Today’s “Cars of a Lifetime” post will be brief because there isn’t much I can tell you about a Jeep Cherokee (XJ) or a Dodge minivan that you don’t already know. There are millions of them, literally. Jeep made about three million XJs between 1984 and 2001, while Chrysler has sold five times that number of minivans since November of 1983, counting all generations of Chrysler, Dodge, and Plymouth people carriers.
My ’92 Jeep Cherokee Sport model had these “pizza” style wheels.
First, the Jeep. In 1992 I replaced my Toyota Tercel 4WD wagon with a new Jeep Cherokee which had a 4.0L straight-six and a 5-speed manual transmission. What can I say about it other than that it was nearly indestructible? I drove it for 130,000 miles, then my middle daughter drove it for a while, then I sold it to my brother-in-law. He added another 100K and would probably still be driving it if he hadn’t hit a deer.
Our Grand Caravan was the same color as this Chrysler. (Photo: MotorTrend)
Second, the minivan. In 1996 my wife’s Isuzu Trooper was eight years old and due for replacement. Our three daughters were around middle school age and didn’t like to sit too close together on long trips, so I thought it was time to buy a minivan.
I didn’t give serious consideration to the GM “dustbuster” minivans; however Ford had a 4-wheel-drive Aerostar that looked interesting. What convinced me to buy a Chrysler product instead was the availability of a second sliding door for passengers, a feature that was new for the 1996 model year. And once I bought a set of Blizzak snow tires on winter wheels, our front-wheel-drive minivan was almost as good in snow as a 4WD Aerostar.
We called our dark green Dodge Grand Caravan the “Queen Mary” because it seemed to us to be as large as an ocean liner. I hung in our garage a fluorescent-yellow tennis ball on a string so we’d be able to park the van precisely and close the garage door with an inch to spare.
“You won’t have to out-wrestle an Easy Out Roller Seat.” – Oh yes, you will.
The van had individual seats up front, a bench seat for two in the middle, and another bench seat for three in the back. The 2nd and 3rd rows were removable – this was before Chrysler invented “stow and go” seats that fold into the floor. I was younger and stronger then; I wouldn’t want to lift one of those “Easy Out” roller seats now. Once the seats were taken out and rolled across the garage floor on their little wheels, what was left was an absolutely huge space in which to move whatever you liked.
The Grand Caravan was my wife’s car, and I made a mistake when I ordered it. We’d never had a car with power windows, and I didn’t see the point of them in a vehicle that had only two windows that rolled down. I failed to consider the van’s great width, which meant that my wife had to unbuckle her seat belt and go for a long walk inside the van if she wanted to crank up or down the passenger-side window. After almost three decades I’d hoped this miscalculation had been forgotten, but when I mentioned to one of my daughters the other day that I’d be writing about the Queen Mary, she said, “Remember how mad Mom was about the windows?”
In preparing this post, I’ve been reviewing the sales brochures extolling all the virtues of the 1996 Grand Caravan and its engineering, and ours was indeed virtuous in many respects. However I need to tell you about certain weaknesses that the literature did not mention.
Firstly, the headlights were woefully inadequate. They did not light up the road well enough for me to feel safe going faster than the speed limit on the highway at night. (At least I never got any speeding tickets while driving the van.) I think I installed extra-bright replacement lamps to find a little more candlepower.
The undersized disc brakes were inadequate, too. They stopped the van well enough, but I went through pads and rotors too quickly. The Ultradrive 4-speed automatic transmission required costly repairs at least once. The 3.3L V-6 engine required an expensive computer replacement, also out of warranty. I don’t believe that the other engine options Dodge offered were much more reliable.
The Grand Caravan had a Dodge cross-hair grille unlike this Chrysler Voyager.
I will say that my family and I went on some long road trips in our Grand Caravan, and we did travel in comfort. I should have sold the van sooner – we kept it for ten years – however I told myself again and again, “We’ve just fixed this or that; what else can go wrong?” and then within a year I’d learn the answer to that question.
I haven’t bought another minivan since, but I do think minivans are underestimated as practical solutions for many (or most?) transportation needs.
Related CC reading:
Both a friend of mine, and my sister had these, both ’96s and I can confirm they eat front brakes like popcorn. Good rigs though…
Brother, sister in law had the “Plymouth Voyager”, cousin. About the same color. inside was gray. Drove so, smooth/quiet. Sat ya up a bit so view was nice.
Fit into the garage; remember backing slowly as I wasn’t used to so much vehicle ‘back there”. lol
Big windshield could lead to ‘heat, buildup” during summer. No surprises, really.
