I’ve been having a bad case of Beetle Fever. I finally broke down and spent a bit of time at BAT (Bring A Trailer) to see what has been sold there recently and to get a sense of the market. I followed two last week, an absolutely pristine like-new ’62 that sold for $30k, and a somewhat modified ’55 small window (I can’t find the listing right now) that also sold for $30k. Nice Beetles, but apart from the price, they just weren’t quite right for me; the ’62 was too nice; I want one that I can drive up gravel forest roads and not worry about dinging it up. The ’55 was a bit too modified with a narrowed and lowered front end, although it had some compelling features.
Then yesterday, this white Beetle popped up: It’s an absolute dead ringer for my ’64 Beetle, also white and with the same slotted wheels on it that I had swapped from a ’66. But the listing called it a 1969 Beetle. That didn’t make sense; this body style with the smaller windows was last built in 1964. Oh wait; it’s from Brazil! And in Brazil they kept making this older body style right to the end in the late ’90s. And…it’s got a 1300 cc engine, which is a favorite of mine, as my brother’s ’66 had one; I called it “The Best Beetle Ever, Or At Least The Sportiest One”. Wow; a combination of my preferred body style with my preferred engine, and the slotted wheels too. This is too good to be true. Literally.
Before we get into the cold facts, let me show you this shot from the rear and why I started getting very excited. Not only does it have the slotted wheels, but the rear ones has been widened just the right amount. And the swing axles have been decambered, just like I did to mine, which really helps keep the rear end more planted, although it is precisely their oversteer that I love them for. No trailing arm double jointed rear axle VW for me! This is the perfect look; a bit sportier but not over the top.
Actually, it was another commenter at BAT that first asked whether Brazilian Beetles had heat and defrost. I had never thought of that. The VW Beetle was the first car in the world with standard heating and defrost, added at the last minute in 1939. American cars were still asking for extra money for heaters well into the ’60s. And no, don’t bring up the old tired trope about all air-cooled VWs not having real heat. I debunked that thoroughly here. If the system is not damaged and it’s operated correctly with the vent window cracked open a bit, it works just fine. Wouldn’t it have been ironic if I bought a Beetle with no heat having written that post, which has now become the #1 search result for “VW Beetle poor heat issues” and such?
The reason the Beetle was the first car in the world to have standard heating is that it was relatively cheap to do so. The hollow body sills made a perfect duct to bring the warm air that had been forced over the engine to cool it. All it needed was a couple of flaps at the rear of the engine ducting and a couple of levers to control it, positioned on both sides of the hand brake (older models had a little wheel that was turned). Bingo! Free heat for the Volk!
Given the Beetle’s exceptional abilities in the snow, it turned it into the ultimate winter car, back when many folks just garaged their rickety cold cars for the season.
So the only thing that VW do Brasil really saved was the control levers and flaps and a couple of outlets on the sills, as the rest was built in inherently. But look at the picture of the interior of this Beetle: no vents on the floor (or at the base of the rear seat) and no control levers.
Here’s a closer look. No outlets on the sills just ahead of the doors. So they saved what…50 centavos per car? Yet these Brazilian Beetles get imported quite regularly to the US and Europe. I suppose one could retrofit it, but that would take a bit of cutting and such.
But what’s really curious is that this particular Brazilian Beetle clearly has the two flexible ducts from the cooling fan housing that feed the heat exchangers for the later “fresh air” heating system. What gives?
So I turned to Google, first asking “Do Brazilian Beetles Have Heat”. I got zero answers; zip; nada. So I started doing image searches for Brazilian Beetles, and all except one did not have any heater outlets on the sills in the front or any visible heater control levers. And Googling for images of Brazilian Beetle engines, many had this unique squared-off fan housing that clearly does not have ducts for heat exchangers. These are mostly a bit later, as this lowered fan housing was created to fit in the back of the Brazilia.
Most of the early ones looked like the “stale air” fan housings which also don’t have ducts for heat exchangers. This is a ’66, and from shots of the inside, it clearly does not have heat.
This one has the intermediate housing like the featured ’69, but no fresh air flexible ducts, although one can see where they would attach, just below the coil on the near side.
I even searched thesamba.com, the ultimate VW forum, but could not find any specific references about the existence (or not) of heat and defrost on Brazilian Beetles. My best guess is that it was probably optional, but very rarely specified and/or built.
So I can’t answer why there are those flexible ducts from the fan on the featured BAT Beetle (above), because the air would seem to go to nowhere. Without shots of the engine underside, it’s impossible to see if there are heat exchangers. And if there were, there’s nowhere for the heated air to go in the cabin.
