(first posted 3/2/2011) Having repeatedly been confronted with the picture of the 1963 Grand Prix in other articles the last couple of days made me think: when exactly did the GP really start its final descent? And then a mental image of this picture of a 1978 GP popped up. I shot this in San Mateo a while back, sitting there so modestly with its dog dish hubcaps and all. The question was answered. The sin of name debasement was rampant in Detroit, but here’s an example as deadly as any.
Let’s bring it out one more time: the ’63 was a stunner, and undoubtedly Pontiac had its work cut out for it in trying to sustain the GP’s halo car image.
By 1967, the GP was getting a bit hippy, and not in the usual sense of the word for that year. But it still managed to convey a certain exclusivity, especially in the ads of the times.
The GP had been downsized before, in 1969, when it rode on a 118″ version of the new mid-sized GM frames. It was a bold step to inject new life into the personal luxury coupe, and ignited that mammoth American love affair with that segment, especially now that it was a bit more affordable. Although now not quite as exclusive, the GP’s stunning good lines (here in what may be my best photo ever, thanks to a setting sun) managed to keep its reputation largely intact.
The 1973 – 1977 Grand Prix was more than a bit challenged to keep up appearances, but its dramatic lines, sculptured beak and very distinctive tail allowed it to hang on, just barely. In this piece we won’t go much into GM’s quality issues of the seventies, and focus more on the styling, and the image the GP exuded, or didn’t. Regardless of how one feels about this generation, it did draw looks, if not always the most admiring ones. The field was now very crowded, and the Cutlass Supreme had somehow captured America’s attention in a way the GP didn’t anymore. Perhaps this GP is too masculine or slightly threatening looking compared to the Cutlass, which exuded a more benign image of gentle middle-class luxury coupe aspirations.
I apologize for the lack of proper front-quarter and rear-quarter shots of this car, which was one of the first I ever shot. What struck me was the side view (top), and how remarkably plain and un-eyecatching it was. This was a Grand Prix? GM’s only effort in trying to maintain any sense of ties to the GP’s heritage was in the beak, but it now too was only a pathetic little caricature of the dramatic 1971 GP beak (below).
I understand that GM’s first wave of downsizing presented challenges in the effort to shed weight, but really…how about going against the grain and bringing back the round headlights? Anything to get away from that profoundly generic front end.
I suppose it still beats the tail, which has now been utterly plucked of any plumage. How the mighty have fallen.
The GP’s dash is the only bit of attempted flair in this otherwise utterly undistinguished interior. I won’t even bother to show you the ’63’s sacred space.
At least Pontiac acknowledged the GP’s decline with a modest price reduction, from the 1977’s base of $5120 to the 1978’s 4880. But that doesn’t begin to reflect the drastic decontenting that occurred in that transition. The 1978’s standard engine was now the 231 (3.8 L) V6, which brought 105 (net) hp to the non-party. A 301 (5.0 L) V8 version with 140 hp was available, as well as a 150 hp version for the GP SJ. At least the V8’s had a half-way reasonable power-to-weight ratio with the new lighter body. But what about the vaunted GP glamor?
I’m going to do something I usually don’t, and repeat the top picture again, because it tells the sad story of the once Grand Prix better than any more of my words can ever do.
Man, I love any Grand Prix. My Dad had a ’72 Model J with 400 cubic inch V8, dual exhaust and Rallye wheels. What a great car! Only problem was that it was a medium bronze with a lighter tannish half-vinyl roof…. Very 70’s for sure.
In CC’s damning this car and praising the Simca, all I can think of is how much I hated my mother’s ’86 Horizon and how much I loved my father’s ’84 Grand Prix.
It’s an upside world sometimes, eh? But your point is taken. Anyway,I never said the GP was a bad car per se; just that its once proud name had been debased.
Take that lock bar off of the steering wheel, who wants that thing?
See my comment below. Trust me, this is a very sought after, hot vehicle for certain demographics.
In all fairness, this a bare-bones dog-dish model. I’ve never seen one adorned with those before.
Yeah as “low rent” as those wheels are I’m amazed this example isn’t one of the rare ones with a 4 speed MANUAL transmission. (The rareness of that would almost make it “lust worthy.”)
This definitely isn’t such a ‘grand’ prix, but this generation looked pretty good in black with the snowflake alloy wheels-I’m thinking of the picture in the 1978 Pontiac brochure. The ’81 facelift was actually an improvement.