Thinking theirs was a “98”, maybe “99”.
Minivans were (and still are) the sensible shoes of personal, civilian transportation, and it’s a shame they, long ago, got the ‘soccer mom’ stigma that made them so uncool and unhip to be seen driving around and with auto marketing virtually handed the market over to the now omnipresent ‘sporty’ (but much less practical) CUV/SUV. I once read that spotting a relatively young guy driving a minivan by himself pretty much said they had given up on life. To me, it just tells me the guy simply wanted the most practical transportation available. It’s possible to get a lot of cargo into the back of a minivan with the rear seats removed and, unlike a pickup truck bed, keep it out of the weather, too. Iacocca made some mistakes, but his championing of the minivan at Chrysler was game-changing brilliance, rivaling that of the inception of the original Mustang.
I recently read a review of the new Lucid Gravity that derided it as a minivan. Personally, I don’t think Lucid went far enough in that direction. The Gravity has startling EV performance but lacks the minivan’s legacy features, such as a front seat pass-thru to the rear, sliding doors, and removable rear seats (although it does retain the ‘magic’ fold-into-the-floor rear seat, pioneered by Honda on their 1999 Odyssey).
But what’s even more noteworthy of the Gravity as a minivan is the footprint. It’s way closer to the short wheelbase (SWB) of the original Chrysler T-115. All of the current, true minivans, besides lacking some of those original features (save the sliding doors), is the size to what can better be described as ‘midi-vans’. The demographic for the original, smaller SWB has moved entirely to CUVs, with the transition most acute when Chrysler (Daimler) introduced their new for 2008 minivan in only the larger size, with the idea someone wanting a smaller minivan would, instead, buy the new Dodge Journey CUV.
I agree with you that minivans are underestimated as practical solutions for many folks.
We have two minivans now (a 2010 Odyssey and a 2017 Sedona)… amazingly practical and cost-efficient. In fact, having owned minivans as our main daily drivers for years, the hardest part is trying to figure out what their replacement(s) will be. Both have over 100,000 mi. now, so eventually we’ll have to give that some consideration.
I heard so many horror stories of Chrysler van reliability that I was a bit worried when my company Pontiac Bonneville was replaced by a Dodge Caravan.
I must of got one of the good ones. That darn thing took me on sales calls throughout the western US accumulating over 1/4 million miles with no problems beyond routine maintenance. No transmission issues – ever. No electrical gremlins. The 3.8 engine gave plenty of power and never used oil. Mine was an All Wheel Drive version. While it was not suitable for off roading due to the low clearance, it was really good on unpaved roads or in snow.
I asked to keep the van beyond the normal company trade-in mileage. I had liked the Bonneville, but even in the base version, the van seats seemed more comfortable on long hauls than the Bonneville had been. I seriously thought about buying it when I was finally directed to turn it in. Probably just as well that I didn’t. Keeping it beyond 1/4 million miles might have spoiled my good memories of that van.
The Dodge was eventually replaced by a Chevy SS – which was a great car though quite expensive to run. It in turn was replaced by another Chrysler van, this one a Pacifica. I remember the Dodge as being more comfortable than the Pacifica, but then I’m a lot older now so there is that.
I’m well beyond my planned retirement having been asked to come back due to my original replacement unexpectedly quitting. Regardless of what the new replacement does, the Pacifica will be my last company van. I don’t want to keep working until I’m dead and I sure don’t need a van as a personal vehicle.
Based on my experience, I consider these Chrysler vans as one of the most versatile transportation values one can buy. If your personal experience with the Chrysler quality lottery was less favorable, you’d probably feel otherwise.
Our “White Whale”, an 87 Grand Caravan, served us well with only a few problems for 14 years. The few problems included V6 cylinder heads rebuild for leaky valve guides, fixed under warrantee fortunately, and a rear side window that flew nearly off while on vacation due to a plastic hinge with a renegade wrist pin (fast reacting son #1 was able to grab it and hold the window closed till we came upon a helpful dealer in Watkins Glen NY). It had the towing package which fortunately had the older three speed tranny and avoided the issue with the new four-speed transmission’s plastic orifice. Hauling a full load of scouts and gear was handled with ease. Loved the comfort and view from the captain’s chairs. Great on cross country trips.
I can agree with the article’s subtitle.
Although many people these days (and perhaps the salespeople at dealers of the makes who sell them as well) think that minivans are uncool compared to today’s SUVs, they are in reality the best tool for the job for anyone who has more than 2 kids (noticing families of 6 who own/lease 3 row SUVs makes me think how much happier they would’ve been if they bought minivans instead like other people they know such as parents, friends, coworkers etc wanted them to do).