Here’s my best explanation so far: there were over 3 million Beetles built in Brazil, and many/most of the survivors, especially the ones being exported for sale in the US are clearly not “original”. Brazilians couldn’t exactly afford to pamper their Beetles back in the day, and most lived arduous lives hard at work. The survivors have often been “renovated” with parts and pieces from other ones as well as aftermarket parts. So this engine fan presumably came out of a relatively rare Beetle with heat or maybe it’s an aftermarket unit targeted at the global market, with fresh air ducts?
Who knows, but what I do know is that a): no heat is a deal breaker for me, and b): not seeing this car in person, especially with the lack of photos of its undersides and such is also a deal breaker. And the substantial gap between the front trunk lid and the body is also suspicious.
Well, maybe it’s going to take $30k to get a really good one? Or I take a different tack.
Update: the seller just posted two more pictures. This one clearly shows the lack of a heating system; there are no heat exchangers and/or any ducting that could function as a “stale air” system. That confirms my assumptions.
This shot of the body underside seem to show pretty solid pans, but without more close-ups, it’s hard to judge the actual condition of things down there. Almost all BAT sellers provide very detailed pictures of every aspect of the car. This is not up to the usual pictorial standards. The misaligned front hood is very obvious too. I suppose if the price were right, this might make a doable driver, but not for me.
Related CC reading:
1969 Brazilian Volkswagen Beetle BAT Listing
Why Millions Of People Think Air Cooled VWs Had Terrible Heating – Operator Error by PN
Curbside Classic: 1966 VW 1300 – The Best Beetle Of Them All; Or At Least The Sportiest by PN
Paul – it could be that a previous owner just blocked off the heater outlets. Some people do that so they can run J tubes and avoid the cost of heater boxes or use a larger exhaust. In the picture from under the engine looking forward, it looks like there is a round duct/tube where the heater box would normally hook up to – just above the belly pan, between the red left shock and left transmission mounting horn – this duct would bring the heat inside the car. Should be one on the right as well. As someone who owned a ’66 for a long time, I can say this is where most of the heat would end up, the air coming out the defroster up front was usually cold by the time it got there.
If those ducts under the rear seat are there, it would be easy to swap in a set of heater boxes and control cables. A picture of the area under the rear seat cushion will tell all. Don’t turn down a good deal on a sweet bug over this.
I see those tubes now. Presumably they all had that, just as part of the body build, but the ones without heaters lacked the heat exchangers and control cables. Hmm…
Thank you Paul, I love reading about the strange world of VWs made in different places. I suspect that no Brazilian air cooled VW had heating. The Brazilian T2 didn’t and ones imported to the UK tend to have aftermarket heaters fitted into the front footwell. Of course the heater is different and less effective on the vans with cardboard tubes running under the floor.
I think you are right that over the years this Beetle has acquired tin ware which allows for a heater, probably Brazilian specific parts aren’t as readily available.
With regard to saving money by leaving out the heater I think the issue is probably the heat exchangers. These started being fitted to German Beetles at the end of calendar year 1962 to prevent engine fumes entering the inside of the car. IIRC they have to be TUV approved and tested at roadworthiness inspections (apologies if this isn’t accurate) which would add to the cost more than a few pfennig, especially if the Brazil car used locally sourced parts needing retooling. Also in the early 60s, the German market cars started getting more complicated heaters with rear footwell vents and closing vents. Brazil may have decided that none of that was worth the effort.
Off topic, my all time favourite Brazilian variation I have only ever read about is the vans assembled in South Africa in the late 60s which had the Split screen body from Brazil with the engine, gearbox and rear suspension from the Bay window sent from Germany. I don’t know if they had heaters.
Yes, the heat exchangers were definitely more than a pfennig. But quite likely Brazil didn’t switch over to those even for the Beetles they made with heat. But I don’t really know.
Rode in those late ’60s South African T2s as a child. The Victoria Falls Hotel in Zim had a whole fleet of T2 and the older ones were of that type. We arrrived in our T2 which bay window body T2, so I could compare and contrast.
A family member had a split bus camper in light green over olive in which we later (slowly) ascended Table mountain near Cape Town.
Another bad idea is to get rid of all the Thermostatic flaps to ” make the engine run cooler” Working flaps and stock engine tin will warm up the engine and intake manifold, and was actually engineered for better air flow !
I had to do this as my big valve heads are not drilled for the tube which operates the flaps. Means warm up in winter below freezing takes way longer. Looking to see if there is a way to reinstall them for that reason.
Did Brazil build Beetles for the Andean countries, or did those come from Mexico? Surely, those had heat. It can get chilly in the higher elevations.
As I said, I’m quite sure heaters were on some of them, but not the majority.
Interesting, they probably saved more than 50 centavos by omitting the ducting pieces under the rear seat. So more like 100 centavos.
I too see the round tubes on the underside shots, and the defrost vents are there on the interior shot. The defrost tubes do not show in the frunk shots, and the floor vents don’t show, but could be carpeted over.
