(first posted 2/14/2016) Growing up in central Ohio, we were one of the few “no car” families in our lower middle-class neighborhood. Mom never drove and Dad gave up driving in his 30s – mostly due to the expense. So anytime we needed to go anywhere, it was off to the bus stop. Thus began a life-long fascination with motor coaches.
Fortunately, our city was served by the Columbus Transit Company (CTC), a progressive transportation entity spun off from the Columbus and Southern Ohio Electric Company in 1949. In the mid ‘50s to mid ‘60s, CTC operated two different coaches; the ubiquitous GM Old Look, in various sizes and seating configurations, and the Marmon Herrington (MH) TC-44/48 Trolley Coach.
Non-Columbus bus – example only
Paul did a great post on the GM Old Look Coach here. It’s hard today to understand just how common these coaches once were – in 1956, GM held 84% of the transit and highway coach market in the US – a fact that invited government scrutiny and the Dept of Justice filed an anti-trust suit in federal court that year. CTC operated three versions of the Old Look.
As Paul outlined, naming designations were pretty easy to decipher. For example, this is a TDH 5105 – T (Transit) D (Diesel) H (Hydraulic automatic transmission) in 51 (seat) configuration, series 05. CTC also used TDH 4512s.
Non-Columbus bus – example only
Smaller TGH (Gas) 3102s were used on the cross-town and low demand routes.
Non-Columbus bus – example only
As Paul mentioned, these had a very distinct ride, as the two-cycle 6-71 diesel engines spinned up quickly – and the two-speed Allison V-Series automatic transmissions gave a very abrupt shift from low to high gear (essentially direct drive). Sometimes, we typically preferred riding in something a little less jerky.
Prior to 1946, Marmon Herrington was a manufacturer of trucks and automotive components; perhaps best known for their 4WD conversions of Ford station wagons and pick-up trucks. They identified a niche in the large post-war bus market – GM and the other smaller bus manufacturers were focusing on internal combustion engine buses, primarily diesel. Few were offering electric traction models. MH built a new factory in Indianapolis to hopefully exploit this niche.
And one of their eager customers was CTC, who was looking to replace its older Brill and Pullman trolley buses, and purchased a series of MH coaches in 1947/48 – here some are being loaded on rail cars at the MH factory in Indiana for delivery to Columbus.
Again, an easily understandable naming convention – T (Trolley) C (Coach) 44 or 48 (seating). TC-48s can be distinguished from TC-44s by the extra window and row of seats in between the front and rear doors.
They served on all major routes.
By the late ‘50s – early ‘60s these MH’s were getting a little long in the tooth – note that was just the bodies and interiors – the drivetrains, as with all electric motors, had little wear. And if you could live with the slightly older, worn-down interior, you’d be rewarded with smooth, fluid electric traction as it pulled away from each stop – no lurching hydraulic auto transmission here.
Non-Columbus bus – example only
The only time things didn’t go smoothly was when the poles came off the power lines (a dewirement). This didn’t happen often and was usually greeted as a nuisance by the driver, who had to steer the bus over to the curb, exit, walk to the rear, and guide the poles back on to the wires. These buses also rode “hard”, as they lacked the innovative air suspension of the GM models.
The MH’s continued to serve until 1965 when the last run was made on May 30, and the age of the trackless trolley came to an end in Columbus.
However, evidence of how well-built these coaches were, thirty-two were sold to Dayton in 1967. Twenty of these were refurbished (twelve used for parts) and continued to provide excellent service for another 15 years.
The bus in the two pictures above (515) has been preserved and is on display at the Carillon Historical Park in Dayton.
Both these GM and MH buses are true Curbside Classics.
Thank you, I’ve a bit of an interest in trolley buses and can remember being taken to New Cross (I think ) to see the last London trolley buses in the early 60s. Dad was a big fan of them. Trolley poles were under a lot of tension and are quite hard to pull down and reattach after a dewirement. Many of the Blackpool trams had poles til replaced with the pantograph.
We made a trip to London last Oct – our first – and one of our initial visits was to the London Transportation Museum – fantastic place – could spend several days there. Looking forward to going back – London is a wonderful city. Jim.
Love London, I was there in November. Did you try eel & mash?
Didn’t try that though being based in Tokyo here I’ve had quite a bit of eel. The food was excellent everywhere we went. The most “UK” food we ate was a superb Fish and Chips at The Mayfair Chippy.
