If you’ve been visiting CC for a while, you probably remember the small parade of Pontiac limousines that made their appearance last year. There was the white one, the Swedish one, and the black one (which used to be mine)–each unique in its own way, each with a story to tell, and each a member of a very exclusive club.
So far, this site has managed to cover at least 30% of the total production of these cars in detail–no small feat! But still, there are a few others which remain unaccounted for.
By most accounts, Superior Coachworks only produced around ten of these uber-long Poncho conversions for the 1965 model year. It seems that most (if not all) were used as funeral limos–“family cars”–before being retired and subjected to the many paths which would, eventually, lead them to where they are today.
Which leads me to today’s question: just where are they? With so few produced, making a list is easy; tracking them down, not so much.
As the former owner of one such limo, my curiosity was piqued. So I decided to try and gather as much history as possible on these strange beasts, especially since their time in the limelight brought out previously unheard details.
What follows is a list of all the cars I know about, and all the clues I’ve been able to gather on them. If anyone has further details, please comment below. Perhaps if we put our heads together, we can find them all!
1) Alive in Texas – One of the better documented examples out there, owned by a guy named Vince Welling. His has been featured in magazines and around the interwebs, and is probably the best known of the bunch. It may also be the most heavily modified–at last check it was sporting a new light blue paint job, an interior that looks to have been lifted from a late ’80s Suburban or some such, and a blown 455 stroked out to 467 cubes and hooked to a “switch pitch” THM400. Family truckster indeed!
2) Deceased in Texas – Mr. Welling also owns a parts car. I don’t know much about it, but as of fall 2012 it did still exist.
3) Auctioned in Oregon – Around August 2012, another car appeared on eBay–shame on me for not making a copy of the listing! It was located somewhere in Oregon, tan if I recall, and in rough shape. The seller appeared to be a tow service; he said he’d retrieved it from a local airport where it was DOA. Mr. Welling’s site mentions one limo was “wasting away in a wrecking yard in Oregon.” Could this be the same one?
4) Alive on Lopez Island – This is “the white one” that was previously featured here. It appeared to have spent much of its life in Washington State. White with black top, vinyl or leather interior (original!), mini-moons. At last check it was running and driving; it appeared on eBay in February 2013, and ended with a winning bid. Its current whereabouts are unknown but its VIN ends in 6657.
5) Alive in Minnesota – I used to own this car before it was featured here, and it was a Minnesotan car through and through: solid, but by no means spared by the tin-worm. It has black paint, a black cloth interior, and steel wheels with chrome trim rings and no caps. Notable as being the only “three on the tree” car built, at last check it was north of Minneapolis, running and driving. It appeared on eBay in December 2012. I’m not sure whether the auction resulted in a change of ownership or not. Its VIN ends in 0964.
6) Missing in Nor-Cal – Mr. Welling’s site mentions a limo having turned up somewhere in northern California. No further details were listed.
7) Restored in Sweden – Another car that was previously featured here, owned by a fellow named Mike Lindholm. It sounds like he did quite a bit of body work on it. It has black paint, a grey cloth interior, and steel wheels with ’61-’63 Tempest/LeMans wheelcovers (which would appear to be correct for the conversion).
8) Alive in Sweden – In the aforementioned article’s comments, Mr. Lindholm mentions having seen another limo in his home country, which showed up to a meet/show he attended. Its whereabouts and status are unknown to me (I suspect this picture may be the car, but can’t tell for certain).
9) Missing in Sweden – Swedish Car nummer tre was also spotted by Mr. Lindholm at some point; however, I have no details on it.
10) Torched in Sweden – Mr. Lindholm also makes mention of the fourth Swedish car having burnt, either in 1970, or sometime within the following decade (not sure which). No idea what the circumstances were, but it would be interesting to hear the story, if there is one.