Perhaps a question on the BaT page to request a shot under the rear seat cushion would shed some light on this.
At any rate I can assure you that owning ANY vintage beetle requires expense and work, and rewards you with heartache and more expense and work. Don’t pass one up because there’s expense and work involved, think of the heartache you could be missing out on :/
Don’t pass one up because there’s expense and work involved, think of the heartache you could be missing out on :/
Thanks for the reality check; maybe I’ll just take a couple of aspirins and get over this case of Beetle fever.
Yes, I see the tubes up there too now. I suspect they all had them, regardless of whether they had they other parts to make them functional. I suppose it shouldn’t be too hard to put heat in this, but I am more than a bit uncomfortable with buying a car sight unseen. Does the engine have good compression? Is the front end worn out? Transmission noisy? Etc…
Paul – you know you need a Beetle!
Look for one that is bodily non-rusty and accident free – mechanically they are easy to do, as you know and parts availability from J Bugs, Cip1 and other sources is really good and most are pretty cheap.
I’d be a bit suspicious about that hood fit on the white one – Brasilian cars often lead hard lives and Beetles can hide a multitude of sins.
Sump guards for sand rails can be made to fit if you are using a decambered Bug on forest trails, BTW.
I’m sure Oregon has a few decent cars.
There is a Ghia restoration specialist not far from you in Salem, OR – House Of Ghia
https://www.house-of-ghia.com/
They have a good reputation and deal with Bugs too, so I’m sure can help you find what you are looking for. Prolly worth a call….
DougD – it looks like the body is straight with minimal rust – if the engine compression is good, and transmission ok, what else would be expensive or difficult to repair? Seems like an old beetle is about the easiest car to work on and even good quality parts are not that hard to find, but one must be cognizant that a lot of vendors sell cheap chinese replacement parts.
Oh it is definitely the easiest car to work on, I’m just a little jaded from many years of beetle ownership. However I am in Canada and there are very few shops willing to work on vintage VWs in my area so I’m pretty much on my own which contributes to the heartache.
That being said Paul, I bought mine sight unseen out of Texas and had it shipped to Buffalo. I picked it up there and brought it over the border myself. My brother in law was living in San Antonio at the time and gave it a non-expert pre purchase inspection to make sure it was all there, ran and the paperwork checked out. Maybe there’s a CC person in Texas who could do that for you.
I’m from Argentina and briefly owned an ’81 Fusca (Beetle) in L trim and it did have heating. This was the luxury trim for export that also gave you a radio, better upholstery and a paper air filter. Engine was a 1300 cc. Argentina imported Beetles briefly between 1979 and 1983.
My guess is that heating was optional in the L trim because southern Brazil can get chilly in winter. I would look for Fuscas in that region.
Note that the one labeled a ’66 with the narrow fan housing is an early 1200cc style block with the fuel pump mounted on the side, below the distributor.
Brazil and Mexico coexisted with the Beetle for many years, almost like the Falcon in Australia.
I’m from Chile and we had a ’67 German Beetle with heating in the late 80’s – early 90’s. This car was something special, since most Beetles came from Brazil and most of them had no heating. I remember relatives of my mother complaining about their Brazilian Beetles. At a certain point the lever cables failed and our mechanic couldn’t find spares for the control cables, hence he connected the heater in the winter months and disconnected it in the summer! Hot spring days in Santiago with 30°C are not unusual and seating in the back could become really uncomfortable!
I still have very fond memories of that car, I understand your Beetle-lust.
I Googled “why are beetle heaters so bad” just out of curiosity – in addition to the first link being to the CC article about Bug heaters also included this blurb from Google AI:
> No recirculating air:
Beetle heaters typically don’t recirculate air, meaning they constantly draw in fresh air. This can make the car feel airtight and can lead to condensation and fogging on the windows.
They have this backwards, don’t they? At least in every car I’ve had it’s recirculated air, not fresh air, that will fog up the windows. Is the Beetle any different? I’m not familiar with the various “fresh” or “stale” air systems that VW used in their air-cooled cars, though from what I understand the crescent-shaped vents behind the rear side windows in later Bugs are part of a flow-through vent system. The ’90s Brazilian Beetles have these, which look strange to my eyes since I’ve never seen them paired with the small windows.
That’s complete AI rubbish.
In either case (“stale air” or “fresh air”) the heated air is always fresh air, coming from the engine cooling fan. The only difference is that the “stale air” systems use that air directly, with the risk of a CO leak, while the “fresh air” system goes through a heat exchanger. So they got that part mostly right, but not about that leading to “feeling airtight” and leading to fogging or condensation.
This is a classic example of why AI answers being offered by Google are all-too often misleading or downright false. It sounds “right”, and if you don’t know better, one is likely to act upon it.