I saw on Youtube, some videos of the last trolley bus who served Edmonton in 2009.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRP2HOYubBk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4BRP4hmsO8
I remember as a young child being fascinated by the electric trolleys that would travel in front of my grandmother’s house in Dayton. You could occasionally see them spark at the the ends of the “antennas” as they crossed nodes in the overhead wires.
Yes, as a fellow Buckeye, I’ve always admired Dayton for keeping its trolley system. They are testing out some next gen buses now….. Jim.
I visited Leningrad in 1988 and was surprised to see two separate trolley busses hitched up end to end. A single driver operated both… They were essentially bendy busses with four axles instead of three….or a trackless trolley train.
Thanks for this fascinating ride ! I was a frequent bus rider too in my younger years. Our public transport buses back then were built by domestic independent coachbuilders, riding on Leyland or DAF underpinnings.
The City of Arnhem (think 1944 Battle of Arnhem) still uses trolleys. The latest model is the Hess Swisstrolley. Built by Hess from Switzerland (well that sounds legitimate…)
Photo courtesy of Wikipedia/Alfenaar.
I always love bus posts!
I didn’t realize that trolley buses were so common outside of the largest cities. I loved riding on the ones in Innsbruck, but even they eventually phased them out.
Before too long, all inner-city buses will likely be electric (with batteries). No more need for the fussy overhead lines.
Metro, King County’s bus service is trying EV buses with 3 prototypes that will do a year long trial to see if they are viable. They also entered into a contract for a bunch of new traditional trolley buses. The overhead lines going away would be welcome in my opinion. http://kingcounty.gov/elected/executive/constantine/News/release/2015/August/18-metro-electric-trolleys.aspx
Yes, trackless were, in my opinion, a great innovation. We had them in Seattle as a mainstay in our transit system. Later, when I was a student and returned from a stint in the Navy, the same trolleys still plied the streets of Seattle, mostly in the hilly sections, and I drove them for five years. We did not have MH’s. The majority of our trolleys were Twin Coaches, Pullman’s and the last surviving Brill. Today, Seattle is among the five remaining U.S. cities still using trackless trolleys, including standard size and 60′ articulateds, all manufactured by New Flyer.
That’s interesting about Seattle. The last time I visited there (which was back in 2004 they were using the Pullman’s, Twin Coaches, and some New Flyer trolleys. The New Flyers were the old style – not the newer low floor models. It had been years since I had ridden a trolley bus (our trolleys here in Dallas stopped running in 1966) so I caught a bus and rode to the end of the line and back downtown. It amazed me at how smooth and effortless they pulled the hills. We have a streetcar line here in Dallas that uses a dual mode trolley – it runs under wire on the route except when it runs across the Houston Street viaduct (a historical bridge that they elected not to put up wires for the streetcar) when it switches to battery power. Once it goes back to the wire, it charges the batteries as it moves. It also uses regenerative braking.
Marmon-Herringtons shared the electrified streets of San Francisco with smaller fleets of Fageol and St. Louis Car trolley buses. San Francisco Municipal Railway’s first order of M-H and all the Fageols were delivered with their sears upholstered in green leather…real leather, heavier and more durable than that in any Mercedes-Benz and just about as hard! Later orders came in green vinyl.
The ride of the M-H buses, as noted, was hard and jolting. The Fageols were soft, much more comfortable. Cushioned ride, seats of thick leather…the Fageols were the Broughams of the Muni!
These trolley buses from the various makers were generally not interchanged between routes until late in their lives when breakdowns took their toll. The Fageols ran on the 30-Stockton and 5-McAllister and smaller lines, the St. Louis (inevitably nicknamed “Louies”) on the 47-Potrero and 14-Mission. M-Hs ran the 41-Union/Howard and most of the rest.
The trolley buses were well suited to San Francisco’s legendary hills. In the mid-1960s when a major street rebuilding project severed the 41 line into Union and Howard segments, Muni substituted diesel buses. They were poor hill climbers. My brother and I would footrace the diesel buses uphill on foot on Union St. Between Polk and Larkin, and usually win, much to the amusement of passengers. Those diesel buses were Macks. When it came time to replace its hoary old White gasoline buses, Muni leased hundreds of Macks. Muni had not a single GM Old Look. There wasn’t a GM bus to be seen until Fishbowls, along with a token group of Flxibles, came in the late 1960s. Flxible then got the contract to replace the M-Hs, Fageols and Louies.
