sure they can rely on them anymore.
Not too shabby for a fuel efficient, 1.9 litre four.
Police and ambulance service use them as well. Seen as a VW with value for money
That’s not how Skoda is seen in the EU. They are typically private purchases and retained for six years or more. Skoda have a sterling reputation as solidly made cars.
(I’m in Denmark).
I quite like the Yeti, but for a car full of VW hardware and software – and with a Skoda badge- it is quite expensive.
Various Skoda and Seat models have the flair that equivalent VWs lack, and in my opinion could do better in the U.S. as a result. But it would be expensive and pointless to try to establish either of these brands here, nor could they readily be priced lower than VWs, so better to bring selected models with the VW badge on them.
Yes, some of the Seats I saw in Mexico were quite nice.
I wouldn’t buy them due to the dodgy rep all VAG products have acquired, but they were sportier looking than their Teutonically-bland VW brethern.
I was interested in the Yeti when these cars were assembled from CKD kits on the GAZ (~ 2012 – 2015) and were relatively reasonably priced. Considered it very seriously as my next car, in fact. Right now, I’m not interested as I feel it is just too expensive for what it is.
Overall, it is a nice and competent little crossover, with a nice interior, reasonably roomy (subjectively, more space than in a Kia Soul, and also better seating position), amazingly maneuverable in tight parking spaces (compared to large sedans I’m used to driving, at least). Better than the Soul, better than Mitsubishi ASX or Suzuki SX4, has more personality than VW’s own Tiguan built on the same platform (and, subjectively, better seats). Among the cars I’ve tested, only Ssang-Yong Actyon offered more for the money (but was overall less competent than the Skoda).
Now that the Subaru Forester has ballooned from a tidy little SUV (station wagon, is how I regard it) to a lumbering mastodon that even Consumer Reports, its most vocal supporter, admits is “not an agile car”, which my ’01 most definitely is … and since that little sweetheart is showing its age, I would certainly welcome the chance to replace it with something like the Yeti. It’s the right size, it’s pretty without being cute, and I have to assume it is agile as all get-out. Plus its 2-liter engine throws out almost the same hp as my car’s 2.5, almost certainly with much better gas mileage. The only downside is I’d have to get it serviced at a VW shop instead of my beloved Suby Specialties …
My cousin in Austria has one and I rode in it last summer. Like other Euro VWs, the interior was quite nice. It has a nice, chunky feel to it. Another cousin (his brother) has a Tiguan, which I’ve also ridden in a few times. Similar nice, solid fell, and excellent seats.
But I like the look of the Yeti better. And, yes, if I wanted a car in this class, a Yeti would be a very appealing choice.
I do like the Skoda Octavia which I saw all over England on a recent trip. The owners seemed very pleased with them.
However, If Skoda wants to make a beachhead in the US, its needs a CUV stronger than the Yeti. That’s the current problem with VW; It lacks a range of CUVs.
Octavia’s were all over Iceland as well, mainly the TDI 4Motion versions. Almost as common (and apparently capable) as Subaru Outback’s here in Colorado. And far more common than Subaru’s in Iceland although there wasn’t any obvious shortage.
Skoda is introducing the Kodiaq currently which is a stretched 7-seat version of the new VW Tiguan (not released in North America yet) which would cover the meat of the CUV market, at least conceptually speaking.
Assuming they’d have to rename that here; I’m sure Chevy still has a trademark on Kodiak even if that truck is no longer in production and I don’t think one changed letter would be sufficient to differentiate it.
Skodas are quite popular here I’m not in the market for one but have heard good things about the new Superb.
Having owned a 2009 model Octavia I would say yes…..and no. Lease one or trade in after three years but do not buy into a VAG product long term, especially the diesel models.
Earlier Skodas were solid if dull cars, like a cut price Volvo, newer models share many of the issues VWs have. EGR systems are especially problematic and expensive to fix.
Nonetheless here in the UK, Skodas consistently outperform VW in reliability ratings and are very popular. The best of them is the ‘Superb’ station wagon, enormous load capacity, lots of toys and good value. Just avoid the diesels and trade in early.
I love the way the Yeti looks, but I have a feeling the next-generation model will look more conservative. Have all of y’all noticed how closely aligned the Volkswagen, SEAT, Audi and Skoda brands are now in design language? Don’t get me wrong, I love the crisp lines and angles, but cars from each of these brands look more alike than ever. It’s a puzzling decision by VAG.