11) Alive in California? – Shortly after this post first ran, I came across a previously undiscovered car for sale on a dealer’s website. Black paint, gray cloth, red pinstripe down the side, the usual steel wheels and covers. It was claimed to be a repaint with a rusty underbody (“Currently no brakes as I’m replacing the brake lines. The floor boards have rust.”), and sporting some incorrect engine (“Not sure what year it is just know its a 70’s engine with a 2bbl”). The dealer is located in Indiana, and the car wore Pennsylvania plates. Further digging revealed that the car had recently been sold to someone in California for $3900.
So, there you have it: The List! If you know any of the missing details on any of these ten cars, please comment below.
But Wait, There’s More! While scrounging around Flickr last fall, I happened upon this picture of another limo, which I’ve been referring to as the “deteriorating wreck.” It has no license plates, and there are no details around it that I’ve been able to use in determining where it is located. To make things even more difficult, I’ve been unable to get a response from the photographer (who recently closed his Flickr account).
Probably one of the biggest mysteries surrounding this list lies in determining that car’s location. If it’s the missing Nor-Cal car, then we know the general recent whereabouts of every one of the ten. If it’s the missing Swedish car, then only the Nor-Cal car remains to be found. But if it’s neither of them, then perhaps we’ve unraveled a whole new piece of the mystery.
Now you’ve done it, Keith – for the next hour, I will have the Ten Little Indians song that my mother used to sing running through my head: “One little, Two little, Three little indians, . . . . . . ” Only these are big indians.
I hope we break some new ground here and account for the rest of these cool cars today.
Hmmm…if the pic is from a cellphone, isn’t there GPS metadata embedded in the file itself?
Also, from the patina patterns, lack of rust, scrub pine and sage, it’s definitely somewhere on the West Coast…plus the Sears-ish white walls. USA!
Yes, I’m thinking south central Oregon or inland northern California.
There used to be multiple shots of that car (front, back, side); the only one which survives today is the one I posted above, which was only around because someone duplicated it and uploaded to Pinterest. I did look at the EXIF data back when, but found nothing useful – taken with some standalone digital cameral.
But while Googling around to see if I could dig up the other two, I found this: http://www.2040cars.com/Pontiac/Bonneville/1965-pontiac-bonneville-limo-569791/
PA plates, advertised in IN, seller claims it’s a repaint with rust and a motor swap. And it doesn’t seem to match up with any of my ten above.
The seller has a website (http://www.indianapontiacs.com/Carsforsale.html) which indicates the car has been sold, for $3900 to someone in California.
The plot thickens!
Cool!!! Did you call the dealer? Looks like they have the scoop on pontiacs at large….
A look at the guy’s website places him in Muncie. I may have to go and check this place out.
This car on the Indiana Pontiacs web site made me jump.
When I worked for a supermarket in northwest Omaha during the 1980’s, a retired school teacher from nearby Bennington, NE drove a Chevy like this to the store where I worked a few times each month. Some kids from Bennington worked at the store and identified her as a bit legendary in Bennington for driving the car for some 30 years.
The website indicates the car went into storage in 1984, so it’s not out of the question that this is the same car.
The condition and patina look about right………
JP, if you happen to get to Muncie and find damage on the passenger side, post a picture. Some pretty fuzzy memories from 30 years ago. But, some sort of passenger side dent (rear door? rear fender?), augmented by maybe even a bit more damage (front fender?) from an accident during the era when I would see the car seem like part of what I recall.
hi its was a long time ago now but the owner of that car left it to be ground into small pieces the day before i was in contact with him and he didnt know what he owned and didnt get it sold hole or in parts so its sad to say its dead
As mentioned elsewhere, we had two new ’65 Bonnevilles at once when I was little – a slate-gray convertible with black top and interior, and an air-conditioned white Safari with blue interior – and I always enjoy seeing photos of these conversions.
Around 1981 I came across a maroon 1966 Bonneville limo of this type in Northeast Philadelphia, and took photos that I still have somewhere, but the car was probably hauled away for scrap long ago.