Here’s a 78 Chevrolet Monte Carlo project car for sale with one:
http://www.ctcautoranch.com/Cars/Car%20Sub-Pages/Cars%20Chevrolet%20Cars.html
Although I’d rather have the 4 speed 79 GA seen here:
http://www.grandamman.com/contact.html
Back in the mid 80’s, my best friend, let’s call him ‘Jake’ had a 71 GP through our high school years. IIRC, it was a crappy golden brown w/ peeling landau’ roof (barf) — most bleak, but in spite of the livery, it was a thorobred to me!
By the time Jake purchased that (<$500) car it was already a goner but he made up for it by putting very little work or money (for that matter) into it. Fact is i doubt he even cleaned when he took possesion. That car rewarded us with many, many 90 mile Jersey shore (round trip) runs with trunkfulls of Red Whitle and Blue beer ($4.99/case). Wasn't good, just cheap.
Towards the end of our time in paradise (high school) — prom night to be exact, he ferried a car full of dopes and his equally libertine date on an overnight shore run. Gladly, I missed that one because on the way back ol' sleep deprived Jake nod off and swerved onto the shoulder and BARELY missed a State trooper ticketing another motorist. Well, that was the last time I saw that 71 GP as ol' Jake didn't need his drivers' license for the next 12 monthes~ I wonder what ever happened to that car……..
Yeah, it’s a bit on the bland side, but I still kind of like it. Maybe for it’s simplicity. However, the 1981 restyle totally turned this car into a looker IMO…
Yup, just like the rest of the G cars 81 was when they came into their own. The GP and Regal especially!
I’ll take mine in 87 GP 2+2 form please.
I agree with supremebrougham about the 1981 restyle. I think it improved the looks of the Monte Carlo and Regal as well. I always found the styling of the 1978-80 models to be a bit awkward. The Cutlass Supreme is a different story. Somehow the styling of the original downsized Cutlass just seemed to flow better… maybe that’s why it sold so well. Of course, the 1981-88 Cutlass Supreme was a handsome car, as well. For some reason, it seems like the downsized Grand Prix just never caught on as well as its siblings. I don’t have any evidence to back this up, but I have a feeling that’s still true today. Special editions aside, I bet a well-kept Monte Carlo, Cutlass Supreme or Regal could fetch more money on eBay than a comparable Grand Prix.
Having spent a lot of time in 78-80 Cutlass-GP-Monte-Regals, one thing that always stood out to me was that although the dash design was different in each model, the radio and climate controls were in the exact same place, and was of the exact same design.
The Cutlass was my favorite of this time period, probably because I owned a 7 year old model ( lime-green, buckets, floor shift w/ console, and the oh-so powerful 260 V-8 ), and as a 23 year old kid, I thought it was pretty cool.
To my eyes, the 2nd Gen Regal was the best looking of the G-bodies………
To riff off of a recent posting at the other site, I think the downsized GMs of the late 70’s was Detroit’s tutelage in how to deal with CAFE and unstable fuel prices. Granted, the Grand Prix in this posting is nothing like the 78 that I took to my high school prom, or even remotely like one of 60’s GP’s, but it was how we dealt with the realities of the situation in the late 70’s. Until electronics became our car’s saviours, instead of our enemies as it was back then, what else could they do to meet the requirements of the buying public? Today we have direct injection for power and torque we couldn’t imagine, six speed automatic trannies that get much better fuel mileage than manuals, and tires and suspension systems that can react faster than we can blink our eyes.
Who would have imagined back when this car was contemporary, I’d be driving a four cylinder 6 speed automatic 4 door sedan that has more horsepower, much better fuel mileage and much better space utilization (2009 Pontiac G6) and inflation adjusted, be a less expensive car to purchase and operate? If you would have said that was coming I would have asked to have a hit off of your bong. We live in the golden age of automobiles, really. I’m glad I was around to witness the malaise era, because as evidenced by the Gremlin review, younger readers can’t seem to wrap their heads around what was happening back then. I guess it’s up to us old farts to get the point across…
When I was a (little – younger than my daughter is now) kid my grandfather had a 78 Grand Prix. Though I’m pretty sure it was a V6, it was clearly more upscale than the vehicle pictured here. It had blue metal-flake paint and a white vinyl top with white vinyl seating and blue carpet. He tried to sell it himself after buying a brand-new 1984 Honda Accord and couldn’t give it away. Wound up driving it to the scrapyard.