Today, San Francisco maintains electric traction. Its trolley bus operation has actually expanded to more route-miles than fifty years ago. Electric rail transit is represented by six light rail lines operating in the Market St. Subway and on the surface outside downtown. A historic fleet of streetcars from Philadelphia, Minneapolis (via New Jersey), Milan and San Francisco itself, wearing paint schemes of streetcar lines from many different cities, cruises along the waterfront and on the surface on Market Street. Electric rail, like electric trolley buses, operates more route-miles now than in the 1960s.
Muni’s trolley buses proudly wear the logo, “ZERO EMISSIONS VEHICLE.” San Francisco owns its water supply, and its own hydroelectric generating capability, more than sufficient for its needs. Vancouver, BC and BC Hydro can make the same claim. Perhaps Seattle, too? Maybe Larry, who drove there and posted above, can tell us. Philadelphia, New York, Washington DC, and New Jersey…and Amtrak…all of which operate electric, use power generated by burning fossil fuels.
Thanks for all the great add’l information. Would have loved to rode in one of those Fageols with the green leather seats! Jim.
Maybe this was missed or not up yet on Wiki. An entire list, with photos, of their trolley fleet part of which you mention. Been on some of these cars but more on the standard service cars back in the 80s and early 90s when living in the City. Miss them but won’t set foot in the City today as it pales in comparison to what it was between 1970 to about 1998. Way too much tech and way too much new money has destroyed the feel of the City which I think Herb Caen would agree. Not to mention other now well documented issues.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_Municipal_Railway_fleet#Bus_fleet
Excellent article. I too am a huge GM “Old Look” and “New Look” buses. I would have loved to experience those trolleys first hand.
Thanks Jim! I am a kid again. No electric transportation in my home town
of Kenosha, WI but Milwaukee was running trackless and trolley along with
the GM diesels. We used them often. I remember the postman getting on,
never had to pay, that was a real courtesy.
There was the North Shore Line, an electric railroad running between Milwaukee
and Chicago. Electricity is great.
No electrics, but I’m sure they made up for it in Gremlins.
I can’t look at these buses without thinking of how bad the diesel exhaust used to smell on a hot muggy day. Just a complete rotten egg, sulphur smell.
In Columbus, shortly after the trollies disappeared, people complained about the diesel bus smell.
The solution lasted about a month- some sort of perfume was used in the diesel fuel. It ended up smelling like diesel roses.
The fix ended after about a month, when most of the busses were in the shop for fuel-related issues.
Prior to 1964, Pittsburgh (actually Allegheny County,PA) the mass transit system consisted of over 30 bus lines and the trolley system (I heard at one time had one of the largest fleets of PCC cars.). In ’64 the state allowed the Port Authority to assume the transit role. PAT settled on the GM “New Look” officially, but along with the routes they acquired from the old bus lines,they also acquired many GM “Old Looks”. They refurbished them in the 60s and 70s. The added on A/C units made them “butt heavy” and slow! Some were still around when PAT briefly flirted with GMs RTS, PAT then got a fleet of junk Neoplans. (if only they were as good as the ‘New Look” or “Old Look”) Some outlying counties still have some RTS.
Trolleys are still the backbone of bus service here in the City of Vancouver, even articulated ones. So nice and quiet compared to diesels.
Mrs. Tom and I rode a trackless trolley in your city 10 years ago. Don’t remember what it was, but it was much older than the articulated in your photo. Nice transit system in Vancouver.
My first year in high school (1964) the Phoenix transit system ran old gas Fageol Twin Coaches for students. One driver told me they brought out the Old Looks when it rained because the Twins would short out in water.
In many of the smaller cities where trolley systems existed, there were never really profitable in a “covering the cost of capital” sense. In other words, they made a small operating profit, but when the fixed plant needed refurbishment, it couldn’t be justified, especially at 20th century borrowing rates.
Instead, many were built by the local electric utility, but were later spun off from the electric company. The Public Utility Holding Company Act of 1935, made it illegal for a single private business to both provide public transport and supply electricity to the public. Since the sale of electricity contributed much of the overall profits, it was difficult for the streetcars to make money alone.
Furthermore, it’s worth noting that these weren’t transit agencies – they were for-profit corporations that had to pay taxes, franchise fees, and maintain their right-of-ways. Fares were usually fixed by regulation, and the franchise fees often were based off of gross profit, not net profit.