I’m kind of amazed that so many have actually survived considering the attrition rate for cars this old. These must be really special to have such a high percentage of survivors.
I’ve often thought the same thing.
I’d like to believe the story of there being only ten (give or take), since it came from a retired Superior employee – as reliable a source as one could expect for a model whose production numbers were never recorded.
But perhaps the old guy’s memory was slipping. You’d think that at least a few would have been destroyed over the years. The odds of all ten having not only survived, but being readily found on the Internet, seem incredibly low.
Cool that they are nearly all found, this and the Turkish taxi post tother day reminded me of a car a mate and I discovered many years ago, a Factory stretch 52 Chevrolet it was on a property in northland where my friend was negotiating to buy a Wolseley 6/80, he got the 6/80 but the Chev remains a mystery and Ive not seen another one, it had jump seats and a large opening door on the right hand side but it was RHD(converted) and only the front drivers/passenger door on the left, Does anyone recall seeing a similar car?
Check out the interior of that blue one in Texas. Looks like it was taken from a late-80s conversion van, especially the wood drink holders.
The original interiors (from what I remember of the ’66 I saw more than 30 years ago) weren’t all that great; the builders of these conversions would have done better to emulate the factory Bonneville upholstery and door panels, I think.
Once on a highway near New York City even longer ago, I saw a black 1964 Bonneville six-window sedan probably made by the same company.
Why the focus on 1965? Rarest ones? Just curious…
This link has pictures of one of them (too dark to tell for sure) with people in it.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.417654578250714.117050.195331190483055&type=3
Interesting how all three rows faced forward, rather than the middle one face backward. Seems a little tight.
Why ’65s? Coincidence, mostly. The white one got posted, which led to the Swedish one getting posted, which led to my old one getting posted, which led to my arrival here, which led to a more complete write-up on my former limo, which finally resulted in this post. Whew!
Facebook link: I know I’ve seen those before, somewhere. The license plates on that car match #8 above.
Our local undertaker had a 1965 Pontiac Hearse- I wonder now if it was a stretch like these, or would it have been long enough in standard form to take a coffin?
The ‘Gothic’ styling of this model always seemed very appropriate for funeral cars!
There’s another site dedicated to these and other unusual Pontiacs
http://www.pontiacsonline.com/index.htm
I’m amazed at how they extended the rear doors to smoothly integrate the swoopy body lines. Today’s hack shops would have to take a pass on a car like that.
I had dug up several sources of info back when – mailing list archives, various webpages, etc – but can no longer find my list. So I’m hunting them down, one by one. Pages I’ve found so far:
http://americanpontiacassociation.us/bonneville-limo-1965/ – someone has spotted four in Sweden; supposedly a guy there named Haakan Larsson once owned “several”; Vince Welling owns two and knows of five others in the States (sounds like a total of 11 – I previously counted ten, plus the Pennsylvania car found earlier today!)
http://americanpontiacassociation.us/members_pages/VINCE_WELLING/ – Mr. Welling tells the tale of how he acquired his limo, and later, his parts car. I remembered bits and pieces of the story, but had a hard time tracking it down. Contains oodles of pictures of his car, including before-and-afters, and what might be a Superior promotional picture I’ve never seen before.
VERY interesting website I just found:
http://www.pontiacsonline.com/Pontiac%20Professional%20Cars.htm
Tells about Pontiacs being used as professional cars. With lots of pictures.
Including the ’63 Bonneville Ambulance used to transport JFK’s body to Bethesda the day he was assassinated.