Interesting that we got $2,000 for our ’78 GP V8 with a rod knock when I traded it in for my new ’84 Cutlass. No it wasn’t added to the price of the new car as I special ordered the Cutlass and price was already negotiated. My guess is the color combination of that one and it being a 6 cyl.
These were the “slab side” years, which, with much relief, I breathed easier when these went away. The 80’s versions – especially the Buick Regal were almost back to what GM did best, minus pillarless, roll-down rear window styling, but those days, I’m afraid, are gone for good. (sob)
I think the Grand Am of those years looked better. The Grand Prix/Monte Carlo styling of that A-body downsize was awkward to be kind. Both improved with the 1981 facelift as they became known as G-bodies (The “A” designation went to the regrettable FWD mid-size series that began in ’82).
That metric TH200(?) trans was a real loser too, my in-laws had a ’78 Grand Am that went to AMMCO for a transectomy circa ’82. Came back with a TH350, end of problem.
They should have put a 4 speed stick in it (grumble grumble grumble…)
Those stupid silver colored/rubber/plastic bumper strips that were discolored, peeling and falling off those Monte Carlos in 2 years though….
Here’s a picture of my 1978 Granprix, I’ve modified the engine to a 350, new enterior, suspention and paint job. What do you think?
Another picture
I like the color, although those wheels don’t work for me. On its own these aren’t bad looking cars but if you compare them to the ’63 above…you definitely get a sense of “How the mighty have fallen.”
As mentioned above these cars didn’t come into their own until the mid-life restyle. I have a deep love and respect for the G-bodies, as they are the last true GM muscle cars. Unfortunately I feel the Grand Prix is the least attractive. The Cutlass and Regal look relatively elegant and understated. For me the Monte Carlo is fine in base trim, but most of them in the South have been tarted up with SS front ends.
A Cutlass or Regal with T-tops with a high compression Olds or Buick 350 (hold the SBC) gets a slot in my Dream Garage.
I know a guy who drives one of these still. ’78 Grand Prix in faded blue with a saggin’ headliner. Car kinda makes me queasy when I look at it…..it seems so……unfinished.
Between 1981-84, the Oldsmobile 5.7L (LF9) diesel V8 was made available for the Grand Prix series. For 1982 only, it was the only V8 engine ever, between the discontinuation of the Pontiac 4.9L after 1981 and the 1983 model-year introduction of the Chevy 5.0L (305) V8.
During these four model years, though, the diesel, despite its problems associated with the 1978-80 units used in related GM products, had been rejuvenated in a few spots (hence the change of block code from “D” to “DX,” for example).
Still, how many of you here still own, or have once owned, a 1981 to ’84 Grand Prix diesel?
I owned three of this generation car. Have never seen one this stripped. Mine all had the upgraded exterior with bodyside moldings, rally wheels on two and snowflakes with red centers on the others, bucket seats and floor shifter on the 80 SJ car and all 3 had 301 Pontiac engines, the 79 was 2BBL and the 80’s were 4. My favorite was the 80 SJ which also came with dual exhaust, full gauge cluster, F-41 suspension, W72 version of the 301 which added 30 HP, 2.93:1 rear gears instead of the horrible 2.14’s in the other two cars and larger 205/70-14 tires mounted on those snazzy snow flake wheels. It was a fun car at the time and would easily beat 305 Monte’s, 302 Birds and 318 Cordoba’s of the same time era. Not a deadly sin in my book. No A-G body car should be on this list!
+1 on deadly sin. This car was so plain and stripped compared to the 77 model. This has less style than the Malibu. And the horrible engines and transmissions?? V6 slug and weak 301 ugg. How these ever sold against a t bird or Cordoba I will never understand. The one shown is grotesque inside and out. Not one bit attractive at all. Ugg. Good riddance to Pontiac. The 81 redesign was more attractive but the 88 was also horrible looking. I hate this car. At least the Monte Carlo had nice lines on the fenders. The Pontiac had no style.
I don’t understand why people hate this era of the Grand Prix’s, I thought they looked a lot better than the Buick Regal’s of this vintage although I do prefer the Olds Cutlass Supreme’s and the Chevrolet Monte Carlo’s of this vintage, for the 1981 redesign the only car I thought improved among the 1978-80 design was the Buick Regal.