I also agree with your article. And I agree with the other in saying that if buyers “think” that the SUV/CUV’s are more cool than vans, they are dead wrong. In fact, for me, it’s gotten so bad with the SUV’s that I look at them and see more soccer mom/dad mobiles than I do when looking at vans.
In 2001, I got my first SUV which was the Jeep Cherokee Limited. This was before driving an SUV was the in thing. I loved the looks of it, but it was thirsty and the ride wasn’t close to what I was used to in a nice sedan. So less than a year old, I sold it to a lady friend who had one with well over 200K and she would only buy another Cherokee. She gave the old one to her nephew and purchased mine. After I moved across the country, we lost touch. But the last time I knew, she was over 300K on that one.
Also, in 2004 I began selling at a Chrysler dealership. So my parents decided to trade their Buick in and lease a 2005 Dodge GC SXT. They loved that van. Great in nearly any angle you look at them.
I’m sure I’ve posted about this before but I’m still mildly surprised and definitely impressed by the subgroup of minivan owners who do not fit the usual family demographic. These people tend to be middle-aged and older. The group consists of empty-nesters, older DINKS, and older single people. I imagine that in years past they probably would have bought station wagons. For some reason they prefer minivans to SUVs. They tend to buy well-equipped higher-end minivans. These are generally well-to-do people who could afford pretty much anything, but who are not really concerned with displaying their status.
These are practical people with interests and hobbies and they use their minivans to haul things. They have horses and dogs. They carry bales of hay and saddles in the back. They carry dog kennels. These people garage sale and antique and haul furniture in the back. They garden and carry plants and bags of fertilizer and peat moss in the back. Then they might use the minivan to carpool to church or bridge club.
One thing that I’ll disagree with here is your opening contention that there’s not much you could tell us about your COAL vehicles that we didn’t already know…and here I’ll focus on the Caravan.
I had no idea that it was possible to purchase this generation Chrysler minivan with manual windows! A totally odd and unexpected fact.
I had a 2001 version of your van, purchased new. It was an actual Chrysler (vs. Dodge) and it was one of the AWD models. It was my wife’s vehicle, and AWD was demanded. It was also (because it was the highest end Mopar minivan made at that time) quite tarted up with full leather upholstery, a high end sound system, etc. etc.. I will say that it was a pretty competent vehicle that given its role for hauling around 2 little kids and 2 dogs it was completely and thoroughly used up when we finally traded it after about 6 years. It was far from the highest mileage vehicle that’s passed through the household, and all of its main mechanical systems still basically functioned, but the interior had turned into a rolling bio hazard with a gazillion pieces of loose plastic rolling around. Interior build quality wasn’t stellar (and frankly, it was abused). Oh, and the electric windows…both passenger side and driver’s…stopped working. I think the dead driver’s side window may have been the impetus for our getting rid of it.
Of course you never got a ticket in the Caravan. I suspect that had less to do with your driving behavior than the vehicle itself. During my minivan years, just about everyone I knew had one…including two female co-workers who regularly drove (and still do 🙂 ) like bats out of hell. 85 to 90mph never generated tickets, whereas I could practically walk by a cop in whatever (non-minivan) I was driving and garner a citation. It used to be said that driving a minivan made you invisible to law enforcement. The Cloak of Invisibility. Yet another bit of minivan magic.
Keep the COALs coming. There’s always something to learn from these tales.
Were on our fourth minivan.
1995 oldsmobile silhouette with a 3800 V6. This one had some torque. Teal green dustbuster.
1998 & 2001 chevy misad-venture vans. 3400 intake leakers and first power sliding doors.
2019 Grand Caravan sxt. So far no issues
1999 Grand Cherokee limited 4.0. Rotted undercarriage demise
2009 Grand Cherokee Larado 3.7. Still in use
I did almost twenty years of minivan driving. First a new short wheelbase Dodge Caravan, then a lightly used 97 Town and Country LXI. At first I didn’t want a van, but it won my affection, over time. We kept it over ten years, it needed a transmission rebuild at 160,000 miles and the Mitsubishi V6 was smoking due to worn valve guides or seals. The 3.0 V6 and three speed proved to be very reliable until it hit the high miles. We took many long family road trips and it was great, cruising easily at 75-85 mph. I wanted a fancy rig for our next van, so I found a loaded Town and Country. I chose that one for myself. It took us on a lot of family vacations and I never felt any stigma, and didn’t care what other people thought. Removing the seats to haul cargo was a drag, and you couldn’t pick up an impulse purchase of furniture or large object easily. Stow and Go was a game changer though the seats were not as comfortable as my van’s Capt. chairs. Unfortunately the T&C had a lot of transmission problems that were difficult to sort out once it went past 100,000 miles.