There was one of these Poncho limos in Shenandoah, Pennsylvania in daily use up until the early/mid 90’s at a small funeral home (Chaikowsky F.H.). Used to see it all the time until I went into the military in 94. My memory is fuzzy but I wonder if the pictured car w/PA tags is it. Rumor had it they also had a same year Poncho hearse but I never seen that one. It was in pretty good shape when I last seen it, so if it lasted that long, it could very well still exist.
the black poncho with the red pinstripe and PA plates is from shenandoah PA ..owned by the chaikowsky’s funeral home for many years,,,i cant remember what side of the car had body work , but i do believe either one of the rear doors and/or rear quarter panel had body work done to it and was not done very well and left the body wavy ..i worked on this car back in the late 80’s / early 90’s and replaced the driver side tie rod end and if memory serves me correctly the car had light blue or light gray interior and was powered by a 389 .
i remember seeing this car around town for many years as a young lad , and years later i did some work on this car,,,the owner had a garage behind the funeral home were the car would be parked and one time i was in this garage for reasons i cant remember , but the second floor of the garage was filled with antique toys ..i often wondered what happened to this car…glad to see it is still around ..hope this shed some light on the black poncho
Thanks Keith. I can’t tell you you how much I value the 65 full size Pontiac. Seeing a compendium like this is a great way to start the weekend. cheers
Has anyone seen, commented on this post on the Albuquerque Craigslist?
http://albuquerque.craigslist.org/cto/4286457027.html
Just saw your comment, and the ad, for the first time. I was not aware of that one’s existence. Guess we’re well on our way to breaking the myth of ‘only ten built’, eh?
This would make sense…Prewitt is a little town between Gallup and Grants and I remember there was a dude out there on old route 66 who had a bunch of old Ponchos among other things….you had to have a sharp eye like me…..but I remember he had a red 69 GTO and a 56 safari and this was like in 2011…..
hi i wonder if the missing no-cal car was on the ebay for sale in parts a few year ago o it was a wrek and i contact the man was looking for som interior part for my car and i emaild him and he responst that he eas geting tired of the ca an d didnt know what to do whith it så the days befor he gets ma email ha had broutgh the car to the scrap yard and they turnd it in to small bits and sent it to be melt down..i told the him what car it was and the history about it and the guy whent crying its tru he had no info of the car and he was afraid to try to restore it when he didnt find any part for the car
Keith, Believe it or not we’ve got one of these 1965 Pontiac Limousines here in Wyoming. Our Dad bought it for our Mom as a gift for their 15th wedding anniversary in 1976. It was last licensed in 1979, and has been in the family ever since. We are pleasantly surprised that the car is such a one of a kind ! My brother and I were so embarrassed when our mom used to pick us up from basketball practice in the “Limo”. It was a great car to deliver newspapers with though on Sundays, Thanks Keith and everyone for the information. Jose
Maybe we / I / use / everyone should try and find the 1966 Pontiac Superior Limos also? I would love to get more information, and contacts that may add to the story of the 1966 as well.
Well, I’ll try to find my early-1980s photos of the one I spotted in northeast Phila. (see above).
Hi there we have maybe the missing piece of the puzzle. Recently aquired from a barn find. attaching picture. Excellent condition and all original. last 4 digit of vin are 7237.
We’ve got one in Wyoming. Our Dad bought if for our mother for their 15th wedding anniversary in 1976. It’s in original unrestored condition. Thanks to everyone for their posts about these vehicles.
Vince Welling passed away in 2021, and I acquired both his Limos from the estate. I am a Pontiac GTO nut, but there is just something about these cars that drew me in. I have found much of the same information as Keith by coming the Web.
As far as the blue car, I found the following articles, which document the construction of this car from the black one shown above as #2.
Another article on #1
And an article that appeared in High Performance Pontiac in 2005.
Along with pictures
Another
One more
As far as the real #2, the parts Limo, it is white, but it is not #4 above. It has no engine or transmission, and the interior is filled with the original seats from both cars. The hood currently on this car I believe to be the original hood from #1, as it is black. It also has the middle cut out, which was grafted onto the original #2 hood to construct a “cowl induction” for clearance of the supercharger.
Another of #2
I have one as well I stay in Oklahoma City. My name is James Madden I’m a car collector and my YouTube is LeonNCars