I’ve never thought 1978 was the point at which GP began its decline. The car in the pictures is an extreme example of which very few were built. A 1978 Grand Prix SJ with honeycomb wheels and the Viscount leather interior and a 301 V8 was a very nice and dramatic looking car. It had adapted to its era by being downsized and featuring razor-sharp creases and plenty of right angles which were at the time cutting edge and Seville-like.
Remember also that during this era, GP retained is personal luxury persona being a two door-only luxury coupe. The mainstream Pontiac mid-sizer was the LeMans available in both coupe and sedan. A LeMans coupe was decidedly less dramatic in appearance having a more conventional roofline and body panels which were bereft of the knifes-edge lines.
Thus, I disagree with the author’s premise and would suggest that GP’s downfall began in earnest with the fifth generation FWD models launched in 1988. Although the new W-Body GP initially looked promising as it finally aligned the GP more fully with Pontiac’s ‘We Built Excitement’ niche, things quickly began to fall apart. For some time the GP had been a holdout from an earlier era still offering a veloured and chromed personal luxury car experience when the rest of the Pontiac line was looking more Bavarian and international. In ’88, GP was finally a blacked-out, buttoned down drivers car. However, soon thereafter GM elected to drop the Pontiac 6000 sedan and offer instead a four-door GP. This was the first time there had ever been more than two doors wearing the GP badge and this, to me, is the point at which the end began. During this era GP was simply Pontiac’s mid size offering; it was no longer something special. It became a boring FWD sedan that only pretended to offer excitement and began to show up at rental car counters en masse.
The one-time sports coupe had effectively become the new Tempest/LeMans/6000 mid-size sedan ending its run as a two-door with styling flair, performance, sportiness, and a healthy dose of Cadillac-like luxury.
Agreed 100%. We had a ’78 GP LJ black, the padded black roof and it was very classy. Nice, subtle clean lines made it look very expensive like a Cadillac. We had the tru-spoke wire wheels and when I drove it to school a classmate said “Here’s the guy that drives the $200,000 Grand Prix”. The Monte Carlo looked clumsy with that attempt to copy the previous version lines and fender bulges. Subtle things like the GP had the power window switches in the door console rather than slapped crookedly on the door panel and it’s separate gages in the the dash made it distinct. I really wanted the SJ with those leather buckets and honeycomb wheels. Actually that car was beautiful. No comparison to the previous body style which was my favorite but the GP was the best example for this downsize.
I fell in love with this in the showroom when I was a kid. Loved the heat vents that were placed in the sides of that center console too.
Looked great with the factory tru-spoke wire wheels too (not wire caps). This one is just missing the cornering lamps which was the icing on the cake.
Paul, I would invite you to go online & track down a photo of a fully-loaded SJ with the Landau roof, Tu-Tone paint & Snowflake rims, & reconsider your opinion. This plain-jane you found is not reminiscent of the GP’s I saw growing up in this era.
That’s the whole point of my article: This should be a Tempest or LeMans, not a (un)Grand Prix.
If I run into a nice one, I may likely have a different take on it. But I have to find it on the streets; after all that’s what Curbside Classic is all about. 🙂
Agreed. Growing up in the Detroit area where GM cars were in abundance, I’d never even seen one like this. I’ve seen the full wheel covers instead of the Rallye or honeycomb wheels now and then and really thought THOSE were plain Jane examples but never one like this.
Whats amazing about this car is it still has the, rare to start with, base hubcaps intact. It would still look better with some snowflakes on it, but I’m a sucker for originality. And speaking of which, I like seeing the original Delco radio in there. I wonder if its a monaural type with front speaker only? The owner probably bought the “club” at a flea market and is gonna put it away and save it for use on a car that someone would actually want to steal!
What you all don’t realize is that the G Bodies are VERY popular with the thugs and wannabes (even the 80s models). I had 3 stolen in the 90s. As long as the sheet metal is good, it will be painted smurf blue, 20s will be put on it along with a boomin’ system installed and voila! Even the Chicago History Museum has a smurf blue metallic ’79 Monte Carlo with the hydraulics in their lobby as a tribute to “Mexican Heritage”.