Some time later I bought my first SUV, a used V8 ’97 Explorer. It had a lot less room inside, with only two rows of seating and poorer fuel mileage. But for some reason I loved driving it. I’ve had a big three row SUV, a used Navigator, which I really liked. I never liked having passengers climb around a folded up seat to access the back row.
Now, I prefer SUVs and CUVs to coupes and sedans, just for the space and ease of loading.
We had a Mazda5 for a while, which is sort of a compact minivan. It was surprisingly spacious for something with the footprint of a Ford Focus and the sliding doors and captain’s chairs made it ideal for 2 kids and occasional extra passengers. With all the seats folded you get a lot of cargo too. I still miss that van, it got totaled after 9 months and we ended up in a crossover.
I’ve never owned a Chrysler or Jeep, although I’ve rented a Sebring and hated it, and sort of wanted an XJ or ZJ for years.
Mazda’s forays into the minivan market saddens me. First, they had the 2nd gen MPV which was effectively the same size as the original SWB Chrysler T-115. To me, it was the Goldilocks of minivans in that it was ‘just right’ and one of the sportier handling minivans. Unfortunately, it sold poorly. So…
Mazda replaced them with the smaller, but still quite good, Mazda5, a mini-minivan that could even be had with a manual transmission. It was pretty alright, too, but, just like the MPV, never really caught on. Mazda finally threw in the towel and went full CUV from then on. And, as one might surmise, sales perked up, as well, even though they were less efficiently packaged.
Still a shame that the Mazda, small, sliding side door minivans never found a market. They were really okay.
Lee Iacocca and Chrysler invented the minivan in the 80’s. That initial design was groundbreaking and they sold a ton of em. Still do. Yes, there was the Aerostar, but it was truck based and rear wheel drive. More truck-like than was the Caravan/Voyager. The Chrysler vans have pretty much always reviewed highly and always have best features, advantages, and benefits. Not until Honda and Toyota introduced the Odessey and Sienna was there true competition and they have always touted quality and reliability first, Chrysler usually beats them in features.
We had an ’88 Aerostar 3.0 V6 and it was reliable and simple until I found out that to change spark plugs we had to pull off the front wheels.
Even here at the edge of the world Chrysler minivans were a thing, I saw a few regularly but not for quite a while what ever takes them out got them all.
My 99 T&C was one of my favorite vehicles. I had avoided Chrysler minivans for a long time but found an old, cheap, high-mile one. It was in such fantastic condition and drove so well I bought it. I suspect that the extra 3 years from your 96 to my 99 were good in the development/durability department. Mine had over 200k miles on it when the transmission finally went, then the person I gave it to got the transmission rebuilt and drove it for a number of years after.
I will argue with you on one thing – you had an electronics issue, but the basic Chrysler 3.3 and 3.8 cast iron V6 engines were among the best that Chrysler ever built from a brute durability standpoint, which is saying something. Even over 200k miles, I got out of the habit of checking the oil because the dipstick always read “full”, even right before the next oil change.
I’ve owned 3 minivans over the past decade: a ’96 Aerostar (2012-18), an ’05 Astro (2018-24), and now my 2016 Transit Connect Wagon. As with any vehicle, none of them were perfect but all have their own positive attributes. The Aerostar by far had the best cargo space (especially with the rear seats removed) due to being the extended model but had an iffy transmission that failed along with the water pump at 157k miles. By that point it had also sustained 2 deer collisions and was just about going to need a complete overhaul when I sent it to the junkyard in the sky; the cost to fix everything was going to be way more than what the van was even worth. It’s long gone now, but it’s a miracle that it lasted as long as it did under my ownership considering its questionable service life before that point.
The Astro could tow more with its more durable powertrain–in addition to being pre-wired with a 7-way connector & trailer brake controller–but also wasn’t quite as good on fuel economy; cargo space was a little less as well due to the shorter wheelbase (111″ vs. 119″ for the Aerostar) although still very generous when the 3rd-row seat was unnecessary. It also had more mechanical problems than the Aerostar due to having over 250k miles. I felt it was time to let it go when the ECM & anti-theft system failed at 286k and left me stranded on the road at 2:00 in the morning. Its service life was also questionable–BOTH vans were ex-rental units–and I didn’t want to take anymore chances with it. Someone else managed to fix it up though and as of this past June it’s still on the highway.