I avoid the AI answers Google offers like the plague.
Heat? Who needs heat? In the dead of winter, in metro Detroit, I didn’t bother turning the heat on in my car when driving to work. It was only an 8 mile drive. By the time the Civic really started to perk, I was there, so why bother?
I found a dealer in Newark, who routinely has about half a dozen Brazilian market VWs, mostly from the 80s and 90s. He has a very handsome Parati, as well as flat four powered examples of the Gol and Saveiro. Of course, in the 80s, you get into cars that are set up for E100, with a carb, and a cold start system, so driving one here is not a slam dunk. The Parati may be one of the minority that were built for gas. But the Gol and Saveiro both have a large, orange, but unlabeled button on the instrument panel, that I suspect is for using the cold start system.
8 miles? My xB kicks out heat after half a mile; seriously.
I suppose much of the time it wouldn’t be a big issue, but there’s times I might want to take a longer drive in the cooler seasons where it would be very welcome.
The herd mentality in Big Tech. Everything has to be “AI-powered” because it’s the Next Big Thing just like the metaverse was the Next Big Thing until people realized it was just a virtual dead mall and now all that’s left is the rebrand of Facebook’s parent company.
8 miles? My xB kicks out heat after half a mile; seriously.
The air coming out of the vents may have been perceptibly above ambient before then, but by the time the passenger compartment was perceptibly above ambient, I was pulling in to the office parking lot. That was true of two different late 90s Civics, and an Escort.
The worse thing to do was use the defroster. The car would typically be covered with snow in the morning, meaning the air duct to the heater core was full of snow. So the air coming out of the defroster vents was moist. The moment the moisture hit the windshield, it would condense, or freeze. So I would be working the wheel with one hand, rowing the shifter with another hand, and scraping frost off the inside of the windshield with another hand.
So, I didn’t bother with the HVAC system at all. If it was 5 degrees outside, I dressed for 5 degrees inside the car.
Yes, on longer trips, heaters, defrosters, a/c, may actually contribute to comfort. But, for my use profile, an HVAC system was pretty useless.
“At any rate I can assure you that owning ANY vintage beetle requires expense and work, and rewards you with heartache and more expense and work.”
One could easily substitute the word “car” for “beetle” here. Any vintage car is an ongoing project and expense.
I don’t know much about VW Beetles but have always wanted to have one as a fun driver, very briefly had a non-runner ’69 but flipped it pretty fast, should have kept it to play with for a while. Now a decent Beetle sells for about the same or more than an MGB, which is crazy considering sales numbers of US Beetles were at least 10 times that of the 500,000 MGBs, and it was a cheap and pedestrian vehicle, not a sports car. Nostalgia can be expensive!
If I came down with a case of Beetle fever, I’d be researching what it would take to import a MY 1999-2000 unit from Mexico. At CC, we admire the simplicity of the carburetor, but 99% of the readers here probably have fuel injection on their daily drivers, with good reason.
If you’re talking about the overly complex electronic-feedback carbs and such during the malaise era (’80s-’90s) I see your point, up to a point. But these are very simple single barrel carbs; there’s not much too them to ever go wrong. I’ve never touched the carb on my ’66 F100 six since I bought it in 1987. Seriously. And it always starts instantly and runs great. The worst that could happen is a worn out accelerator pump diaphragm or such, but it still would run.
FI? there’s lots to wear out. The high pressure fuel pump, injectors, and the electronics that run it. Sorry, but I would very much avoid a FI Beetle, as it rather breaks with the whole simplicity/easy to fix aspect that makes them so appealing.
Brazilian Beetles did get updated bodies, with the “moon vent” behind the quarter window, around 1974, same as the Mexican versions. Here’s a ’74.
It’s the side windows and the windshield that never got updated; they’re the same as the German Beetles from 1958-1964. In 1965, the German beetles got much bigger side windows and windshield. The Mexican beetles did get those bigger side windows and windshield, not sure right now of the year; I’m thinking about 1970 or so.
Yes, the Brazilian Beetles got various other updates, including a larger rear window, but never lost that smaller windshield and side windows, right to the end. That makes them quite distinctive, and pretty obvious if you look at them from the front or side.
https://www.curbsideclassic.com/blog/cohort-sighting-brazilian-vw-beetle-small-windows-still/
An 84
A 93
Hello Paul, the standard Fusca does not have a heater and it cannot be retrofitted. You can tell by the fact that the dashboard is smooth and the ventilation slots are missing. Fuscas were also never officially exported, as they basically have no traceable original condition, in Brazil too much was simply improvised. All Fuscas are own imports, not from VW.
I had to do this as my big valve heads are not drilled for the tube which operates the flaps. Means warm up in winter below freezing takes way longer. Looking to see if there is a way to reinstall them for that reason.