Additionally, these cars are stolen VERY easily by simply cracking the plastic steering column cover and pulling the rod to start it.
I always thought the Buick Regal A-body, 78-80 were the best looking of the lot. But the 81 restyle was really an improvement for all the “A’s”. The first really “nice” car that I ever bought was an 84 Regal Ltd. 2 door, it was a real looker.
is it for sale
It was for sale. The article was first published in 2011 and Paul took the picture “a while ago”.
I agree the disappointing downsized GM cars.(Some started getting ugly in 1977) They gave me the impression of being generic copies of generations past. The stodgy looks to say the least were the most unimpressive of styles. To take it further Gm designed the Citation and it’s humpback 4 door ugly sisters. It has proven itself that the majority of these late 70s cars are now very uncollectable and underpowered.
What a drab looking car, its one I’ll never see, nobody is going to bother shipping one of those all the way here its got no resale value and there are much better used pickings to be had that people will fight each other to buy.
I don’t understand the disdain. With a little work, this would be a terrific car. Paint, reupholster the seat with the right period specific material and style, get a new rear bumper filler kit ($149) and you guys would be salivating over it. All the lights and lenses are intact, all the hubcaps are there, I don’t see much rust other than the trunk lid and all the trim pieces (including the bumper chrome – try finding this gen Monte Carlo with that!) seem to be attached. It’s a LeMans in everything but name. It doesn’t even have a rust enabling vinyl top.
When brand new, as now, I find the “downsized” 1978 GM intermediates “under-whelming”/
Compared to the stylish, graceful, well appointed, smooth driving ’77 models; the 78’s were steaming piles of automotive offal.
I found this generation of Grand Prix to be the most disappointing version of the entire crop of downsized 1978 luxury-ish coupes. The Cutlass Supreme and the Regal carried the new size so much better.
I can’t decide what I dislike about this. There is an odd tension between harshly flat surfaces (like the C pillars, header panel and back of the decklid) and attempts to replicate the Coke bottle (at the beltline and the rocker moldings). It just doesn’t work.
I like many cars in strippo trim because it shows off the car’s basic lines. This Grand Prix looks soo much better with Broughamish gingerbread. Which is sad.
I think a lot of the late seventies GM downsizing looks bad without checking off a decent amount of the option boxes. Look at plain Jane GM products of this vintage to see what I mean.
Anyway, jumping ahead one year to 1979, here’s a pretty well equipped LJ model:
IMO
That black 1963 GP with the 8 lug turbine style wheels is outstanding,
the classy clean styling was never matched again after that. Super rare to see one anywhere even at car shows, my guess is that it has become a collectable model.
Like the early Buick Riviera’s have.
Like the other 1978 downsized GM midsizes, it’s ill-proportioned, awkward, looking like it was downsized too clumsily. With the dog dishes, the wheels look too small (20-inchers would be overkill). The slab sides were probably intended as a retrospective to the iconic 1963 Grand Prix but without that car’s graceful proportions, they only made the awkwardness worse, especially with the subtle mid-body character line running the full length of the bodyside being missing. Those commenters who said that it needs dressing up are right. Unlike the chaste but graceful 1963, which speaks quietly, elegantly, the 1978 needs an appropriate amount of bling to cover up its blockiness.
The 1981 redesigns really solidified the look. All of the Gs got much better looking. Especially the Regal.
I havta agree, It’s one of the few times that the update was better than the original.
As noted above pretty eloquently, this car is a product of the environment in which it was bron. A time when the formerly iconic Thunderbird was nothing more than a torino with some plastic headlight doors and an altered roofline, a Monte Carlo was a Malibu with some sculpted fenders grafted on and the Chrysler competition was merely a Fury with some gingerbread. The sin here is not the car itself, but the name applied to the final product. This level of equipment and trim should have been reserved for an entry Tempest, with the LeMans having an uptick in standard features and the Grand Prix at least coming standard with a split bench with folding armrest, some upgraded door panels, and at minimum full wheel covers. I don’t hate this car, as a a matter of fact in as-new condition it would be attractive, albeit not exactly impressive. The problem is that a Grand Prix SHOULD have been impressive.
Wow that bleached green Grand Prix is a sad example of a once great nameplate for Pontiac. I’m a big fan of American full-size Pontiacs up to 1973. Hubcaps on a Grand Prix, sad, very sad.