I’ve been lucky with the Transit Connect so far at only 94k miles. The only major problem it has had as of now was with the Hill Start Assist system, but one trip to Cromley’s in Saluda, SC took care of it. Being the “shorter” 5-seat model instead of the more common “long” 6-or-7-seat version, the wheelbase is even shorter than the Astro’s (at 104.8″; LWB is about the same as the Aerostar), but there’s still a generous amount of room for being based on the Focus platform. I also realized the 3rd-row seat in my previous 2 vans was left unused up to 99% of the time when I had it and therefore felt I could part with it altogether for the foreseeable future. In addition, the rear seat(s) in the 5-seater can still be removed just like in the older vans, but NOT in the longer van unless you use tools. And the rear seat folded down in mine still gives me about the same room the Astro had with the 3rd-row seat removed. PLUS, the front passenger seat folds down too! Fuel economy is way better than either of the other 2 vans and I can still tow my Wells Cargo trailer with it; I never needed more than a 2000-lb. capacity all that often anyway. I feel this generation of the TC embodies the spirit of the original Chrysler minivans the best and was probably the van I needed all along. But you also learn what you ACTUALLY NEED and can do without over time when you own different versions of fundamentally the same vehicle. 🙂
Nice rig there John! Needless to mention that the Ford Transit Connect commercial vans have been commonplace here for years. Below an example I caught several years ago, a 2018 panel van with the 1.5 liter TDCi turbodiesel.
If it has rear seats and windows all around, like yours, it’s called a Ford Tourneo Connect in Europe. But these are rare, folks prefer fancier-yet-far-less-practical crossovers, you know…
The current Transit Connect is fully based on the VW Caddy. On the other hand, the current VW Transporter is fully based on the Ford Transit Custom.
On topic, those Chrysler Voyagers (their name here) were a common sight too. They were often converted into a commercial van, these were usually powered by a four-cylinder VM Motori turbodiesel engine.
I’ve never ridden in the “newer” Chrysler model minivans like here, but I rode in countless Gen 1 models. They had a great ride. Great in snow. Though sometimes the seats were set up totally cramped in the back. And it seemed every single family in my area who had 3 or more kids, had an 80s Chrysler minivan. They really were everywhere.
But 13 year old me was in love with the GM Dustbuster vans before they even hit the dealer lots. I told myself I would get one once they got old and cheap. I ended up with two, a 90 Lumina APV 3.1, and a 92 Trans Sport 3800. At the time I was married and we had a combined 3 kids. Also I had several A bodys and these shared many parts. The 3800 was definitely more powerful and versatile since it towed my camper and enclosed utility trailer. We hauled so much firewood, scrap metal, everything. Many long trips towing the camper. I could pop out the seats and slide a spinet organ into the side door. Speaking of doors, the door handles always broke. Astro van handles were 95% the same and could be made to work, and for some reason they were stronger so I loaded up at the junkyard. The 3.1 was powerful enough on its own, but had absolutely zero reserve power. Peak torque was at 2200 RPM so revving it up just spun the engine with no additional power. But I actually preferred the simplicity of the 3.1 and I miss it. The vans I had rotted worse than any of my A bodys, even while having an identical subframe. I think the plastic body gave a false sense of security “hey it will never rust”. I’ve had opportunities to get another Gen 1 Dustbuster, but where I live now I need my 4WD Jeep XJ in winter, and I’ve got enough summer cars and projects.
One of my friends folks had an Aerostar. He called it the Growler, I believe because it made a lot of noise but had no bite (power). Another guy I knew had a later one, he drove it like he stole it. Riding with him once, he took a corner so hard that the rear seat lifted off its mounts with 120# me in it.
My boss was a huge fan of Astros for a decade or more. He had like 3 or 4 of them. He borrowed my trailer once and got rear ended by a gas tanker semi trucker in a construction zone. Nearly totaled the van and my trailer absorbed the impact while exploding, and probably saved their lives. Took a few months but the trucker’s insurance bought me a new trailer.
Th we first time I ever rode in a dodge grand caravan my wife, daughter and I were in the third row seat. Looking forward at what seemed like a long, narrow view to the front I said to the wife now I know what it feels like to ride in a hot dog bun!
Our old neighbor had one of these, probably early 2000’s. She would complain constantly about all the money they spent on repairs. 3very time they took a trip it cosst several hundred to maybe a couple thousand in repairs. One day she came home with a brand new one. I reminded her of all the trouble with the last one and said I was surprised they bought another. Her comment was are you kidding, these vans are the best vehicle ever made. I wouldn’t own anything else. How short our memory can be!