For myself, when the time comes I would happily replace my Jetta Tdi wagon with a Superb diesel wagon, as, for me, the Jetta’s only drawback is not quite enough cargo space, and the superb has it in spades. I would VERY happily replace our Versa hatchback with a Citigo four door.
From VW’s perspective, it might make more sense to offer Skodas that do not compete directly with VW’s current North American offerings: Citigo (they’d need to develop an autobox for it) Fabia hatch, Rapid sedan, Yeti. I suspect the Kodiaq would compete too directly with the new SUV due out of Chattanooga any day now (sic). The Superb could be re-badged as a VW, and replace the Passat. It would be unique in its class in having a hatchback.
There has been significant discussion on VW Vortex on FB about Skoda nameplates being registered here.
The things I question about the proposal:
-how could a Czech built Skoda be lower cost than a Mexican built VW?
-VW sales in the US are weak because VW does not have a broad slate of CUVs. Neither does Skoda. The Kodiaq Jim mentions is a stretched 7 seat version of the new European Tiguan. The new US version of the Tiguan is that very same stretched 7 seat version.
-VW has some brand equity in the US. Skoda has none, so Skoda would have to do the same thing Hyundai did to establish themselves: offer really really low prices. See point one about Czech production costs vs Mexican.
-Skoda products are constrained by the need to use VW platforms, so a Skoda plays Chevy Malibu to a Pontiac G6/Chevy Cobalt to Pontiac G5/Chevy Aveo to Pontiac G3. GM finally figured out how redundant Pontiac, and Saturn, were and used the opportunity provided by the bankruptcy to kill the redundant divisions. Why in the world would VW want to go in the opposite direction and offer newly established redundant divisions with redundant products?
-If VAG did manage to sell some Skodas here, they would, more than anything else, cannibalize VW sales because everyone would know they are “actually a VW”
The bottom line is, by introducing Skoda in the US, VW would spend vast sums of money establishing the brand, to no net gain in sales or profits. imho, VW would better serve itself using that money to develop products the US market wants and improving it’s sometimes sketchy reputation for reliability and customer service.
I understand and don’t disagree with your points per se but as an example Hyundai and Kia are very similar products too under the skin yet both seem to be doing well these days. Kia was established when Hyundai still had a bad rep (and Kia first had a bad rep too but not due to being associated with Hyundai) and now both have overcome that. I’ll bet most owners of either brand have no clue of the relationship between the two.
GMC and Chevrolet trucks/SUV’s are even more similar than H/K or VW/Skoda. I believe that Chevy/Pontiac ended up just too similar, i.e. there was almost zero differentiation towards the end. Pontiac, the perfomance brand, had less of a performance portfolio than Chevy did/does, so had no real reason to exist.
I’ve seen mention of perhaps Audi dealers offering Skoda as a lower-cost alternative. Yes that is exactly what VW is, however the VW name is quite tarnished not just due to TDI, but also the reliability thing as well as the dealer issues. WE all know that Skoda/VW/Audi is all the same thing in the broader sense but the general public has no clue. See the fact that Audi and Porsche get rave reviews and its products are considered to be reliable and of quality when in reality many/most of its systems are shared with VW itself.
I believe some people just will not buy a VW for whatever real or imagined reason. However they might just buy an alternative that is similar but badged differently. Ego is a big thing. People will pay vastly more for a Porsche Cayenne compared to a VW Touareg, even when both use the same VW 3.6liter V6 and/or the same 3.0liter V6 TDI. Same with the Audi Q7 in regard to the TDI. They have no clue that it’s a VW engine and that many/most parts are stamped VAG. There really is no quantifiable or perceivable quality difference between Cayenne/Touareg/Q7. In this case (with Skoda) they’d potentially be paying less, however with options and packages being what they are, could easily be walking out the door paying more.
Lastly, and perhaps most importantly (and I don’t mean this as snark) VW does have a penchant for not always doing what seems to be obvious or in its best interest which I think is what is giving this idea wings. VW’s American leadership has been (for whatever reasons) tone deaf for so long that perhaps Skoda does have a chance. Keep in mind there is VAG (the mothership) and VWoA. VWoA seems to have less influence inside VAG than Audi of America and Porsche of America does. Perhaps Skoda of America could follow in those footsteps and succeed. I don’t believe that anyone thinks that VWoA has been a successful venture in the US in many years, if not decades. And the last year has made it even worse.
Hyundai and Kia are very similar products too under the skin yet both seem to be doing well these days.