I’d agree with those that think that the GP is the least attractive of all of the downsized G bodies for ’78, but for me, it’s a tie with the Regal. The ’78 Cutlass and Monte’s look great, but in my opinion, the ’80 Cutlass and Monte look the best. I think that this period really started GM’s slide, because of the parts bin sharing (as has been mentioned), but also not giving each division (and especially each higher division) something better, in terms of styling. Myself preferring the Monte Carlo in terms of styling–as a Chevrolet–would defeat GM’s reasoning to buy the more expensive upper lines of BOP. Aside from the GP’s interior (which is probably the best of all those G bodies at the time…something that I thought as a kid and still do), there would be no reason for me to buy the upper brands……just get a Monte that was well optioned and be done with it.
Of course, I’ve outlined how our ’80 Monte was a complete piece of junk in some other threads, and I can confirm that it was a true Deadly Sin. The atrocious build quality made me believe–as a kid–that it was normal for a car to be in the shop every month (or second month). Paint, rust, fitment, engine/ tranny issues galore. GM deserved to be put out of business for good, after cars like that.
Put too many lines and curves on a car, trowel on the chrome, and it’s “over-styled” and too “brougham.”
Keep the style simple, and allow a lot of options to make the car what you want, including one of the better driver’s cars coming from a company in that era, and you have a corporate Deadly Sin?
Definitely not on board with this Deadly Sin. Refresh that popular period paint, add some Pontiac rally wheels, and this car would be quite pleasant with its nearly true hardtop looks.
Dog dishes were not standard on these, nor were painted wheels. Somebody did this to give it their own minimalist look – sort of a ‘70s version of the base 1963 Pontiac Catalina two-door hardtop – charming in its own way. Patina doesn’t work well on this car with its no longer fashionable color.
Paint it a dark modern color, add some wheels, avoid the egregious gingerbread, and you have a pretty sharp car……………….
I agree. Not a “Deadly Sin”. The black one from your brochure photo is a very attractive car, and admirable in the restraint of its styling.
This generation of GP was very much like that “Gwen” character from “Seinfeld” – a beauty in the right light (colors, options, wheels, etc.), but dreadful-looking in the wrong light.
Always loved these cars, but they must be loaded and with the most attractive colors and trim and options. Mine have the leather bucket seats for example.
My GP LJ was formerly two-tone grey with a red accent stripe. Over the years the paint went dull on hood,roof and decklid, so I decided to let it paint black by a paintshop.
It’s equipped with leather bucket seats and console, floor shift automatic,power seat, seatback recliner for the passenger, cruise,a/c,power windows and door locks,extra gauges,tinted glass,bumperguards f/r, remote controlled sport mirrors,and some other options.
I remember seeing a few elderly drivers in downsized GP’s [and sister cars] like the one at top, with dog dish wheel covers and bench seats.
Seems like dealers ordered many stripped personal lux coupes for buyers who wanted the latest “lux look”, but cheap. These trounced the Malibu/LeMans base coupes. Buick/Olds killed theirs with the Aeroback styling.
I never really liked these cars much. Even with the fancier tu-tone paint, wire or lace wheels, pinstriping and landau vinyl roof, they still seemed too plain and not detailed enough. The rear deck in particular was an abomination, looking like the stylists gave up half way thru.
Had yet another boyfriend who drove a 78 SJ. These cars had to be seriously dolled up to look like anything. Just picture the LJ above w/ two tone and the padded landau vinyl top. Very seventies!! That poor plain jane at the top is sooo sad.
I think that the downsized GP came out pretty good. The plain flat sides and sharply creased edges gave it a distinction from the “shrunken” looking Monte Carlo. I like the grille and the slotted tail lamps. The roofline is crisp, and the “hardtop” appearance is a plus. The dashboard was the best of the A cars. That door panel has a sewn vinyl soft panel with door pull and arm rest, with a carpeted insert on the bottom edge. The three spoke steering wheel is much better looking than the other A cars. This example had the split bench with arm rest, but buckets with console were more popular on higher trimmed models. Mechanically they were a good layout, RWD, V6 or V8 and could handle pretty good, The smaller design made them easier to handle and park in traffic, plus they had more room inside compared to the previous model. I don’t see a deadly sin though this example is beat up, faded and worn, plus it’s green. A lot of folks don’t like green. I would repaint this a dark Highland green with some nice alloy wheels. I see a winner.