Once the automobile caught on, these companies were all doomed as profit-making enterprises. Some survived to be taken over by transit agencies in larger cities that could afford them.
Streetcars once ran in cities as small as Shamokin, PA (population fewer than 30,000 from the 1890s to 1929, when the trolleys shut down). There is no public transportation in this dying coal town today (population 7,500).
https://onepointintime.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/ct_edgewood-park_elec-rwy-station_src-shmkmyhmtn.jpg
The Pacific Electric Railway was a special case – owned by the Southern Pacific Railway and founded by Henry Huntington as a loss-leader. The railway was built to provide transportation to land owned by Huntington, which he then sold to developers. The PE didn’t have to make money as long as the land sales were providing profits. But once all the land was sold, and most of the residents had cars, the PE couldn’t turn a profit.
Unfortunately the PE didn’t survive long enough to be taken over by a transit agency.
The fate of the PE is a bit more complicated, and explained pretty well here,
http://www.erha.org/latl.htm
Pictured is an ACF Brill coach with 140hp GE motor. Operated by the post-WWII Los Angeles Transit Lines, which eventually was sold into the public agency called the MTA. I remember these in green MTA livery until the electric portion of the system was abandoned in 1963.
Was that act revoked at some point? I remember quite well that when I was a child (1980’s) in Greensboro, NC, the buses were run by the local electric utility, Duke Power. That ended sometime in the late 80s as I recall.
Nice article ! .
I well remember riding the electric trolly buses in and around Boston in the early 1960’s warm and comfy in Winter , hot as Hades in Summer (! NO A/C !) , smooth and quiet , cheap @ .10 CENTS including a transfer back then .
-Nate
Going by these pictures, it appears that passenger side rear view mirrors were not standard issue. Hardly seems safe for navigating or assuring the safety of your passengers after they get off the bus.
Our city kept electric trolley buses in service until the mid 1960s and I rode on them quite a bit. I remember the dewirement happening on more than a few occasions, especially when the trolley made a left turn too quickly. The diesel buses that replaced them were noisy and smelly but the streets looked better without the grid of overhead wires.
I have previously discussed our love of the GM buses from my student days in Iowa City, where the University had bought up old ones and used them to provide campus transportation. They road and accelerated exactly as Jim describes. The windows rattled as if they were going to fall out on every bump, and the transmission felt and sounded as if it was about to disintegrate on every shift. Hroom-Rattle-Rattle-Bam! Here I want to give thanks for those wonderful old pictures of Columbus. Just the other day a friend of mine and I were discussing how much we miss the old downtown Lazarus department store. Even a starving (OSU) graduate student could walk into that place and be waited on and outfitted as if he was worth a million.
Thanks. Absolutely agree – Lazarus was the best; selection, service, great restaurants, etc. Jim.
Loving all the vintage pics of downtown Columbus! I moved here in the early ’80s, but my family made many trips here during the ’60s and early ’70s to visit my Grandma and an aunt. I was only about 4 years old in ’65, so I don’t remember the trolley buses. 🙁
The downtown Lazarus is sorely missed, but I’m pretty sure the store with the Mr. Peanut sign is still in business at the same location. (3rd picture from the top)
Lazarus was definitively the place – I haven’t found anyone who shopped there who doesn’t miss it. As a youngster, would ride the trolley from Clintonville to downtown and explore the 6th floor toy store area. Yes, the Mr Peanut store was at Broad and High and was a landmark. I haven’t been back to Columbus in several years so don’t know if it is still there or not – hope it is. Jim.
The Peanut Shop (with the same working Mr. Peanut sign!) is now at the SE corner of High and State Street on the ground floor of the Fifth-Third bank building. A larger and nicer store than the former N. High Street location and I think it is busier for them too…the idea was to be closer to Ohio Theater business. The downtown Lazarus is now refurbished (nicely I might add) as office space. The Chintz Room restaurant recently reopened but is accessible directly from High St – I have not tried it (it can’t be as good as the original, of course!). My favorite of the old in-store restaurants (weren’t there eleven of them?) was the Highlander Grill in I believe the West Basement. And what other store could have had an “UP TO BASEMENT” sign as on the Front. St. Level escalator? What a store!