True, now. 15 years ago, the two lines were very different, Hyundai being Mitsubishi based and Kia being Mazda based. The two brands started in the US at about the same time. Both used the same low ball price approach. From what I gather, they never would have been under the same roof without Kia’s collapse and the South Korean government arranging a shotgun marriage. Having been forced to marry, it would probably be prohibitively expensive for Hyundai to shut the Kia division, so Hyundai carries on, probably well aware that supporting two brands selling the same products to the same clientele is costing them a fortune, but the alternative is worse.
VW has already put itself in the same situation by spreading Skoda and SEAT around Europe. Why double down by making the same mistake here?
I believe that Chevy/Pontiac ended up just too similar, i.e. there was almost zero differentiation towards the end.
Same with Dodge and Plymouth. Same thing with Chrysler and DeSoto. Same thing with Ford and Mercury. Differentiation costs money. VW’s profit margin is already razor thin. Competing in the same space with other VAG divisions only adds more pressure to reduce costs, and an easy way to reduce costs is to reduce differentiation.
I’ve seen mention of perhaps Audi dealers offering Skoda as a lower-cost alternative.
Several of the VW dealers in my area carry Audi and Porsche as well. Adding Skoda, even if it’s across the driveway in the Audi showroom, will only put the hurt on the VW showroom, probably with little or no added sales because the person that walks into the Audi showroom and cringes at the price, will look at a Skoda, instead of walking across the driveway to look at a VW.
VW does have a penchant for not always doing what seems to be obvious or in its best interest which I think is what is giving this idea wings.
All the redundant and halo brands seem to have been accumulated when Piech was running the show. The entire mess smacks of empire building, like after having some success with Chrysler, Iacocca went nuts buying Gulfstream and Lamborgini. Imagine if Chrysler had kept the AMC brand alive, and kept Plymouth alive, all selling rebadged Dodges down the block from the Dodge dealer, That is what VAG is doing with Skoda and SEAT.
The only reason I can think of that VW would be considering this move is they handed another big check to McKinsey, and, forced to come up with a recommendation, McKinsey said “the VW brand is damaged in the US by the diesel scandal. Introduce a new brand and go for a reboot”. The truth is painfully obvious. The mob cares not one whit about the diesel scandal. The Tiguan, as funky looking as it is, is showing a large sales increase this year, ( as of the end of June up 50% year to date), as it is the closest thing to a reasonable CUV the company offers. Jetta and Passat sales are soft because small sedan sales are soft everywhere. Chrysler is abandoning the C and D segments entirely and Buick Verano production ends this fall.
VW’s American leadership has been (for whatever reasons) tone deaf
VWoA management has not been in place long enough to know where the washroom is. Johnathon Browning came on board from Vauxhall in October 10 and was sacked in December 13. Browning was followed by Michael Horn, who was sacked last March. Horn was to be replaced by Winfried Vahland, but he quit before taking the position. So now they have former BMW executive Hinrich Woebcken running the show. With this much turmoil, it’s impossible to create and work a cohesive plan, which would add credibility to my suspicion VW figured it would solve the problem by writing a check to McKinsey.
You raise an interesting point about Hyundai and Kia. Is one supposed to be upmarket of the other, or is Kia just a more stylish alternative of equal status? I’m still scratching my head over this one. Around here you see more small Hyundais and larger Kias.
Is one supposed to be upmarket of the other,
Skimming over the info in CR, it seems like maybe the Hyundais are slightly more expensive, like maybe $1-$2,000, which isn’t that much on a $30,000 car. To my eye, Hyundais look richer and CR complains about their more broughamish handling.
There are slight differences in the Kia and Hyundai lineups. Kia is the only one with the Soul and a minivan. I recall Hyundai having a version of the minivan, but it wasn’t around more than a couple years. The Forte is offered in sedan, coupe and 5 door hatchback bodystyles, while the Elantra is offered as a 4 door sedan and the more pretentious Elantra GT 5 door. Hyundai also has the Veloster and Genesis sport coupes, which have no counterpart in the Kia line. Hyundai has 3 SUVs vs Kia’s 2.
My takeaway would be that Kia, with it’s minivan, cubemobile, hatchback Forte, plainer styling and slightly lower prices is the more lower end family oriented brand, while Hyundai, with it’s higher prices, richer styling and overtly sporty models is the more aspirational of the two.