I will concede that this green GP in this case, is horribly unadorned of what it should have (snowflake rims, etc), but does nothing to convince me that a similarly optioned (ie: stripper) LeMans or Grand Am wouldn’t be essentially the same car. Paul’s point is not that this is a terrible looking car–because it’s not–it’s just that the Grand Prix’s origins were rooted in it being an aspirational car, not one that was merely one of the pack. The Grand Prix’s higher end status ended up being the flavour of vanilla at some point, and this was where it legitimately started to happen.
These cars were NOT the beginning of the end! I agree that the ’81 restyle was a big improvement. IHowever I do understand your point to an extent from an aesthetic perspective and as delivered.
But the fact of the matter is this car is a HUGE improvement over even the most beautiful and powerful Grand Prixs to come before it minus the drivetrain by a VERY WIDE
margin.
Equip a 1978 Grand Prix and previous year Grand Prix with identical Pontiac 400s and th400s and there would not be one thing the 1978 car would not do better..And since doing such could be and has been done by me in the matter of a weekend 25 years ago as an 18 year old kid and because I know what it feels like to handle such a creature,I find myself believing that anyone who says different probably does not know much. Because I know These cars quite easily make most of the previous cars look pretty stupid on almost any road with really not that much effort.
Yes, G bodies are now getting good $$ as resto-mods and the 80’s GN, Monte SS and 442 bring in bacon. Cult following on social media and can easily swap in an LS V8.
Also, CC re-hashing “GM DS’s” posts from decade plus ago is getting old. How many times will an old Cimarron or Citation post be re-cycled? Just to get “clicks”? How about more fresh, original posts?
The DS series still brings good debate and commentary.
Plus it’s free! 😀
I must have seen something in this car that most don’t. I love my 78!
Curbside Classic: 1978 Pontiac Grand Prix
What size is the engine of the Pontiac at the top of the pqge?
Once again, Paul and I agree on a car.
Saw this one recently, the vinyl top and side trim makes it look less plain
While not a bad car, it certainly looks very ordinary, and a pale shadow of previous Grands Prix, if that’s the right plural (not a French speaker, Grand Prixes doesn’t sound right). Not quite anonycar (that came later), but not as distinctive as previous efforts. There’s not the interesting interplay of light and shade over the body contours that marked GM cars before the ‘sheer look’ seemed to wipe all that away. At least the waistline has some curvature to it; it avoids the ‘block of cheese’ look of the later X- and A-cars.
So many of Pontiac’s classic model names connoted speed and power if not outright racing, and were bound to suffer horrible debasement to the point of cognitive dissonance once the ‘malaise era’ kicked in.
Pontiac did this before. They bunted. The stylists decided that to not make a error was more important than styling their cars. It is as though they stripped the Grand Prix of everything except the minimal. So, it looks like a generic car in profile. No one can say that it is bad, but obviously it is not a Grand Prix. It is like they froze when assigned to style the downsized car and thought that minimalism was the request.
Pontiac did this before. Remember at the end when Pontiac dropped all their Rubbermaid exterior trim pieces that were considered the height of cool a decade before? It was as though the G6 was a Grand Am without the ribbed Tupperwear exterior, remember?
That isn’t a Grand Prix. It is just a coupe looking for a marketing niche camouflaged among the personal luxury cars. Pontiac decided that it needed to put a lot of painted trim on this blank canvas in order to dress it up. Perhaps this was intentional; “let’s put a stripper out there and see who buys it, and if we need to, we can paint details on it later!”
I know that minimalism was cool for some car brands. But this was a Grand Prix, not an Audi. There was no way any Grand Prix driver would find this generation attractive enough to trade in a real Grand Prix for this generic version.
One more thing – I think Pontiac a stripper version of this car, I believe.
The Cutlass Supreme was the frumpy one of the bunch, a big comedown from the popular ’76-77 version. The back third just doesn’t work with the landau roof they all had. The Regal looked great when not tarted up, which the GP needs.