Thanks for the info – glad the Peanut shop is still open and doing well. You’re right – all the restaurants were great – each with its own theme. And I hadn’t remembered the “Up to Basement” sign in 40 years – thanks for the memory! Jim,
Way before my time, but I’ve been curious about these buses for a while, in fact I never knew they existed until a few years ago when I was researching mass transit systems, in particular the electric streetcars. I in the midst of reading about the factors leading to the decline, I thought to myself in hindsight “they should have just used electric busses that use the overhead wires and just do away with the rail infrastructure – best of both worlds!” Really glad I wasn’t writing any kind of term paper or surrounded by real experts on the topic, my face was sure red when I saw a picture of a bus with poles on it soon after! 😛
Still seems like a good better means than diesel busses to me though, I utterly hated riding busses in my lifetime, every last one was a NVH peanalty box with a loud jerky diesel(can’t imagine the days of the old look from what I’ve heard described). My personal view on the subject is gas IC belongs in cars, Diesel belongs in industrial/agriculture, and Electric propulsion belongs in transit. Plus, maybe I’m in the minority, I love the look of cities with overhead wires, they just look so much more complete. I’ve been to parts of a few cities where some of the hardpoints of that old infrastructure remains(poles, abandoned right of ways, etc) and it just looks depressing, and functionally I feel direct power transmission > power storage(batteries) can’t take more than a few minutes to realign two poles to the wires in a dewirement scenario, run out of juice on the batteries and that bus aint going anywhere for a while.
Personally, I thought the overhead wires were ugly, and that is most likely the majority opinion. Also, the infrastructure to support that system required large motor-generator sets every few miles, as the systems were 600VDC, as I recall. Conversion efficiency could not have been very good and the power itself was generated from coal or bunker oil here, very little hydro and the nukes didnt exist yet.
Until storage battery tech takes another leap, natural gas powered buses are used in Los Angeles. Not being tied to a trolley wire infrastructure allows the most flexibility in routing.
There is the dual power option. Metro Transit had a lot of them for a while. They use articulated buses with a complete diesel power train in the rear and a complete electric power train in the middle. One of the areas that they were used heavily once it was open was in the bus tunnel in downtown Seattle. But before that there were routes that would run in city on electric and continue on to the Suburbs on diesel.
I don’t get the whole infatuation with streetcars either. I’ve seen plenty of “then and now” photos of major intersections in places like Pittsburgh or downtown Los Angeles where there were so many sets of overhead wires crossing the street that they looked like cages.
See, I love that look, in a dense city it adds to the built up feel – surrounded on all sides by tall buildings and with overhead wires up top too, it’s like a canopy in a man made jungle. But yeah, I know I’m one of the few who think that way, I’m mechanical minded, I see way more beauty in infrastructure than the attempts to hide it. I remember driving through the rocky mountains and my absolute favorite part was going through the tunnels, the spectacular natural scenery in between? Meh! lol
If you’re such a fan of tunnels, I would suggest driving through some in Austria. A few of them were incredibly long. An experience for me that really stood out on that trip.
I remember Aucklands trolley buses from city shopping trips as a child however they were got rid of in the 70s and herds of diesel Mercedes buses took over,
Wellington still has trolleys but they are being phased out in favour of hybrids.
The smaller yellow and orange gas bus and the larger diesel bus in the next frame down were taken in Winnipeg prior to 1976. The building in the background was the Fort Garry Court / Strathcona Block at Broadway and Main. It was destroyed by fire one cold morning in early 1976. The other photo was in close proximity. Consolidated Motors, a Lincoln Mercury dealership was in the background. It was torn down close to four decades ago. Some other frames may be Winnipeg Transit as well. They operated trolley buses and streetcars prior to engine driven units as early as the beginning of the 29th century
Yes, I couldn’t find very many pictures of Old Looks in Columbus so I used these as examples of the models listed – thanks for clarifying. Jim.
I like the fact that Dayton still has the trolley buses, though I haven’t ridden one. San Francisco had them, too, on Market Street. They were equipped with large water filled bumpers in the event of a collision.
Cincinnati is about to get a streetcar system and Northern Kentucky is studying how to tie into it to make local transit much more interesting.
As far as the old-look buses, St. Louis had many of them in the 1970s when I got my first real job in 1975. I did ride them, and not all had air conditioning, either. They got quite hot.
Good grief, Cincinnati’s money-pit streetcar to nowhere. I just read a book about Cincinnati’s abortive subway system from the early 20th century…the tunnels are still viaible between I-75 and Central Parkway, north of the Western Hills Viaduct.