Rather than Kia being the “plainer” brand I get the impression that Hyundai has a more “luxury” feel and Kia has a more “sporty” feel, while staying in the value priced bracket. Hyundai is spread a little thin right now, with models running from the value-leader Accent all the way up to the full-on luxury Equus. Hence they are spinning off the Genesis and Equus as new models in a separate Genesis brand, and the lineup will top out with the Azera. No idea whether that means the Kia K900 will disappear or not–I’d wager yes. But if you look at their bread-and-butter models, Forte versus Elantra, Sportage versus Tucson, and perhaps most tellingly Optima versus Sonata, the Kias seem to have more aggressive styling and sharper dynamics, whereas the Hyundais have more flowing lines, softer suspensions, and more luxury touches. Also note that the Forte still offers a 2-door coupe whereas the Elantra coupe sunk without a trace after selling poorly during its short life. The Soul, with its funky character, fits much better in the Kia lineup. The presence of the Veloster and Genesis Coupe (to be renamed) under the Hyundai roof is a little confusing, but there have been heavy hints of an upcoming sports coupe from Kia as well.
Some years ago on a trip to Canada I stopped at a Skoda dealer there. This photo is what I still think of when I think “Skoda.” (I still have the brochures laying around somewhere.)
That looks like a descendent of the Škoda 1000 MB:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Škoda_1000_MB
I’m guessing that the MB stood for Mladá Boleslav, where the car was made. Some years ago a Czech coworker told me that in Czech, the words for “little pains” begin with M and B, so the joke in Czechoslovakia was “1000 little pains.”
Many years ago, a work colleague bought one of these. Cheap new car, with warranty, and all that. She revised her opinion when a back wheel came off and overtook her on the freeway…
Crossovers aren’t my thing, and I have reservations about the reliability of VAG products. (Ironic, in view of how reliable the bug was, but that’s another discussion.)
To tackle the larger question: If two cars of different makes were the same car under the skin, I wouldn’t pay a premium for the badge on the more expensive one. I’m a confirmed non-snob.
It’s part of the VW Group so that’s a non-starter.
Plus it’s yet another Stupid Useless Vehicle- strike two.
No way because it is nothing more than a rebadged VW. If it were truly a Skoda, I would think about it and then head over to the Peugeot dealer if they ever come back stateside.
I think VW would be wise to kill the VW brand in USA, and instead start using the Skoda or Seat badge. Dieselgate rightly killed the brand. Yeti could be USA’s first look at the new brand.
Valu-Jet became Air-Tran, Phillip Morris became Altria. When a band develops negative equity, its time to bin it!
A friend had a Yeti and loved it. Unfortunately it was in a collision, and the insurance assessor wasn’t familiar with Skodas. Borderline repairable but they went ahead with the work. Unfortunately the assessor hadn’t noticed the cracked block.
He’s still with Skoda; now drives a Rapid Monte Carlo.
Funny thing about Skodas they’ve been on the Kiwi market in various forms since the the late 40s at least the old Octavia sold here then the backbone frame and powertrains were imported and the light utility Trekka assembled onto them, meanwhile the MB was the latest offering that evolved into an 1100 model in the 70s the cheapest car on the market along with the 125 Fiat style Lada. They were still selling something in small numbers into the 80s AFAIK before the VW takeover now we get the full lineup, we have a local dealership, I must go have another look, The Roomster has become vehicle of choice for an elderly companion driving franchise so they are a quite common sight everywhere.
I recall an article I read several months or a year ago, that said VW wants to move upmarket in the US and the dealers object because they like the volume they get from the hypercheap Mk VI Jetta.
When the Mk VI Jetta came out in 2011, it was a major step backward from the Mk V: beam axle, drum brakes, cheap hard plastic interior and a very rudimentary instrument cluster, as well as the base S trim being laffably underpowered with the 8 valve 2L 4 from the 1990s. But it was cheap, lower priced than a base Golf, and they sold a ton of them.
It’s possible that what VAG would call a Skoda Octavia here would not be the current, well finished, MQB based Czech model, but a reskin of the cheap and nasty Mk VI Jetta, built exclusively in Puebla using the existing Mk VI tooling and sold in VW showrooms as a fallback for anyone who faints at the prices of the new upmarket VWs. Add the Czech built Roomster, which has no counterpart in the VW line, and VW dealers have cheap and funky models to sell, next to the nicely designed and well trimmed VWs.
Problem with that scheme is, while people thought $15K was a bargain for a Jetta in 2011, with it’s “upscale” image, would they be willing to pay the same price for an unknown brand? If it’s sold as “really a VW” then that fights VW’s attempt to move the brand upmarket. If it is sold as “not a retrimmed VW”, it will have zero brand recognition and will need to fight for share the same way Hyundai and Kia did 20 years ago, with really cheap prices. Either way, it will cost VW a bundle to establish the brand and it will cannibalize VW sales.