GM’s car divisions (Cadillac excepted) from about the mid-’70s to their bankruptcy tried to be everything to everybody, a result of dealers wanting something to sell to all tastes and budgets. This resulted in fancy Chevrolets, sporty Buicks, and cheap base-model Oldsmobiles. And cars like this strippo Grand Prix, a rare car that looks much better with the landau roof, opera windows, and other brougham gingerbread. Without it, you get an awkward attempt to foist a coke-bottle shape onto a boxy car that wants straighter lines. The front looks like it’s from one of those awful neo-classic cars like the Zimmer or Excalibur. Not sure why, but I really want a Pontiac logo in the middle of the grille; without it it looks generic. If you could get by the outside appearance, the interior was a knockout. Pontiacs had by far the best dash design of the A/G bodies, and the GP added to that distinct door armrests not used on any other GM car including the LeMans or Grand Am – note the raised section that holds the window controls that on other A bodies were just stuck on the door trim where the crank would have been. There’s also no indentation in the armrest to close the door with because all GPs had separate pull straps. LJ and SJ models could be fitted with Viscount leather bucket seats with open headrests, also a GP exclusive amongst A bodies. Either these or the standard bucket seats show off the interior best because they included a large (yet unobtrusive) console that neatly joins with the dash, rare for its time.
The 1981 facelift was a clear attempt to revive the 1963 body contours (especially around the rear fender), along with some colonnade-era creases on the hood and trunk lid. It didn’t work really well with the squared-off and downsized body, but it was a distinct improvement over the 1978-80 models IMO.
“GM’s car divisions (Cadillac excepted) from about the mid-’70s to their bankruptcy tried to be everything to everybody, a result of dealers wanting something to sell to all tastes and budgets.”
In effect, other than Cadillac, each division was trying to be their own little, mini-GM (“a Buick/Oldsmobile/Pontiac for every purse and purpose”). Instead of competing with Ford and Chrysler, they ended up competing with themselves. It’s no wonder that it ultimately led to the demise of two of them.
Exactly. FCA/Stellantis has been accused of having too many brands as well, but they’re widely sold in combined Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/Ram dealerships and thus they can keep their brands distinct, without Jeep dealers insisting on some sedans or Chrysler dealers wanting a pickup truck.
GM in the ’80s and ’90s had many individual GM brand dealers that wanted a full line of cars, which continuously negated attempts at keeping their brands from competing with each other. Pontiac tried to woo a younger crowd in the ’80s with a more affordable take on BMWs, but dealers said they need a big traditional car so back comes the Parisienne which clashed in every way with the direction they tried to go. Buick did well with plush cars that were unabashedly American style and popular with older buyers, but hey lets make T-Type sporty versions of our cars in case younger buyers looking for high-performance cars step into our showroom, and Skyhawks for those starting out who need a cheap small car. Oldsmobile tried several approaches that failed to catch on (emphasizing high tech, trying to woo “import-oriented” buyers, etc.) and made a good impression with the first Aurora, but they couldn’t let go of the ancient Ciera because it was a cash cow, so this 13-year-old car for bargain hunters (and fleets) outsold the new Aurora and got in the way of Olds trying to update their image.
Not a deadly sin, considering the CAFE yearly increases at the time. Maybe if CAFE had been phased in more slowly, GM would have time to style and engineer these better.
PLC’s were so popular that Big 3 brought out stripper models, to take place of base 2 door sedans. Hence, by 1982, there was no more LeMans/Malibu coupe, or Olds/Buick equivalent. And later, Ford had no Taurus 2 door, since had T-Bird.
BTW, the ’63 GP was simply a Catalina with different trim, same B body, even some panels the same. Pontiac’s version of ’63 Impala SS. Not same as ’63 Riviera with its unique E body. The 1969 GP was a true PLC, no shared body parts with Tempest/LeMans.
There were however FWD A body two door sedans like the Celebrity, or the Pontiac 6000 up to 1988, which effectively succeeded the RWD A body line leaving the G body to cover the PLC spectrum.
I followed this idea of name debasing before. Buick Electra, Olds 98, The Grand Prix. Even Ford and Chrysler did this too. New guys would be hired to these companies and would throw away the value of a brand to move the metal and maximize profits. They didn’t care of the history. And they all essentially moved on or retired with no regrets.
Honda and Toyota made efforts to invest in brands and they lasted for years and are here today (Accord, Civic, Camry, Corolla etc). Of the Detroit Brands, Ford is invested in the F series trucks and Mustang, GM the Corvette. Chrysler brought back storied brands like the Chrysler 300, Dodge Challenger and Charger and briefly the Dart.