If Cincy is going to do anything on rails, they need to do a light rail system like St. Louis has done…although St Charles County may regret not tying into the light rail lines.
There are tunnels in Norwood, too.
I agree that a light rail system should have been done, but if NKY gets into the streetcar act and ties in with Cincinnati, AND if the streetcar builds up the hill to the UC/”pill hill” area as originally planned, at least that’s something. Hey! at least they’re pretty!
Now if this place can ever get its act together about I-75 and a new bridge…
Glad I retire next year!
Thankfully my wife’s commute, and my commute, only involve surface streets. We had to go up I-75 Saturday evening, to a charity banquet in West Chester, and it was a stopped-up mess, from Mitchell Ave to Glendale-Milford…I avoid 75 like the plague.
When North Bend Rd was re-done several years ago, they finally tore out the old rails from the streetcars…it was amazing how many layers of asphalt had been piled on top of the old railbeds. I was also astounded that the rails were still in place.
Now that’s funny – I live in West Chester!
Fortunately, I don’t do I-75, either – I work in Hebron behind the airport, so I take I-275 all the way. Long, but a sane ride.
Although I’ve never ridden as a passenger, nor have I seen one in person, I’ve seen pictures of these vintage buses and trolley buses.
Trolley buses were common in many large UK towns & cities, they replaced trams in many cases when the tracks were worn beyond economic repair.
Wow, I knew about Marmon-Herrington, but did not recall (if I ever even knew) that they made these electric trolley buses. I enjoyed this a lot.
I still remember the tangled “forest” of electrical lines that over ran the streets of downtown Atlanta, and how the sparks would fly whenever a junction was crossed! The look really changed once the transition to diesel/gasoline/etc. buses occurred! 🙂
Great article, good to recognize trolley buses for their contribution to public transportation.
The video showing the two Edmonton Transit System buses following old route 7 brought back memories of riding the trolley as a little boy before my father bought his first car. As a kid I always enjoyed riding the bus whether on a GM old-look or the Brill and Canadian Car trolleys. The first trolley buses in Edmonton were AEC models followed by Leylands imported from England. In the latter part of WW II the city of Edmonton bought Pullman-Standard trolleys.
I remember riding GM “Old Look” buses in Washington DC in the early seventies on occasion. This must have been the end for them. I rode mostly GMC “fishbowls” after that. This was during my high schools years. Also used to love the Cadillac bodied ambulances going by on Connecticut Avenue, too!
For a long time, I had assumed that the electric trolley buses were used due to environmental consideration and noise abatement. Living in San Francisco proved me there’s more than that aforementioned reasons.
A several years ago, San Francisco MUNI was evaluating modern buses as a potential replacement of its ancient trolley buses. One manufacturer whose name MUNI would not reveal offered a diesel bus instead of trolley bus. Off it went on the Routes 33 and 37 with full passenger load.
For CC readers unfamiliar with San Francisco, Routes 33 and 37 are notorious for a series of very steep climbing (25-40% gradient) and sharp turns, especially in Noe Valley, Cole Valley, and Twin Peaks neighbourhood areas.
http://www.datapointed.net/visualizations/maps/san-francisco/streets-slope/
The diesel bus groaned loudly and grinded to stop about a quarter of its way up the steep grade. It could not continue any further. What a huge embarrassing coup de grâce for the manufacturer…
The electric trolley bus happily and quickly zoomed up to the peak like the Norwegian Husky dogs pulling the sled through snow.
Electric buses both Chinese and Canadian built have been tested during the past several months in Edmonton and the nearby city of St. Albert. Results have been very encouraging but I have not heard yet how these buses do in winter. These types of buses would be the way of the future if batteries can keep a strong charge over many kms.
If all coal generated power plants convert to natural gas generated, then that issue will be removed making electric buses truly Eco friendly transportation.
From the 40’s thru the mid 60’s, trolly buses were very common on the main thoroughfares of New Orleans. I barely remember them, but my older brothers and sister road them on their way to high school.
However, the city was wise enough to keep the street cars running. Several lines have been converted back to street cars in the last several years.
The trolley buses had leaflets with local New Orleans stories.
Note the trolley bus is depicted in the center of the header row of the leaflet.
I love Mr. Peanut standing guard over the peanut store Glad he is still on duty!
I rode the metrolink bus in St Louis for two years did they ride rough
I thought new busses had some high tech smooth ride something
They must have forgotten to put the air in the air suspension system!