VW has ruined its own sales by not producing what people want (i.e. lots of CUV’s at competitive prices) and a reputation of poor service experiences at VW’s dealerships. The only things they had that were somewhat popular were TDI’s which are a non-starter going forward (too much negative baggage even if they are now properly engineered), the Golf (formerly Jetta) Wagon and the GTI. Sales totals of those models are low. Even the Tiguan which has seen a large percentage improvement in sales is not any kind of real success if actual units moved are looked at compared to the segment leaders.
A full reboot of perhaps removing VW entirely and starting over with Skoda could potentially work. VWoA has made misstep after misstep since the 80’s over here, which has nothing to do with the multiple managers in the last couple of years. VW by and large does not have positive brand equity, Skoda would start with zero which is better than negative. I don’t see it as worse than sticking with VW and VAG can afford to throw money at it. If you aren’t achieving your goals currently and there is little possibility of achieving them going forward, what is the point of continuing with the present course?
VAG sells three volume brands here – VW, Audi, and Porsche. VW is the only one that has a generally negative public reputation. Audi overcame theirs although I’m not personally convinced it’s warranted. Since they all report to the same masters at VAG corporate, the problem has to lay with the local leadership, VWoA. I would imagine that Skoda would install its own leadership and not just change the current management’s business card logos. There is really no other explanation for VW’s service experiences for example generally being considered poor and Audi and Porsche’s being considered good when they are often performed in the same building by the same dealership and often affect the same parts, components, and systems.
I say all this as a fan and purchaser of VW’s, more than one of them new and several used along with several Audi’s and a Porsche (so yeah, I’ve had plenty of the Kool-Aid). I had a ’95 Jetta (new) which turned into a disappointment and a 2012 Touareg TDI (new) which was a good vehicle while we had it although we did not keep it long along with almost a dozen others. In hindsight, while the Touareg was impeccably trimmed and a great driving SUV, it didn’t really do that many things any better in our normal day to day usage than our current Highlander does although it cost significantly more to purchase. My own wife who has had several VW’s herself and isn’t nearly as involved with or interested in cars as I am and would generally be considered “the public” as far as knowledge of VW’s scandal and tech issues are concerned, now generally says no to considering VW.
So I say bring on the Skoda’s.
VW has ruined its own sales by not producing what people want (i.e. lots of CUV’s at competitive prices) and a reputation of poor service experiences at VW’s dealerships.
Yes. VW tries to sell it’s European line here. While the US market has been moving to SUVs for years, the C segment sedans and hatches VW wants to sell are increasingly a niche market. The TDIs were also a niche market where VW had success by virtue of having no competition in that niche. With fuel prices where they are now, and Marchionne betting his company they will stay there, VW would not be selling very many TDIs now, even if they were legal and the scandal had never happened.
While the US fetish for gigantism dictates the dimensions of the products, the Japanese are writing the book on reliability. I have been interested in VWs since the days of the Dasher, I was not sufficiently comfortable with their level of reliability until the (later,debugged) Mk V Jetta and Mk V and VI Golf. Finally pulled the trigger on a 2014 wagon. A couple of minor gremlins have shown up in 2 1/2 years, both handled efficiently by two different dealers. Both dealers carry all three VAG brands. I have not tried a stand alone VW store. There is a stand alone VW store nearer to my home than the ones I use, but something about it gives me the creeps.
Hyundai and Kia both overcame their dreadful early reputations, so it is possible. We old geezers remember the horror show that the Audi 100LS. Fox and 5000 put on, but now CR is showing virtually everything Audi makes as better than average. Go to a VW car show and you will see plenty of enthusiasm for the brand. The company needs to make reliability an eternal obsession, not a “quality is job 1” ad campaign for a few years.
A while back, I heard from the rumor mill that VAG routinely selects the best quality parts for Audi, the second best quality parts for Skoda, because the brand is not well established in many markets, and the third rate stuff goes to VW because management thinks the VW brand is so strong it can overcome third rate parts and substandard reliability. Again, that was watercooler talk, but other watercooler talk has it that the Octavia is known for bulletproof reliability. The assertion that the VW brand is strong enough to overcome abusing customers with substandard reliability is consistent with the sort of hubris that has management pouring money into halo models like the Phaeton, and vanity brands like Bugatti, Lamborgini and Ducati, instead of taking care of their core products. I think it was Peter Lynch who described managements who diversify away from their core competency as diworseification. That level of hubris is also the sort of mind set that makes management think going out of their way to cheat emissions standards is a really good idea.