Here in Dallas, we had trolley buses manufactured by Pullman Standard, J.G.Brill, and Marmon Herrington. The Marmon;s were the newest ETB’s, having been put into service in 1948. They ETB’s were in service from 1940 until 1966, when the ETB operation was stopped in favor of diesel buses. Below is a picture of one of the Dallas ETB on a route. I remember riding the ETB as a child, and I can remember that they were smooth and quiet and quite fast.
My dad worked for the Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) for his whole career, starting with summer jobs at university in the 30s until he died in 1967. The TTC had trolleys along with diesel buses, subways and streetcars so I had experience with all sorts of public transit. The routes cover by trollies were limited, so I did not ride them much, but they did seem very smooth. They trolleys were all retired a fair time back, but the streetcars continue to be an important part of the network. I no longer live in Toronto so when I visit I basically use the subway.
I loved the trolley buses the TTC used on Annette street. I loved the sound, the hum as it spooled up to accelerate. Your Dad may have driven one I rode on.
Something tells me they were harder than a streetcar to get the electric rod to reconnect with the overhead wires if they became dislodged.
As a kid, I used to love waiting for the Old Look diesel bus to come up Runnymede Rd. so I could watch it from my bedroom window above. I can still see the yellowish roof from that top view in my mind’s eye.
My mother didn’t drive from some time before I was born until I was 9 or 10 due to cataracts; my childhood buses were a mix of New Looks and then-newish slantback RTS-01s. There was less bus riding as I approached adolescence – we moved closer to the center of town where I could walk or bike more places, Mom had surgery on one eye and got her license back (the materials spoke of how the new-in-the-early-80s process allowed a much higher chance of a good outcome and faster recovery time than the ’60s/70s procedures – but when she went back to have the other eye done circa 2010 there was a round of calling everyone in the practice in to have a look that “this was done with a knife!” But I digress…)
In any case the local bus company (Chittenden County Transit Agency, Burlington VT) was an RTS buyer up to the turn of the millennium and never updated their -01s to the larger a/c unit that dictated later ones’ squared-off rear.
Back in 1987 I got to ride one of these Trackless Trollys in Seattle while visiting relatives. Our Trolly experienced an unfortunate breakdown rendering us immobile. I still remember the bus drivers joke about it that went something like “folks I’m sorry for the inconvenience but just so you know this bus has driven (insert crazy number) miles and never burned a quart of oil.” That got a good laugh out of all of us tourists. I also have a bit of a fascination with all catenary wire systems. Most people consider catenary systems to be an ugly eyesore. However our modern Light Rail catenary system designed from scratch for the Minneapolis, Saint Paul metro area is a beautiful work of art in my eyes.
I wonder what the motor configuration is of the trolley buses? Is there a motor at each wheel or a central motor? The heating and air conditioning systems (assuming they had them) must have been a considerable load on the electric system.
The older Marmon Herrington’s had one central motor Steve, usually a GE model 12-12J1. It ran on 600 volts DC. No A/C and yes, the heating was pretty weak in the winters.
Modern trolley buses, and battery-electric, currently use one motor – Siemens seems to be the leading manufacturer, One could expect as the technology improves that motors may move to the wheels.
Where I live in Vancouver, trolley busses are the backbone of the transit system. There is a trolley bus stop like 200m from my door. It will take you downtown Vancouver in less than 20 minutes. I am really glad the powers that be kept the electric busses. The reason is our provincial power utility, BC Hydro, ran the bus system for years. They are clean and quiet.
Any interesting emerging technology is the “electric highway,” where heavy trucks are powered by overhead wires. It is being tested in Germany.
https://www.electronicdesign.com/markets/automotive/article/21172885/electronic-design-electric-highway-tests-accelerate-in-germany-and-the-uk
Thanks for a great article and to all of oyu who added information.
Thanks for that information Jim. Interesting how it’s one central motor, unlike many of the modern electric vehicles emerging. Then again, quite different altogether with external DC power for the buses.
I rode the Marmon-Herringtons a lot in 1960’s Dayton, OH. Great buses! My favorite memory was of the City Transit Driver M. Stout who would let his #5 Route bus practically freewheel down Far Hills Avenue (45 mph?) and speed around the slant to Oakwood Avenue. Every once in a while, he’d misjudge and the result was his pulling over to the curb and putting the trolley arm back in its proper wire. Loved those buses!