I had a ’95 Jetta (new) which turned into a disappointment
The Piech era seems to coincide with the very worse VWs: timing belts that break before the scheduled service interval, water pumps with plastic impellers that crumble, windows that come out of the regulator and fall into the bottom of the door, failing coil packs, oil leaks. Most of the diworseification into halo brands also seems to have occurred during the Piech era, while the development of the vastly improved Mk V Golf/Jetta coincide with Piech stepping aside as Chairman for former VW head of quality Bernd Pischetsrieder in 02.
So I say bring on the Skoda’s.
I’ll stay with clean up and rehab VW, but I have yet to see any corporate management follow my recommendation.
Its interesting to read your comments about the brand made in my country. Since early 90s when VW stepped in the brand made a extreme progress. It established itself in entire Europe as good quality product for fair price, which increase step by step and are not such a bargain anymore. In my opinion, its accepted on the market as upper level to i.e. French or Italian brands already.
The gap between Skoda and VW is mainly in the high tech technologies that VW keeps for itself. But avarage buyer can get everything they really needs even with Skoda.
You can spend +50k $ for top loaded Superb on European market with 2.0 turbo 280ps. Quick check shows Toyota Camry with more powerful v6 sells for 31k$ top and is us segment leader. For how much it would be competitive to offer it in us market, 25k $ ???
Soon a colleague will take delivery of a new Skoda Superb Combi (wagon), although I don’t know the specs.
Its main advantage is this, and the reason he chose it: you get a car with the size of an E-segment car (I’ve read that the Superb Combi is as big inside as a Benz E-Class wagon) for the price of a D-segment car.
When my V70 passes the point of no return, it’ll be replaced by another V70 – or a Superb Combi. Nothing else would do the job.
They already sell SEAT cars in Mexico, so it wouldn’t it be hard VW to build Skodas SEATs in their Mexican plants from kits.
The SEAT and Skoda might be below than Volkswagen in terms of the VAG pecking order, but isn’t that how Daihatsu and the defunct Scion brand were to Toyota or the defunct Saturn and Geo brand were to Chevrolet? Yet in terms of GM pecking order, Chevrolet and GMC Truck were probably below Opel and yet defunct Pontiac might be above Opel, Vauxhall and Holden? Just wondering. In addition, Toyota’s affiliated relationship with Subaru might be similar to Volkswagen and Porsche as well.
Would I be interested in a Yeti? Nope. I won’t consider anything produced by a VW-affiliated brand until their reputation for making unreliable, flaky junk improves considerably. I like the Yeti as a vehicle but I couldn’t trust it, and I’m not going to walk into a showroom and pay new-vehicle dollars for anything that I don’t trust.
If I were leasing, it would be different. I’d absolutely consider leasing a Yeti (or a Superb or Octavia if we were to have them). As long as the numbers made sense for me to walk away at lease end. I’d also consider leasing a Golf, Passat, or GTI. If I was leasing. But leasing just isn’t for me (I drive a nearly 20 year old Ford, obviously not the type to want a new car every 3 years) and the idea of an out-of-warranty VAG product would keep me up at night. It’s a shame as some of their products are quite appealing.
VWoA sales are out today. So how are they doing?
Jetta sedan -0.2% Only models in this size up signifcantly are Corolla and Civic. Sentra flat. Dart, Cruze and Focus down a lot.
Golf down 34% but GTI up 35%. VW sold nearly twice as many GTIs as garden variety Golfs last month.
Passat down 5%. Malibu down 26%, Fusion down 4%, Chrysler 200 continues it’s death spiral down 40%
Beetles continued their downtrend that has been in place since 2014: -33%
Tiguan continuing it’s trend up 40%
The general buying pubic cares not one whit about the diesel scandal. VW models are doing as well as the average of their competition. The VW brand is not destroyed in the US. Introducing Skoda will only cost the company money and confuse customers.
Today, the head of the Skoda division confirmed a decision about introducing the brand in the US will be made in 2017.
“Speaking to German newspaper Handelsblatt, Maier said, “During the next year, we want to have the question of North America decided for us. When we talk about our plans until 2025, then you cannot leave out one of the most important car markets in the world,” he added.”
http://www.vwvortex.com/news/skoda-news/skodas-decision-to-enter-us-market-could-come-by-2017/